U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Happy Easter!
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 1.5 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Jump to a detailed profile or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Business Search - 14 Million verified businesses
Search for:  near: 
Reply Start New Thread
 
Unread 08-11-2009, 02:30 AM
 
13 posts, read 15,905 times
Reputation: 15
Default Gay People vs Divorce People and the Bible

I know that this may spark debate, however I do hope that it is civil.

There is a lot of debate as to whether being gay is right or wrong which, recently, has been tied to whether or not gay people should be able to get married.

Should divorced people be able to get married? According to the Bible, if you are a divorced woman and sleep with another man, you are committing adultery. Also, if you are a man who sleeps with a woman who has previously been married, you are committing adultery.

For a divorced woman, there is no way to prevent becoming an adulteress besides remaining celibate for the rest of her life so long as her first husband still lives.

So, I guess my questions are, should non-virgins be able to get married? Should divorced women be able to get married? Should gay people be able to get married?

And some versus:

It was also said, ‘Whoever divorces his wife, let him give her a certificate of divorce.’ But I say to you that everyone who divorces his wife, except on the ground of sexual immorality, makes her commit adultery, and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.
Matthew 5:31-32

And Pharisees came up to him and tested him by asking, “Is it lawful to divorce one's wife for any cause?” He answered, “Have you not read that he who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.” They said to him, “Why then did Moses command one to give a certificate of divorce and to send her away?” He said to them, “Because of your hardness of heart Moses allowed you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so. And I say to you: whoever divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another, commits adultery.”

Matthew 19:3-9

Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries a woman divorced from her husband commits adultery.
Luke 16:18
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Unread 08-11-2009, 02:50 AM
 
Location: Indianapolis
4,325 posts, read 2,975,596 times
Reputation: 637
Quote:
Originally Posted by jnpull2 View Post
I know that this may spark debate, however I do hope that it is civil.

There is a lot of debate as to whether being gay is right or wrong which, recently, has been tied to whether or not gay people should be able to get married.

Should divorced people be able to get married? According to the Bible, if you are a divorced woman and sleep with another man, you are committing adultery. Also, if you are a man who sleeps with a woman who has previously been married, you are committing adultery.

For a divorced woman, there is no way to prevent becoming an adulteress besides remaining celibate for the rest of her life so long as her first husband still lives.

So, I guess my questions are, should non-virgins be able to get married? Should divorced women be able to get married? Should gay people be able to get married?

And some versus:

It was also said, ‘Whoever divorces his wife, let him give her a certificate of divorce.’ But I say to you that everyone who divorces his wife, except on the ground of sexual immorality, makes her commit adultery, and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery. Matthew 5:31-32

And Pharisees came up to him and tested him by asking, “Is it lawful to divorce one's wife for any cause?” He answered, “Have you not read that he who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.” They said to him, “Why then did Moses command one to give a certificate of divorce and to send her away?” He said to them, “Because of your hardness of heart Moses allowed you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so. And I say to you: whoever divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another, commits adultery.”

Matthew 19:3-9

Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries a woman divorced from her husband commits adultery. Luke 16:18
Anything that is done with love is right with God. The only reason divorce is so hard is because the parties fell out of love. It doesn't matter to God if you're gay, straight, a virgin, divorced or married. What matters to God is Love.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 08-11-2009, 03:31 AM
 
Location: Houston
1,427 posts, read 1,865,729 times
Reputation: 1303
Quote:
Originally Posted by jnpull2 View Post
I know that this may spark debate, however I do hope that it is civil.

There is a lot of debate as to whether being gay is right or wrong which, recently, has been tied to whether or not gay people should be able to get married.

Should divorced people be able to get married? According to the Bible, if you are a divorced woman and sleep with another man, you are committing adultery. Also, if you are a man who sleeps with a woman who has previously been married, you are committing adultery.

For a divorced woman, there is no way to prevent becoming an adulteress besides remaining celibate for the rest of her life so long as her first husband still lives.

So, I guess my questions are, should non-virgins be able to get married? Should divorced women be able to get married? Should gay people be able to get married?

And some versus:

It was also said, ‘Whoever divorces his wife, let him give her a certificate of divorce.’ But I say to you that everyone who divorces his wife, except on the ground of sexual immorality, makes her commit adultery, and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.
Matthew 5:31-32

And Pharisees came up to him and tested him by asking, “Is it lawful to divorce one's wife for any cause?” He answered, “Have you not read that he who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.” They said to him, “Why then did Moses command one to give a certificate of divorce and to send her away?” He said to them, “Because of your hardness of heart Moses allowed you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so. And I say to you: whoever divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another, commits adultery.”

