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...Which certainly qualifies you for the Understatement of the Year Award.
YSM seems not to know (or deliberately skirts the fact) that her vaunted quotation from Isaiah 18 is very, very off base. Isaiah was, to phrase it in a Biblical way, waxing poetic. That writing was definitely not meant to be taken literally. Isaiah would be ashamed of you!
Originally Posted by Mercury Cougar View Post
Oh, really? I'll bet I've read the bible from cover to cover more times than you have. OMG how can that be, since I'm an atheist?
I doubt that you have, really.
I live in it, love it, and have been reading it regularly and sometimes straight through, a book at a time, for all my 40 years as a born again in Christ Believer.
But you also include books that few people have heard of that you apparently think actually belong in the Bible which is very unusual for a Christian.
As far as your threads about Mormons are concerned I'm getting the impression that your dislike of this religion may be based on your personal experiences with family members that you mentioned on a few posts.
The one statement you made about the castration of a young man in the 1800's would be very disturbing if it really happened and was covered up by church officials. However, Mormons in the twentyfirst century are very different from their ancestors and tend to promote a strong family who are supportive of each other. Obviously as an atheist I don't believe in the claims of the Mormon religion or those of any other religion. It's just that I know some very decent and sincere Mormons and I dislike seeing them attacked. A look at the history of Christians a few hundred years ago would also reveal some horrible atrocities but that doesn't change the fact that there are many Christians living today who would be sickened by such behavior. I think you need to put things into perspective.
So what does the Hebrew say, and what did the Greek Septuagint translation of it say, and what did the Douay-Rheims English translation say, in relation to where God has set His created tabernacle in His created heaven?
"He hath set His tabernacle in the sun".
And Jesus will return, "shining like the sun", as the Sun of Righteousness. whose Glory "outshining" in Jerusalem will outshine the sun and moon for the entire Millennial reign, as the source of Light for Jerusalem, as a type of the eternal City of God which will come down from God out of heaven and be over the earth, shining in glory, forever.
Mal 4:2 But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness [Jesus] arise with healing in his wings [The Shekinah Glory, as rays extending out from the Sun of Righteousness]...
John sees Jesus; Rev 1:16 And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance [was] as the sun shineth in his strength.
He is the Light and the Glory which will light the City of God forever; Rev 21:23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God didthe Lamb [is] the light thereof. lighten it, and
He dwells in the light which no man can approach; 1Ti 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto;
Hab 3:3 ¶ God came from Teman, and the Holy One from mount Paran. Selah. His glory covered the heavens, and the earth was full of his praise. Hab 3:4And [his] brightness was as the light; he had קרן [coming] out of his hand: and there [was] the hiding of his power.
קרן ) to shine a) (Qal) to send out rays
קרן
like flashes of lightning
When Jesus returns, He will be the Light of Israel, and His Glory will shine out from Jerusalem with no need for the sun and moon, there, for they will be outshone and invisible in Jerusalem, for the brightness of the Glory of the Sun of Righteousness, Jesus Christ, returned.
Isaiah 60
A Glorified Zion
1"(A)Arise, shine; for your (B)light has come,
And the (C)glory of the LORD has risen upon you.
2"For behold, (D)darkness will cover the earth
And deep darkness the peoples;
But the LORD will rise upon you
And His (E)glory will appear upon you.
3"(F)Nations will come to your light,
And kings to the brightness of your rising.
The sun set in the heavens is only a type of the Son of God, who Himself is the only Similitude of YHWH and who alone has the Glory. The sun was set in the heavens on the fourth day of creation as a type and sign of the Son of God coming into New Man creation flesh on the fourth Millennial Day of creation, as the Light of YHWH to the nations.
Jesus is the Light of Israel; who is the Sun of Righteousness; who is coming back, shining like the sun; and who is the Light of the nations. Luk 2:32 A light to lighten the Gentiles, and the glory of thy people Israel
The sun is only a sign of the Great Light for all men, Jesus Christ, who is Christ, come in flesh -revealed to men- in the fourth [millennial] day of creation. That is what the Word of God teaches us about the sun, as a type, of the True temple/tabernacle/dwelling place of YHWH'S Great Glory, which is the body of flesh of the Firstborn of the New Creation Man.
Rev 21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God [is] with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, [and be] their God.
Rev 21:23And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb [is] the Light thereof.
That is Bible doctrine, on the Person of God the Word come in flesh as the True "Sun of Righteousness", which the created sun, as a temple for the Glory to indwell, only types, so as to teach us by.
...
The one statement you made about the castration of a young man in the 1800's would be very disturbing if it really happened and was covered up by church officials.
They did not cover it up. That is the point, You can go read these things in the records I linked to, and in other records, of the Mormon Church, itself -well, you used to be able to, but they do hide a lot now; but nevertheless, before they hid them, they got micro-fished by Mormons and ex-Mormons, who reproduced them exactly as copies of the old records.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontanaGuy
However, Mormons in the twentyfirst century are very different from their ancestors and tend to promote a strong family who are supportive of each other. Obviously as an atheist I don't believe in the claims of the Mormon religion or those of any other religion. It's just that I know some very decent and sincere Mormons and I dislike seeing them attacked.
