What Do You Consider Unforgivable?..... (birth control, church, abortion, suicide)
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What would make you cut someone out of your life? It's obvious from reading all these threads that some things/sins bother some people more than others.
In my case, it's an abusive parent. I struggled with trying to have a relationship with him in spite of what he had done not just to me but everyone around him. I felt that I had to be the bigger person and forgive, because one of the Ten Commandments is to honor your mother and father.
After being completely humiliated in public (in a Christian bookstore, no less) because he once again was arguing with someone, the salesperson, about how dare they push anything other than the King James Version of the Bible on anyone (it's a bookstore, for crying out loud) - I experienced what I like to call an Alfred Hitchcock moment. You know, like scenes from his movies where a defining moment is defined even further by the zoom of the camera lense....it all came crashing in at me.
All the things he had ever done and swore that he didn't, all the things he was still doing and never once admitting to having done anything wrong or uttering the words I'm sorry or please forgive me....it was like I was in a vacuum in the middle of that store, frozen with my mouth dropped open. On the way back I confronted him and I remember two things that he said. One, he said that someone had to set that woman straight because she was wrong, and the other was that the only reason I was any kind of decent human being was because of him. My response? No, Dad, I am a decent human being IN SPITE of you. I walked away and he was still blabbing as I closed the garage door. That was 6 years ago.
What would force you to completely remove someone from your life? Is there someone you need to remove right now or have you had to do this already? I got past the honor your parents thing with the help of my mother. God says to honor, He doesn't say you have to take abuse. I honor him by staying away from him. No more harsh words, anger, rage, hitting, or me feeling inadequate in every way. I have a relationship with my God in spite of the way he twisted religion and the Bible. But I had to fall hard before I searched for the truth for myself. Don't make my same mistakes....life is never good without Christ! What say you?
I've been in your shoes, so to speak. I'm an adult child of an alcoholic father. We kids (6 total) had our share of beatings, near death car crashes, emotional abuse, etc. etc. My mother was Christian and that's what I believe saved us all. She was strict and had her share of problems, mostly taking her anger out on us kids (emotional/physical) rather than dad. But also took us to church and attended church. It was at our church, through teachings and Bible study that I came to understand 1) you cannot judge the Christian faith by those who say they follow it. They are sinners too and fallible and make plenty of mistakes, too. 2) You must forgive.
Now, the forgiving part is extremely hard. As we all grew into adults, and after my mother left my Dad, she came to each of us, apologized and asked for our forgiveness for what she was responsible for. IT was sincere and we all did. My dad was another story. I pretty much cut him out of my life for almost 10 years. He never asked for forgiveness or even said sorry for anything. My parting words were I love you and forgive you but I can't see you anymore.
It took longer than I thought to forgive him. I also prayed for him every chance I had. Eventually the bitterness went away. Eventually I saw him as the sorry, sad person he was. Did that excuse his behavior? No. But it put him in a new perspective for me. I had finally let go of the anger and resentment. Then one day he came around and asked to be forgiven. He had given up drinking (mostly) and was trying to reconnect and make an effort to be a dad to an adult and be a part of my life.
Well, we had a good six months before he was killed in an auto accident. I thank God that I got to be with him in the time we had after our 10 yr separation.
To end my long diatribe -- yes, you can cut someone out of your life. But you must still forgive them (lest ye be forgiven). Now whether or not you ever reconnect, pray about that and leave it for God to decide.
I don't think you can really answer that question of what is unforgivable unless you're a position where it's extremely difficult. (Did that make sense?) You know I mean you can say "oh ya I'm always going to forgive because it is the right thing" but until you're in that situation you just don't know. We are told by Jesus that we are to forgive all. Only He is the ultimate judge. I can't say that it's easy to forgive someone who's done something awful cause I just haven't been in that situation but I do know that it is a lot harder and more stressful to hold a grudge and be bitter then it is to let go and have the sweet peace that comes with forgiveness.
There was an incident that happened here in my state a few months ago:
A man was driving with his wife and two kids in the car on Christmas eve. They were slammed by a hit and run. The wife and two kids were killed instantly. The husband declared on that spot that he would unconditionally forgive the man who did this. Now I can't even imagine how hard that would of been and I don't think I could do that in the same situation but I do believe that his heart is a lot lighter and filled with peace and love of Christ because of it.
