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Old 10-25-2009, 06:17 PM
zdg
 
Location: Sonoma County
845 posts, read 1,969,430 times
Reputation: 1144

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I hate to say it, and this will sound like a personal attack (I assure you, it is not, it is an observation), you are not equipped to deal with a debate like this. I'm not talking about having the evidence on your side, I'm saying I don't think we're playing the same game here.
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Old 10-25-2009, 06:20 PM
 
218 posts, read 310,862 times
Reputation: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by zdg View Post
I hate to say it, and this will sound like a personal attack (I assure you, it is not, it is an observation), you are not equipped to deal with a debate like this. I'm not talking about having the evidence on your side, I'm saying I don't think we're playing the same game here.
Is that so how am I not equipped?

Why don't you respond to what I said in my last post. I think it makes total logical sense.

Last edited by Lightinsky; 10-25-2009 at 06:28 PM..
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Old 10-25-2009, 06:36 PM
 
4,367 posts, read 3,477,908 times
Reputation: 1431
Quote:
Many of you claim you don't believe in sin or evil well that's fine with me but you can't say you don't believe in right or wrong or that doesn't exist.
What does right and wrong have to do with your religion? Other religions, Hinduism, Taoism, Buddhism also teach "right and wrong". Further, one does not need yours or any religion to explain to ethics and morality; evolutionary biology and sociology can do just fine without belief in gods, virgin births, talking animals, flooded earths, ancient people flying into the sky, etc.

Quote:
Go out and break the law man has set in place in society and see where that lands you right in jail.
Or not. A lawyer can get you off, a judge can dismiss the case, charges can be dropped, or one can pay a fine. If you want to compare your "loving" god's "justice" to human justice, you will have to ditch the hell theory, because even the worst of human judicial punishment falls infinitely short of Christianity's and Islams doctrines of eternal suffering.

Quote:
So if man has moral standards for society although people will still not obey that doesn't change the fact they exist and are real. God in the same manner has a moral compass for mankind to obey and follow which is in the Ten Commandments.
No one is disputing that society has moral standards. We do though dispute the veracity of your religion. Also, the Ten Commandments are not a perfect moral guide, far from it. How many Christians go to church on the Sabbath (Saturday)? Is it right to honor your father and mother if they were abusive?

Quote:
You can't tell me that hitler was a morally sound person without faults and wrong doing that is obvious so how can you say sin doesn't exist and evil doesn't exist. Makes no sense. Think about it.
You can't tell me that burning Hitler's Jewish victims in hell forever is moral. Think about it.
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Old 10-25-2009, 06:39 PM
 
218 posts, read 310,862 times
Reputation: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by nightflight View Post
What does right and wrong have to do with your religion? Other religions, Hinduism, Taoism, Buddhism also teach "right and wrong". Further, one does not need yours or any religion to explain to ethics and morality; evolutionary biology and sociology can do just fine without belief in gods, virgin births, talking animals, flooded earths, ancient people flying into the sky, etc.



Or not. A lawyer can get you off, a judge can dismiss the case, charges can be dropped, or one can pay a fine. If you want to compare your "loving" god's "justice" to human justice, you will have to ditch the hell theory, because even the worst of human judicial punishment falls infinitely short of Christianity's and Islams doctrines of eternal suffering.



No one is disputing that society has moral standards. We do though dispute the veracity of your religion. Also, the Ten Commandments are not a perfect moral guide, far from it. How many Christians go to church on the Sabbath (Saturday)? Is it right to honor your father and mother if they were abusive?



You can't tell me that burning Hitler's Jewish victims in hell forever is moral. Think about it.
Last statement makes sense we will have to just trust God to avenge their death in righteousness and hopefully grant them life with Him. He is a just and loving God and I'm sure He will punish the murderers who killed the innocent.
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Old 10-25-2009, 06:51 PM
zdg
 
Location: Sonoma County
845 posts, read 1,969,430 times
Reputation: 1144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightinsky View Post
Is that so how am I not equipped?

