Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 12-02-2009, 04:05 PM
 
Location: Colorado Springs
92 posts, read 215,590 times
Reputation: 52

Advertisements

i am late to this question in this forum about the beginning of everything.....if there is something such as First Cause..then the singularity would have to have been caused by something....if the singularity was eternal, then what caused the inflationary expansion of the singularity into what is now the Universe?..the singularity could have just been there through eternity....always..but, the term always or eternity is not appropriate because there was no space-time before the Big Bang.....and if there was not.....in what medium, dimension, space, or sense did the singularity exist??...it had to exist in something, occupy something I believe....what???...as to what quantum mechanics says about things popping into existence due to fluctuations in a vacuum field, or extra negative entropy or something...well where did the entropy or quantum mechanics for that matter come from?
It is really baffling....
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-02-2009, 08:38 PM
 
Location: New Haven, CT
179 posts, read 294,522 times
Reputation: 39
It's funny that you ask that. People think that god is a being with form and structure. Furthermore, the bible says that he created all things in 6 days and on 7th day he rested. This BS in it's true form, First off days did not exist before creation a day is a measurement of time relative to how long it takes the earth to rotate 360°. A day to god could have very well been a micro-second or even a billion years. I belive that god is a force that exists outside our very notion of existence, a force without form or shape, I belive that the god i worship is what i call "The Ultimate Origin" The beginning of the beginning's beginning. Was god Created? perhalps god is space itself even physicist's agree that all things exist in space even alternate universe's (if they exist) exist in the same space. Space even scientifically speaking is the origin of all things and is the endless boundless void that all things exist in. The bible is right when it says in the beginning there was darkness. Perhalps god is space.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-02-2009, 10:50 PM
 
1,186 posts, read 2,246,421 times
Reputation: 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by moonsun View Post
who is the creator of god ?

God is the creator .

if some one or some thing created him then he would be the created and not the creator.

but he is the creator and not the created

so
this question is not logical and it is invalid and contradictory in it self
because Allah is the creator and he is not the created

for example we say Allah the strong and this Characteristic for Allah is invalid to have its Versa which is weak

same thing he is the creator we cant say he is created

and he is not created so how can we ask who created him .

if we have imposed - a controversy - there is a creator for the creator then we ask who is the creator of the creator and then
who is the creator that create the creator of the creator

Thus, to continue indefinitely. This is impossible in the minds.

so he is the creator and every thing else is created and they end to him

he is the first and nothing before him
he is the last and nothing after him

the laws and rules of the universe is created by Allah and it does not apply on him

he does not need any thing to create the universe .


2:117 To Him is due the primal origin of the heavens and the earth: When He decreeth a matter, He
saith to it: "Be," and it is.

Sura #54 Al-Qamar / The moon verses 50
And Our Command is but a single (Act),- like the twinkling of an eye.

19:35 It befitteth not (the Majesty of) Allah that He should take unto Himself a son. Glory be to Him!
When He decreeth a thing, He saith unto it only: Be! and it is.

19:36 And lo! Allah is my Lord and your Lord. So serve Him. That is the right path.


112:1 Say: He is Allah, the One and Only;
2 Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;
3 He begetteth not, nor is He begotten;
4 And there is none like unto Him.

and in the hadith

"Satan comes to one of you and says, 'Who created so-and-so? 'till he says, 'Who has created your
Lord?' So, when he inspires such a question, one should seek refuge with Allah and give up such
thoughts."

This is a very tricky question, asked usually by an atheist and the rationalist.

Once a close friend of mine, while beginning a discussion with a rationalist in an atheist organisation in Mumbay started off by asking, ‘This is a pencil, how did it come into existence, it has to have a creator’. ‘This is a book, how did it come into existence, it has to have a creator’. Thus giving answers to his own questions, proved that everything has a creator.

He then posed the following questions- if the pencil is created in a factory, who created the factory? The answer is an engineer or some similar person. Who created that engineer? There also has to be a Creator of this engineer. Similarly who created the sun, the moon, the stars etc? There has to be a creator for everything.

Then he posed the question: ‘Do you agree that everything in the world has a creator?’ The atheist of that organisation replied, ‘we will agree only on the condition, that you should not back out in future from your own statement that everything has a creator.’ My friend was very satisfied, thinking he had succeeded in convincing about God and said, “Yes I will stick to my statement that everything has a creator, but you still have not replied to my question: that who created the human beings, the sun, the moon, the stars etc”. He further helps them with the answer by saying ‘It is God Almighty,’ the atheist replied, “We will believe in God if you tell us ‘Who created God? and my friend got the biggest shock of his life. He knew he was trapped.

He was disturbed so much that he did not sleep for the whole night. The next day, while he was narrating this incident to me, I realised that he was using the methodology of proving the existence of God, written by some scholars. In this methodology, a very important rule of logic i.e. self analysis is overlooked. During my talks while proving the existence of Allah, I never make any statement saying everything has a creator.

I start my explanation by asking the atheist, “Who will be the first to know the mechanism of an unknown object? It is the atheist who replies; the creator, the manufacturer, not Me Using his answer that the creator is the first person who knows the mechanism of any object I further prove to him using scientific knowledge that the creator of the Universe i.e. God Almighty is the first to know the mechanism of the universe and has mentioned it in his book ‘The Quran’. But if somebody was to pose me the same Question:, that who will be the first to know the mechanism of an unknown object, I will not reply just by saying ‘the creator’ or ‘the manufacturer,’ but I will reply, that every object and all things which have a beginning, the mechanism of all these things will be first known by its creator, since they are all created things. Even after using this answer of mine, we can still scientifically prove that all the signs that we see i.e. the sun, the moon, the earth etc have a beginning of their mechanism”. That is the way they function and behave.

