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Please Rafius, can you show us what historical facts were distorted?
I already have done in numerous posts. Let it drop Campbell. No point in going around in circles.
I asked Finn if he had watched the series of videos that Sanspeur presented on the Siege of Tyre but he won't answer so presumably he hasn't. How about you? Did you watch them?
Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneInDaMembrane
Speaking of Ezekiel's Tyre's prophecy flopping, here's another flopper from the book of Isaiah:
Isaiah 17:1-2:
An oracle concerning Damascus. See, Damascus will cease to be a city, and will become a heap of ruins. Her towns will be deserted forever...
....a bit like Egypt being made such a desolate wasteland that neither man nor beast would set foot in it for 40 years.
I know I'm going to crush someone's heart here, but as far as I know about the bible, which is very little, the prophecy of the Messiah is true.
using the bible to prove that the bible is true is not a valid exercise. kinda like,
"it is true because I say it is true" and using that statement as proof.
I already have done in numerous posts. Let it drop Campbell. No point in going around in circles.
I asked Finn if he had watched the series of videos that Sanspeur presented on the Siege of Tyre but he won't answer so presumably he hasn't. How about you? Did you watch them?
I have seen the piece about Alexander attacking island Tyre, but I don't take History Channel for gospel. Or Wikipedia for that matter. Besides it didn't seem to prove your POV in any way.
Don't get me wrong, I watch History Channel all the time. They were talking about something we both agree about: Alexander attacked and defeated island Tyre, by building the land bridge. We never disagreed about that, so, why are you offering that as proof of something? We have been talking about what happened to mainland Tyre, which was destroyed before Alexander was born.
Speaking of Ezekiel's Tyre's prophecy flopping, here's another flopper from the book of Isaiah:
Isaiah 17:1-2:
An oracle concerning Damascus. See, Damascus will cease to be a city, and will become a heap of ruins. Her towns will be deserted forever...
Of course the apologist will claim that this is STILL yet to happen so within the relatively near future, we should expect this large city with a metropolitan area of 6 million people to be flattened. There is no way the apologist will accept the idea this is a failed prophecy despite the fact that the prophet Isaiah lived during the time when Syria (Damascus) was a constant threat to Judah. The chances are, as a result, the writer directed this prophecy of doom upon Damascus to assure his people his people that Syria would cease to be a threat.
This leads to this other flopper:
Isaiah 7:1-7:
In the days of Ahaz,...king of Judah, Rezin the king of Syria and Pekah the son of Remaliah the king of Israel came up to Jerusalem to wage war against it, but they could not conquer it...And the Lord said to Isaiah “Go forth to meet Ahaz...and say to him, ‘Take heed, be quiet, do not fear, and do not let your heart be faint...at the fierce anger of Rezin...and the son of Remaliah. Because Syria...and the son of Remaliah has devised evil against you saying “Let us go up against Judah and terrify it and let us conquer it for ourselves...” thus says the Lord God: “It shall not stand and it shall not come to pass...”
Now compare that to this:
II Chronicles 28:1, 5-6:
Ahaz was 20 years old when he began his reign...[T]he Lord God gave him into the hand of the king of Syria, who defeated him and took captive a great number of his people...He was also given into the hand of the king of Israel who defeated him with great slaughter. For Pekah the son of Remaliah slew a hundred and twenty thousand in Judah in one day...
Hope this one does not conveniently slip through the cracks.
Hope this one does not conveniently slip through the cracks.
If you read a little bit more of Chrinicles and Isaiah, you'll see that God told Isaiah to tell all that to Ahez, but Ahez rejected God and worshipped other gods and even burned his own son alive to please Baal. So God allowed Syrians to smack them around in battle. But they did not lose the war entirely because they got some paid help from Assyria.
Last edited by Finn_Jarber; 12-31-2009 at 12:24 PM..
If you read a little bit more of Chrinicles and Isaiah, you'll see that God told Isaiah to tell all that to Ahez, but Ahez rejected God and worshipped other gods and even burned his own son alive to please Baal. So God allowed Syrians to smack them around in battle. But they did not lose the war entirely because they got some paid help from Assyria.
Well, you know, I am not sure what constitutes "conquer," but this sure sounds like a good ass-whooping:
"...[T]he Lord God gave him into the hand of the king of Syria, who defeated him and took captive a great number of his people...He was also given into the hand of the king of Israel who defeated him with great slaughter."
According to the writer in Isaiah, whatever Syria and Israel was bringing to Judah was NOT going to succeed. Sounds like they did.
Last edited by InsaneInDaMembrane; 12-31-2009 at 05:32 PM..
Well, you know, I am not sure what constitutes "conquer," but this sure sounds like a good ass-whooping:
"...[T]he Lord God gave him into the hand of the king of Syria, who defeated him and took captive a great number of his people...He was also given into the hand of the king of Israel who defeated him with great slaughter."
According to the writer in Isaiah, whatever Syria and Israel was bring to Judah was NOT going to succeed. Sounds like they did.
Yes, they lost over 100 000 people, but the slaves were returned, and they got help in the end, so they were not entirely wiped out. From what I understood Isaiah took the message to the king, but he turned away from God and paid the price.
What is the point, because I don't think this story is a prophecy per se, because everything was happening as they lived. The story is a part of Isreal's history, and this King was evil. When he died, they didn't even bury him in the graves designated for kings.
Yes, they lost over 100 000 people, but the slaves were returned, and they got help in the end, so they were not entirely wiped out. From what I understood Isaiah took the message to the king, but he turned away from God and paid the price.
What is the point, because I don't think this story is a prophecy per se, because everything was happening as they lived. The story is a part of Isreal's history, and this King was evil. When he died, they didn't even bury him in the graves designated for kings.
This is what Isaiah told Ahaz in the name of god concerning the invasion:
"thus says the Lord God: “It shall not stand and it shall not come to pass...”
Sounds like a prophecy to me.
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