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Old 09-01-2019, 10:26 AM
 
4,529 posts, read 1,715,122 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
Can you explain the difference between Spirit and flesh? That might give you a clue.
Doesnt the answer the question, but since you seem to know what’s a spiritual son.
Were Moses and Abraham, spiritual sons of God?
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Old 09-01-2019, 12:32 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
16,660 posts, read 7,834,283 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCardinals View Post
Doesnt the answer the question, but since you seem to know what’s a spiritual son.
Were Moses and Abraham, spiritual sons of God?
According to Torah they followed God and would be accounted children of God in Spirit.
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Old 09-01-2019, 04:33 PM
 
4,529 posts, read 1,715,122 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
According to Torah they followed God and would be accounted children of God in Spirit.
So Jacob and Jesus are spiritual sons of God because “Bible says so”.
Abraham and Moses are also sons of God because according to Torah, “they followed God”.

So to establish the spiritual sonship with God, we have used two different criteria (as double quoted above).

This puts Jacob, Jesus, Moses and Abraham in the same breadth.

Is one higher than the other or they are all 4 equal?
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Old 09-01-2019, 04:34 PM
 
40,426 posts, read 11,389,133 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
According to Torah they followed God and would be accounted children of God in Spirit.
So anyone who follows God (this would include Muslims and even Hindus, i suppose) is a spiritual son of God? N.B the Way (dogma-doctrine) it's done isn't the issue as Paul points out - Abraham was 'Righteous' even before the rules of the Torah were handed down. Though of course that didn't stop Noah making sure he had a supply of 'clean' beasts so as to make a proper Jewish sacrifice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCardinals View Post
So Jacob and Jesus are spiritual sons of God because “Bible says so”.
Abraham and Moses are also sons of God because according to Torah, “they followed God”.

So to establish the spiritual sonship with God, we have used two different criteria (as double quoted above).

This puts Jacob, Jesus, Moses and Abraham in the same breadth.

Is one higher than the other or they are all 4 equal?
Well done (*Spoiler alert*) "What makes Jesus special?"

"Well, he taught...the others followed"

"So Jesus (Pub and swat etc.) is a son in the Spirit as much as anyone else, but he Taught..(read 'was a prophet') but nothing more than that?"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tired of the Nonsense View Post
Did God... um... invade the wombs of the mothers of Abraham and Moses?

Inquiring minds want to know!
Reminded me of a line in the dam -busters when an air force official asks Barnes Wallis why he thinks he should be entitled to have a Lancaster bomber put at his disposal:

"Well, if you told them that i designed it, do you think that might help?"

Last edited by mensaguy; 09-02-2019 at 03:48 PM.. Reason: fixed quote
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Old 09-02-2019, 03:31 PM
 
6,590 posts, read 1,828,634 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TRANSPONDER View Post
"Out of the mouths..." Haven't i presented you with what's actually in the Bible and what it tell us, and you stuck your fingers in your ears and ignored it?
No. You haven't. You've given your opinion that was shown to be false.
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Old 09-04-2019, 01:32 AM
 
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You are fooling nobody. I gave the reasons in the text why it was wrong and couldn't have worked so Jesus wouldn't even have tried it on. You ignored everything and stuck to Your 'opinion'.
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Old 09-06-2019, 02:32 PM
 
5,001 posts, read 1,289,672 times
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I talk to Jesus like I talk to a family member..( I actually for ages have called him "My big brother" )...and I pray to the Father and I do that "in Jesus name" , thus by his authority I ask for what I seek from the Father's throne, his gifts and or knowledge of his direction and his will to be released to me.

from these groups of scripture with directions for how to pray..

Effective Prayer

Mat 7:7


“Keep on asking, and you will receive what you ask for. Keep on seeking, and you will find. Keep on knocking, and the door will be opened to you.

Mat 7:8

For everyone who asks, receives. Everyone who seeks, finds. And to everyone who knocks, the door will be opened.

Mat 7:9


“You parents—if your children ask for a loaf of bread, do you give them a stone instead?

Mat 7:10

Or if they ask for a fish, do you give them a snake? Of course not!

Mat 7:11

So if you sinful people know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your heavenly Father give good gifts to those who ask him.


and

12Truly, truly, I tell you, whoever believes in Me will also do the works that I am doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13And I will do whatever you ask in My name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14If you ask Me anything in My name, I will do it.…

but it is also by his authority on earth that we can appraoch the Father .. he tells us how to pray to the father..Luk 11:1


And it came to pass, that, as he was praying in a certain place, when he ceased, one of his disciples said unto him, Lord, teach us to pray, as John also taught his disciples.

Luk 11:2


And he said unto them, When ye pray, say, Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done, as in heaven, so in earth."
Luk 11:3

Give us day by day our daily bread.

Luk 11:4

And forgive us our sins; for we also forgive every one that is indebted to us. And lead us not into temptation; but deliver us from evil.
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Old 09-06-2019, 10:10 PM
 
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If you want to prove that prayer works, you can convert me to Christianity my Monday.
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Old 09-06-2019, 10:30 PM
 
Location: Booth Texas
15,553 posts, read 5,201,448 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TRANSPONDER View Post
If you want to prove that prayer works, you can convert me to Christianity my Monday.
I think we should experiment, I mean, after all, you and I both know that the New Testament states that the person indwelled can ask whatever they please and recieve, and there is no doubt or exception, there is only the request and the fulfiment. There was no doubt involved when those disciples healed the blind, raised the dead, healed the deaf and the lame.

There was no maybe it will work and maybe it wont work. it worked, and if it would not have worked, their fame would never have been.

Faith was needed before the spirit fell on Pentecost and even Jesus couldn't heal in his own town of unbelievers, but this was no longer the case after Pentecost.

Faith was no longer an issue, it was sight.

So yeah, your challenge if you have one, or your request, either should be granted by a spirit filled believer or something is amiss.


ONLY THING IS, THOSE MIRACLES HAPPENED IN PERSON AND WITH THE LAYING ON OF THE HANDS.

But I am certain people are in pain , amd everywhere you look, a child dying of this and of that.

Woe is us and woe is Jerusalem for there is no prophet at all, are we Gods that someboy thinks we can do the impossible?

Let all the prophets be gathered, and let there be a request made, and let all the prophets pray and prophesy.

Is there even one brave enough to say,'' Don't let it be said that there is no prophet on Israel.''

Of course the problem is, is that all the many prophets and so called Christians in here, they are not of Israel, and Lo, we are looking for a prophet of Israel, is there but one?
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Old 09-06-2019, 11:09 PM
 
40,426 posts, read 11,389,133 times
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You and i know that laying on of hands was not necessary in the Gospels. healing was done at a distance with the Centurion's servant (and variants). What was needed was Faith backed up with the guarantee that you can move a mountain if you have Faith as small as a mustard sees (Luke) so, if you can turn a bottle of water on my desk into wine through prayer, I'll convert to whatever religion you want.

cue excuses.
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