Is Anyone Here Actually Searching for Something New to Believe In? (bible, faith)
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They have mutually exclusive descriptions and definitions of God that satisfy their intellectual requirements . . . that has NOTHING to do with the reality or unreality of the God they claim to have experienced. There is no such descriptive information available in the experience . . . except love and acceptance. If there is a wishful component . . . it relates to the choice of descriptions.
Not even love and acceptance are not part of every description of a god; it's just that those are some of the more desirable traits obviously. But aside from that, you are highlighting my point. There's no standard outcome, so the test must be flawed.
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In my case . . . it fails miserably . . . since I not only had no such wishful thinking . . . I had the exact oppposite.
Everyone's different. I'm not saying every theist got their beliefs in that way. It's just that when they say it's real proof, I have to object. My previous post is why.
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The encounter was real and unmistakable. I have no ability to alter it or its character or content. All the intellectual explanation I have accumulated and employed to understand it . . . has nothing to do with the experience itself. The existence of the experience and its reality was the impetus for the decades-long intellectual quest for answers . . . not vice versa. Given the Logic in your screen name . . . I am surprised you continually resort to this . . ."it's all in your head" nonsense. EVERYTHING we experience and know is "all in our head ". . . unless you know of some other repository for it.
Don't revert to the brain in the vat concept. We all agree that there is a clear difference between thoughts in one's own mind and incoming stimuli through our senses; we'd have to in order to function in the world. We almost always agree on where to draw the line between them, as well, but, like the subject of this thread, there are still grey areas.
Now, if only we had some mystical doctor who had a direct line to this alleged divine being, to perform scientific tests on it to see if it was actually an external source or "all in his head." One who claims to learn new things from this being, who can ask it questions and provide correct answers that he would have no other way of knowing. Now here's a way to get to the bottom of this and let it be known once and for all if this god exists, eh MysticPhD? You're a doctor, you know how to set up scientific tests..
Now, if only we had some mystical doctor who had a direct line to this alleged divine being, to perform scientific tests on it to see if it was actually an external source or "all in his head." One who claims to learn new things from this being, who can ask it questions and provide correct answers that he would have no other way of knowing. Now here's a way to get to the bottom of this and let it be known once and for all if this god exists, eh MysticPhD? You're a doctor, you know how to set up scientific tests..
Why do you need some mystical doctor when you can go there and ask God yourself?
It's not all that difficult to talk to God... you don't even have to open your mouth... as he can see everything that's on your mind... and I mean everything... so you might want to keep it clean.
Why do you need some mystical doctor when you can go there and ask God yourself?
It's not all that difficult to talk to God... you don't even have to open your mouth... as he can see everything that's on your mind... and I mean everything... so you might want to keep it clean.
Your programmed fears are showing. God can convict us of "thought crimes", or at the very least spy on our most personal thoughts, can't he? That is a scary thought.
I know how to "talk to God," you just think the words and imagine a being can hear your thoughts; think the words in the form of a letter addressed to [insert god here] and *snap* you are talking to [insert god here]. Enough of this will train your brain to believe the there is really a being listening to your thoughts, and this does not require the being to actually be real at all. It's no proof of any being listening to your thoughts.
Now I must ask you a question. Say I took your advice and (again) "asked God" if he's real, or to be my personal savior, or whatever the magic words are. What specifically do you expect to happen to me that would make me suddenly believe that I was talking to a real god? Please be specific.
Your programmed fears are showing. God can convict us of "thought crimes", or at the very least spy on our most personal thoughts, can't he? That is a scary thought.
I know how to "talk to God," you just think the words and imagine a being can hear your thoughts; think the words in the form of a letter addressed to [insert god here] and *snap* you are talking to [insert god here]. Enough of this will train your brain to believe the there is really a being listening to your thoughts, and this does not require the being to actually be real at all. It's no proof of any being listening to your thoughts.
Now I must ask you a question. Say I took your advice and (again) "asked God" if he's real, or to be my personal savior, or whatever the magic words are. What specifically do you expect to happen to me that would make me suddenly believe that I was talking to a real god? Please be specific.
Well, it's only scary if your thoughts are gross.
First and foremost, please remember one thing above all else, that God loves us beyond anything we can ever imagine.
Second, God has laws and one of his law is there for the purification of our souls... it is our soul that is important here and our way of thinking, acting and feeling affects our soul either positively or negatively. When you are thinking negatively, this brings darkness to your soul.
Not only God can see and hear your thoughts, so can every other spirit, who was once a person on earth. When your thoughts are negative and hateful, you attract those spirits who are like-minded and they feed off of that and this can make matters worse for you.
And when you have positive, loving thoughts, you attract the higher spirits.
The hells are all about degrees of darkness... there is no fire and brimstone or a devil... but there are evil spirits, who have nothing better to do that harass us here on earth, so that's why it's best to think higher thoughts.
If you are really serious about this and not being a jokester, and you really did talk to God with your mind... move your question down to your heart and let your heart speak. You may need to do this for a month but keep doing it, because you'll get an answer.