I believe there is a difference in christian forgiveness and being able to have someone who is toxic continue to be an influence on your life and that of your children...
I think there are cases where while you forgive your alcoholic parent for not being there for you but you draw the line when it comes to letting him continue to be a destructive force in your life, especially if you have children.
My neice is a destructive force, I forgive her, I don't hate her, I feel sorrow at what her life has become...however she is not welcome in my home, she is not welcome around my daughter...not because I feel I am superior to her but because I can't have that kind of destructive, toxic influence in my life or that of my daughter.
I am not a mental health counselor or a warden, I can not help this person. I think often when people want to forgive they go to far and try to FIX that person, they allow that person to cause problems with their family life...
She does illegal drugs, drinks and has since she was 15, she uses abortions and the morning after pill as birth control, she sleeps around with the ease that I shake hands with people, she steals, she drives drunk and high...she dresses like she is a hooker...she makes Britany Spears look like a old married lady...
THE very last thing I need in my life is for my daughter to see this kind of behavior and think its cool or see the way in which her parents enable her to continue.
I guess my question should have been what do you consider unacceptable. Lisa uses the word that fits and that I have used to describe any person that must be removed - TOXIC. I have weaknesses, and to turn my life around and be strong in Christ I had to remove everything and everyone, pretty much. Sorry about your terrible childhood, Mams. I can relate.
It's not that I haven't forgiven...I just can't be exposed to that level of toxicity and expect to behave Christ-like. It affects my behavior too. But I do require a sincere apology and a complete change in behavior from him to resume a relationship, like Mams. I haven't always felt that way, though.
The Bible says not to yoke ourselves to unbelievers....I don't see my father as a true believer. I see it more as a control thing. Christians don't act like he does. But I also believe there is some mental illness there, too. That's because I went to see a Christian psychologist a year or so after I cut him out of my life. She heard all the lovely details, and could not see how I had survived it. She said that he has a form of schizophrenia, called "grandiose personality." But still, even mentally ill people can say they are sorry, get help and try to do better.
The real concern for me has been my own psychological well being...I can only take so much without loosing my own mind...AND therefore the ability to take care of my daughter...Her care is of the utmost importance too me, everyone else comes after that.
The other concern is of course the effect it has on my developing daughter, she is only 10 and I do my best to make sure that she is not exposed to the wrong things...
The real concern for me has been my own psychological well being...I can only take so much without loosing my own mind...AND therefore the ability to take care of my daughter...Her care is of the utmost importance too me, everyone else comes after that.
The other concern is of course the effect it has on my developing daughter, she is only 10 and I do my best to make sure that she is not exposed to the wrong things...
Take away daughter and add son, and this could have been something I said. Your priorities are most definitely in order.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mams1559
attended church. It was at our church, through teachings and Bible study that I came to understand 1) you cannot judge the Christian faith by those who say they follow it. They are sinners too and fallible and make plenty of mistakes, too. 2) You must forgive.
This is also what I came to understand. I have tried to convey this to non-believers who have had really bad experiences with those claiming to be Christians and do reprehensible things. I haven't been very successful.
well anyway her and her hubby are getting a divorce (6 yrs ago) and hubby asks me to "be on his side" in court
I said yes BECAUSE she tried to commit suicide
kids don't need to come home to that if she thinks she's having a bad day
anyway to make me look like a bad witness she slandered me name and did all this kinda crap saying i was an alcoholic etc etc
Well she lost custody
would you believe at the end of the trial she said ahe wasn't trying to be mean to me she just wanted her kids
and would I forgive her
I told her I would
she asked if we could still be friends
I told her when pigs fly
PS Her children come to my home on a daily basis
my son wants to do a sleepover with her son at HER house
I said NOPE don't ask again
It's hard for me to forgive people who have stabbed me in the back. Also, the guy who killed my brother - it's hard to find forgiveness for that.
Someone wise told me this so I will share
For you to hold your anger in does no good for your brother
but for you to let your anger go does good for your soul
I don't know if it will help
I'm am sorry about your brother
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I honor him by staying away from him. No more harsh words, anger, rage, hitting, or me feeling inadequate in every way.
I have a relationship with my God in spite of the way he twisted religion and the Bible. But I had to fall hard before I searched for the truth for myself. Don't make my same mistakes....life is never good without Christ! What say you?