Why don't you respond to what I said in my last post. I think it makes total logical sense.
Exactly. That you really think that what you said is based within the rules of logic says to me we're not playing the same game here.

You honestly believe that assumptions are the same as evidence.
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Old 10-25-2009, 06:54 PM
zdg
 
Location: Sonoma County
845 posts, read 1,969,430 times
Reputation: 1144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightinsky View Post
Last statement makes sense we will have to just trust God to avenge their death in righteousness and hopefully grant them life with Him. He is a just and loving God and I'm sure He will punish the murderers who killed the innocent.
Whoa there, ladyfriend. Are you actually trying to tell me that we should not try to deter known violent criminals because your phantom might take care of that after they die naturally?

You scare me. Seriously.
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Old 10-25-2009, 07:23 PM
 
218 posts, read 310,862 times
Reputation: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by zdg View Post
Whoa there, ladyfriend. Are you actually trying to tell me that we should not try to deter known violent criminals because your phantom might take care of that after they die naturally?

You scare me. Seriously.
I scare you lol. You can't be serious my ladyfriend. I told you before I am a man get it straight oh wait you may not be straight I don't want to offend lovers of themselves.
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Old 10-25-2009, 07:30 PM
zdg
 
Location: Sonoma County
845 posts, read 1,969,430 times
Reputation: 1144
Aaaaaaaaaaaand....we're done.
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Old 10-25-2009, 08:35 PM
 
Location: Kentucky
1,088 posts, read 2,192,975 times
Reputation: 613
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightinsky View Post
None of you on these forums are worthless trash you are God's creation and all He asks of you is to acknowledge Him for creating you. I guess that is not possble because either I am doing a lousy job of conveying the truth so God forgive or you could care less about what God says truth is. I know you've asked me how do I know I chosen the right god and the short answer is Jesus Christ. I know from years of research and countless hours of study and yes even looking into science to some degree that all religions fail in their effort to provide their followers with assurance of life after death but Christ said none are righteouss and all have sinned falling short of the glory of God as has offered Himself as the final sacrifice for Jews and Non Jews (Gentiles). When you believe in Christ and the god of the Bible you align yourself with perfection given from Christ Himself since we can't be perfect and without sin.
You're using the supposed existence of characters from your religion of choice as proof that your religion of choice is the right one. That's circular logic and in the end, a useless argument. I can argue that vampires are real because I've read about them in books that said they existed, but that doesn't actually mean vampires exist.

Quote:
Many of you claim you don't believe in sin or evil well that's fine with me but you can't say you don't believe in right or wrong or that doesn't exist. Go out and break the law man has set in place in society and see where that lands you right in jail. So if man has moral standards for society although people will still not obey that doesn't change the fact they exist and are real. God in the same manner has a moral compass for mankind to obey and follow which is in the Ten Commandments. You all know what they are.
Religion, particularly Christianity, does not hold the market on morality. All things considered, Christianity is a relatively new religion on the deity of choice scene. Especially in the sense of the evangelicals we see in America today. But standards of living within society and the morals that exist within communities are much older than religions.

And the "morals" so often promoted by the Bible are questionable in the first place. Stoning women who are not virgins, forcing women to marry their rapists, God sanctioned mass murders of infants and women with child, condoning of slavery, an eye for an eye, etc. It's rather barbaric.

Quote:
You can't tell me that hitler was a morally sound person without faults and wrong doing that is obvious so how can you say sin doesn't exist and evil doesn't exist. Makes no sense. Think about it.
Hitler was a Christian who believed he was doing God's work. Evil exists, sure, but sin is a religious based concept and I can, in fact, say there's no such thing as sin. Hell, most Christian groups can't even come to a comprehensive agreement on what acts constitute as sin.
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Old 10-25-2009, 09:05 PM
 
1,628 posts, read 4,032,321 times
Reputation: 541
Lightinsky still has not answered direct questions, just keeps using circular logic.

What a perfect example of the 'enlightened'.
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