First and foremost, please remember one thing above all else, that God loves us beyond anything we can ever imagine.
Coming from a person who believes God created the world complete with all its evil, this sounds like Stockholm Syndrome.
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Second, God has laws and one of his law is there for the purification of our souls... it is our soul that is important here and our way of thinking, acting and feeling affects our soul either positively or negatively. When you are thinking negatively, this brings darkness to your soul.
Not only God can see and hear your thoughts, so can every other spirit, who was once a person on earth. When your thoughts are negative and hateful, you attract those spirits who are like-minded and they feed off of that and this can make matters worse for you.
And when you have positive, loving thoughts, you attract the higher spiritsThe hells are all about degrees of darkness... there is no fire and brimstone or a devil... but there are evil spirits, who have nothing better to do that harass us here on earth, so that's why it's best to think higher thoughts.
That's some superstition. How do you know that all this is true?
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If you are really serious about this and not being a jokester, and you really did talk to God with your mind... move your question down to your heart and let your heart speak. You may need to do this for a month but keep doing it, because you'll get an answer.
Saying that I may need to do this for a month absolutely highlights my point, that you train your brain to act as though the being you created in your head is real. Nice try with the deflection by the way, but you never answered my question. So that you don't have to go back to that post:
Now I must ask you a question. Say I took your advice and (again) "asked God" if he's real, or to be my personal savior, or whatever the magic words are. What specifically do you expect to happen to me that would make me suddenly believe that I was talking to a real god? Please be specific.
I suspect the majority of the Atheist on this forum have reviewed and been debated enough to hold a steady position on their religious views. I don’t see much chance of getting them to see any lights or change their views. With Deist and to some extent Agnostics, I guess they may still be finding their footing in the non religious world.
Coming from a person who believes God created the world complete with all its evil, this sounds like Stockholm Syndrome.
That's some superstition. How do you know that all this is true?
Saying that I may need to do this for a month absolutely highlights my point, that you train your brain to act as though the being you created in your head is real. Nice try with the deflection by the way, but you never answered my question. So that you don't have to go back to that post:
Now I must ask you a question. Say I took your advice and (again) "asked God" if he's real, or to be my personal savior, or whatever the magic words are. What specifically do you expect to happen to me that would make me suddenly believe that I was talking to a real god? Please be specific.
Oh sorry, I guess I missed this sentence.
Since I don't know your personal circumstances, let's just say that you have some sort of issue that needs to be resolved and it's been stressing you out.
Just say, hey God, help me out here, I need some relief... I'm giving this problem to you.
Then forget about it.
Within a short time, if you are completely serious and sincere in your request, the feelings of stress will go away and solutions on how to solve the issue will be given to you in your thoughts and actions.
And P.S., I don't have any Stockholm syndrome and God didn't create evil or sin. Apparently, you missed watching my youtube video which I posted in another thread, which explains the whole thing in detail. Evil and sin were the result of Adam and Eve thumbing their noses at God, when He told them they wouldn't be able to live in the highest Heavens without His Divine Love.
Since I don't know your personal circumstances, let's just say that you have some sort of issue that needs to be resolved and it's been stressing you out.
Just say, hey God, help me out here, I need some relief... I'm giving this problem to you.
Then forget about it.
Within a short time, if you are completely serious and sincere in your request, the feelings of stress will go away and solutions on how to solve the issue will be given to you in your thoughts and actions.
So if I have stress and problems, they will go away and I will come up with a solution? That's how I would know God exists?
Imagining a god is relieving your stress sounds like a visualization technique, which is a proven method of relieving stress. Another simple technique is closing your eyes, breathing slowly and imagining the air you breath in collects all the stress, and carries it out when you exhale. There are many varieties of visualization techniques, and the details do not matter as long as it works for you. I see no difference between that and your "proof of God" method.
And coming up with solutions to problems happens to everyone. Your brain mulls over things even when you are unaware, especially when sleeping. Seeing solutions later that at first you couldn't see in the middle of a stressful moment is no proof that an external being injected that solution into your thoughts.
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And P.S., I don't have any Stockholm syndrome and God didn't create evil or sin. Apparently, you missed watching my youtube video which I posted in another thread, which explains the whole thing in detail. Evil and sin were the result of Adam and Eve thumbing their noses at God, when He told them they wouldn't be able to live in the highest Heavens without His Divine Love.
Ah this is a whole other subject, but you claim that God created the tainted fruit tree in the middle of the garden, and created Adam and Eve naturally curious, and didn't realize they would eventually eat the apple? He also created a snake that he knew would tempt them further, and he had no clue? I think if that story were literally true, there's no way that God did not do it on purpose.
On top of that, we did nothing wrong but have to suffer the punishment of living in this hostile world full of pain and injustice, because our earliest ancestors committed a sin? Would you ever punish a kid for something her parents did? The god of the bible is quite fond of vicarious punishment, but I think it's a terrible concept.
Darn it, all those videos and my speakers have died on me.
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