I am not attacking individual "Mormons", but the doctrine of Mormonism, at its foundations. So what that there are "nice Mormons"? Are there no nice non-Mormons, in your mind!!!
What has that to do with the doctrines of Mormonism as a false religion, anyway, teaching lies about what the Word of God states and making up things that are not in the word of God and which the Word of God refutes? Are you trying to make Mormons "victims"?, when the Mormon religion itself attacks Bible Believing Christians and claims they are of the devil, in their doctrines?
And as to how people claiming to be Christians have acted in the past or may act in the future, which is not in the Word of God, I am in agreement with you. But this thread is not about how "nice people, judged by you to be 'nice people', may go to heaven after all", in spite of teaching blasphemies about the Person and work of Christ, the Living Spirit from heaven, who is Himself YHWH/LORD ELOHYM/God, come in human being flesh of second Man creation.
Whoever denies the Christ [the LORD from heaven] come in flesh is anti-christ, says John; and Mormonism is only one of the many false religions which have highjacked the name of Jesus and invented another "gospel" and another "christ".
Now this thread is about where God dwells, in His Glory, in this creation in His temple, at, which the Word says is "set in the sun", and yet Mormonism says their god of flesh and bone who was a man and who is not an everlasting god who existed forever, but who was made a god out of a man, dwells on a planet invented by Joe Smith, and named "Kolob", with his wife or wives; and with all the billions -to some great power- of spirit children, whom his wife or wives have as babies, and then send to earth, to be born as babies of another, second, sexual union of flesh and bone men.
As I stated earlier, the Mormon god is left out in the dark; but the God of the Word is in the Light, and is Light, and His throne is in the tabernacle set in the sun, which He created.
When Jesus returns, He will be the Light of Israel, and His Glory will shine out from Jerusalem with no need for the sun and moon, there, for they will be outshone and invisible in Jerusalem, for the brightness of the Glory of the Sun of Righteousness, Jesus Christ, returned.
<greatly snipped>
That is Bible doctrine, on the Person of God the Word come in flesh as the True "Sun of Righteousness", which the created sun, as a temple for the Glory to indwell, only types, so as to teach us by.
From now on I'm just going to post TLDNR to your posts that are merely cut and paste longwinded blathering. We'll start with this post above:
When Jesus returns, He will be the Light of Israel, and His Glory will shine out from Jerusalem with no need for the sun and moon, there, for they will be outshone and invisible in Jerusalem, for the brightness of the Glory of the Sun of Righteousness, Jesus Christ, returned.
Oy vey! And you have a link to confirm this, I suppose.
YSM,, you really need to put your bibles,and extra-biblical writings down for a minute and pick up a dictionary.You deny you even follow a 'religion'.You fail to grasp that the bible is full of allegory and symbolism.Much of it clearly isn't intended to be taken literally.The point the writers are trying to illustrate may be true but you are the only person i've ever heard of who believes it all should be taken literally.It obviously wasn't written to be taken that way.
You have a completely convoluted understanding of lds beliefs and I doubt that posting threads of this type is going to achieve anything positive in promoting your own beliefs.I have stated on other threads and will reiterate an observation of mine here,'When your mormon bashing thread is so over the top that you actually get multiple atheists and non-mormons defending the mormons its time to find a new strategy.'But feel free to continue if you want.....I find your threads quite entertaining and am disapointed every time they get closed.
YSM seems not to know (or deliberately skirts the fact) that her vaunted quotation from Isaiah 18 is very, very off base. Isaiah was, to phrase it in a Biblical way, waxing poetic. That writing was definitely not meant to be taken literally. Isaiah would be ashamed of you!
YHWH inspired Isaiah to write His own words, and those words in Hebrew state exactly what YHWH was going to do; retire, look down/scan intently, from His abode/dwelling place, the dazzling hot sun.
I gave the Hebrew words which show that, indeed, Isaiah 18:4 is God's own word about what He would do and where He would do it from.
If I was off base, then there would be no corroboration of the passage, but I have showed much corroboration of the same statement of fact that "He hath set His tabernacle in the sun" -or "in the sun hath He set His tabernacle", as the Greek Septuagint translates from Hebrew to say, and as the Douay-Rheims also translates it to English to say.
Then, there are the Jews who left the DSS collection in Qumran, and in their hymns, they say the same, that His residence/abode is set in the sun.
on a copy of The DSS Translation, published in 1994, translated by Wilfred G.E. Watson, I found this in the hymns on page 355, but there are also others,
Col XX (=XII + frags. 54 + 60)
line 4 [For the Instruc]tor, praises and prayers to bow down and entreat always,
from period to period:
when the light comes from His residence;
in the positions of the day, according to the regulation,
in accordance to the laws of the great luminary; at the return of the evening, at the departure of light,
when the realm of the shades begins; at the appointed moment of the night, in their stations;
at the return of dawn, at the moment when it withdraws to its quarters before the light; at the departure of night when day enters; continually.
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