Matthew 19:3-9

Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries a woman divorced from her husband commits adultery.
Luke 16:18
Honestly, with all the problems in the world, I think people's time would be far better spent supporting one another. I absolutely think people who pay the same taxes and are governed under the same laws deserve equal rights and protection...I think its absurd that in this day and age people are having to fight for their right to marry. Its not as if heterosexuals haven't made an absolute mockery of the insitution of marriage (with divorce rates being what they are) already.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 08-11-2009, 04:51 AM
 
3 posts, read 3,384 times
Reputation: 11
There are so many people that got divorced and re-married, (even pastors), and they still claim God's blessings on their lives, saying that the blood of Jesus restores all sinfulness....my question is just, there are so many grounds for divorce, like abuse (in any form), the Bible only speaks of sexual immorality. I cannot for once believe that God would expect a woman/man to stay in a marraige that is filled with abuse for example. Maybe one should consider the times in which these scriptures were written and the social rules and settings at that time back...people were not that enlighted, woman were treated as the 'lower' race, so things have evolved alot since then. There seems to be a lot of gray areas, but I believe it is a heart issue. I do not believe you are doomed to hell, if you remarry after a divorce if it was not due to sexual immorality. Surely God sees your circumstances and forgives all sin.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 08-11-2009, 08:58 AM
 
Location: 30-40°N 90-100°W
13,859 posts, read 11,868,661 times
Reputation: 6417
I find some problem with that, but as long as you don't remarry you can separate or divorce from an abusive spouse. (I'm speaking religiously)

On a civil basis the US has always allowed divorce and remarriage regardless of whether either party committed adultery. (Although in the past you did need some fault like abandonment, abuse, insanity, or what have you) It would be unwise, imprudent, and impossible to change that.

The argument on SSM, so far as I understand it, is that the notion of same-sex couples being married is a relatively modern development. It has no basis in Anglo-US tradition, which is the tradition our country is based. I think it's debatable that a same-gender union was ever deemed a marriage in any society. The examples I know of a male would be deemed "spiritually a woman" and marry a Man. (Or a female be deemed "Spiritually a Man" and marry a woman or a person be deemed as some third gender. Basically it was more like Trasvestism-Marriage.) Other examples I know of in certain cultures is young men engaging in "temporary marriages" before "graduating" to heterosexual marriages. This was usually in societies that were so intensely homosocial that men had to be almost "phased into" living with women.

Two men as husbands or two women as wives is not something I think existed, even as a concept, until the nineteenth century. When the subject was broached in the 1950s gay magazine "One" most homosexuals in the letters forum rejected the idea. They felt homosexuality meant you were "different" and that marriage was too normalizing. Even in the 1980s there were strong pockets of resistance to the idea among gays.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 08-11-2009, 01:52 PM
 
25,171 posts, read 31,073,948 times
Reputation: 6643
This is good. Everyone who divorces is committing adultery. There you go. How many people walk around in shame saying "Omg I got a divorce. Jesus Christ is angry with me. I'm burning in hell for this". Nobody. How many times do you hear gays walking around with a burden of shame on their shoulders saying to themselves "Omg I'm gay. I made Jesus upset. I'm burning in hell". Yep. I rest my case.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 08-11-2009, 01:59 PM
 
4,669 posts, read 1,282,319 times
Reputation: 409
Sex of any kind outside of marriage is wrong. Gay or straight.

As for the question of who should be allowed to marry? The Bible doesn't say anything about a chastity test...and none of us would want the government to get involved in that anyway. But the example of marriage in the Bible that we're given is 1 man, 1 woman. Eventually, men took more wives...but it wasn't the original model.

As for divorce/remarriage? I wouldn't have a problem with the idea of making it harder to remarry. We all know those people that have been married 3-4 times or more and still don't quite know how to have a happy marriage.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 08-11-2009, 02:47 PM
 
Location: OKC
5,330 posts, read 2,921,164 times
Reputation: 1663
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas R. View Post
I find some problem with that, but as long as you don't remarry you can separate or divorce from an abusive spouse. (I'm speaking religiously)

On a civil basis the US has always allowed divorce and remarriage regardless of whether either party committed adultery. (Although in the past you did need some fault like abandonment, abuse, insanity, or what have you) It would be unwise, imprudent, and impossible to change that.

The argument on SSM, so far as I understand it, is that the notion of same-sex couples being married is a relatively modern development. It has no basis in Anglo-US tradition, which is the tradition our country is based. I think it's debatable that a same-gender union was ever deemed a marriage in any society. The examples I know of a male would be deemed "spiritually a woman" and marry a Man. (Or a female be deemed "Spiritually a Man" and marry a woman or a person be deemed as some third gender. Basically it was more like Trasvestism-Marriage.) Other examples I know of in certain cultures is young men engaging in "temporary marriages" before "graduating" to heterosexual marriages. This was usually in societies that were so intensely homosocial that men had to be almost "phased into" living with women.

Two men as husbands or two women as wives is not something I think existed, even as a concept, until the nineteenth century. When the subject was broached in the 1950s gay magazine "One" most homosexuals in the letters forum rejected the idea. They felt homosexuality meant you were "different" and that marriage was too normalizing. Even in the 1980s there were strong pockets of resistance to the idea among gays.
The idea that women were equal to men is relatively new, too. Yet the new-ness of an idea doesn't really prevent it from being adopted. It certainly doesn't make it wrong.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 08-11-2009, 02:50 PM
 
Location: OKC
5,330 posts, read 2,921,164 times
Reputation: 1663
I think what this thread will find is that most Christians will want to keep their double standard.

They will want the country to enforce the biblical laws of marriages as they pertain to gay people, but they are willing to be much more flexible when it comes to straight people.

They want the Government to enforce the laws of the bible against people they don't happen to like, but not enforce the laws of the bible against people like themselves.

Its pretty much that simple.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 08-11-2009, 03:52 PM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
9,924 posts, read 5,897,996 times
Reputation: 6423
Sounds like the old saying of, Do I say do, don't do as I do.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $74,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:20 AM.

© 2005-2014, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25 - Top