This has been discovered recently by science, but was mentioned 1400 years ago in the Quran which proves that it is a book which is revealed by Allah.

Now if someone asks me the question “Who created Allah?”

I will reply that once my friend asked me a similar question that his brother Tom was admitted to the hospital and he conceived and gave birth to a baby: guess, is the baby a girl or a boy?

It is an absurd statement. Only females can conceive and give birth to a baby.

It is impossible for Tom, who is a male, to conceive and give a birth to a child.

One of the qualities and characteristics of a male is that he cannot conceive and give birth to a child. Similarly one of the characteristics of Allah is He is uncreated and does not have a beginning.

Therefore asking a question, “Who created the uncreated?” is as absurd as asking, “My brother Tom conceived and gave birth to a child, is the child a girl or a boy?”.

Islamic Voice - Safar / Rabi-Ul Awwal 1422 H
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-03-2009, 12:32 AM
 
Location: New Haven, CT
179 posts, read 294,522 times
Reputation: 39
Yes, but, tom had a mom. Furthermore, I do agree with you that god has no beginning or end no shape or form. He is and always will be this is why i call him "The Ultimate Origin". When moses spoke to god (the burning bush) Moses said to god "suppose i go to the isrealites and say to them 'The god of your fathers has sent me to you' and they ask me 'what is his name?' then what shall i tell them?" God said to moses "I AM WHAT I AM. This is what you are to say to the isrealites: ' I AM HAS SENT ME TO YOU.' " GENESIS CH.3 Verses 13/14. This proves 3 things 1: god has no creator therfore he has no name he simply is. 2: he has no form or shape he can be a burning bush or a pillar of flame or anything and everything he simply is. 3: God is "The Ultimate Origin" of all including the mind Buddhist alway's say that the mind could not have come from nothing it had to have already been there. This is why god referred to himself as "I AM" wise man once said "I think therefore I am". We are antenna's tapped into god.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-15-2009, 10:46 AM
 
Location: Kurdistan Sine
152 posts, read 220,297 times
Reputation: 34
if u think better u will see that time is created by GOD so there will be no "before" fo GOD
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-05-2011, 05:21 PM
 
1,811 posts, read 1,203,448 times
Reputation: 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafius View Post
The answer you will get from theists is that their god was not created by anything. They will say that he is and always was.... but when they ask you how the universe came to be and you say 'Why can't the universe always have been there...it is and always was', they will scoff and say 'What an idiotic thing to say. Nothing can always have been. Everything must have had a beginning'.

They are indeed strange creatures!!
Yes, and they say it with straight faces, so to speak, not realizing one bit what a silly contradiction they are making. They want their cake and want to eat it too.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-05-2011, 05:22 PM
 
1,811 posts, read 1,203,448 times
Reputation: 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by diako_lorddm View Post
if u think better u will see that time is created by GOD so there will be no "before" fo GOD
But who or what created god.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-05-2011, 05:24 PM
 
1,811 posts, read 1,203,448 times
Reputation: 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by PersonaFan View Post
Yes, but, tom had a mom. Furthermore, I do agree with you that god has no beginning or end no shape or form. He is and always will be this is why i call him "The Ultimate Origin". When moses spoke to god (the burning bush) Moses said to god "suppose i go to the isrealites and say to them 'The god of your fathers has sent me to you' and they ask me 'what is his name?' then what shall i tell them?" God said to moses "I AM WHAT I AM. This is what you are to say to the isrealites: ' I AM HAS SENT ME TO YOU.' " GENESIS CH.3 Verses 13/14. This proves 3 things 1: god has no creator therfore he has no name he simply is. 2: he has no form or shape he can be a burning bush or a pillar of flame or anything and everything he simply is. 3: God is "The Ultimate Origin" of all including the mind Buddhist alway's say that the mind could not have come from nothing it had to have already been there. This is why god referred to himself as "I AM" wise man once said "I think therefore I am". We are antenna's tapped into god.
Passage in the bible or any other book, especially a work of fiction like the bible prove nothing whatsoever, are evidence of nothing whatsoever. It is mostly jibberish and unintelligible babble.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-11-2012, 10:53 AM
 
Location: Point Hope Alaska
4,320 posts, read 4,746,556 times
Reputation: 1146
Quote:
Originally Posted by moonsun View Post
Who created god?

not any normal person can answer this question.

the one who can answer this question is a prophet

and the prophet said

"Satan comes to one of you and says, 'Who created so-and-so? 'till he says,
'Who has created your Lord?' So,
when he inspires such a question, one should seek refuge with Allah and give up such thoughts."
For thousands of years mankind worshipped the sun & the moon! thus Allah was born -a pagan god from pagan religions!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-31-2015, 06:46 PM
 
1 posts, read 531 times
Reputation: 10
If god is real and is good like others have said then why isn't there world peace? Why is life so hard? Why is there depression? I'm Satanist but it's not what you think it is I don't worship Satan I see myself as a god there isn't a heaven nor hell just an after life and sometimes if chosen by the reaper reincarnated into another life but there has never been a god. The human beings created a god to give others hope and to get their slaves to work harder or "god" will punish them and in case you ask "if there's no god then how were we created?" There are life among us outside of earth similar to us who created us wanting to see how our society will turn out they tried with the dinosaurs but failed so they got rid of them and started all over and they are slowly watching us and to be honest we were lucky we made it this far
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top