Why 2,000 years ago? (bible, quote, divorce, marriages)

[MoItaly]

Well, Reverend, isn't fear what religion is about? It all starts with fear of death, with the need to believe in an other life. Then there's the fear of hell, fear of suffering for the eternity...
Without death there would not be one single religion in the world.

[QuixoticHobbit]

Originally Posted by Campbell34

Human beliefs state that human existance goes back 200,000 years or more.

Human beliefs don't state that. The facts written in the earth itself do..

The Biblical account states that the world is only about 13,000 years old.

The Biblical account is in error.

God allowed man to see through the Old Testament times, that man could not earn Salvation through his own merit. And because of that, God provided another way through the person of Jesus Christ 2000 years ago. God does things in His own way, and in His own time.

And rather incompetently...

[Melvin.George]

Originally Posted by Reverend1111

It's really sad that you see God that way. There is a God just not the one you have been taught. When you wake up in the spirit world and realize where you are, you'll go searching. Unless you are so far in your own hell to find the hope that is needed to start your journey.

How's about you prove to me that there's a living, caring god??

In the 1940's and 1950's when I was young we were always in church at least two days a week and on Wednesday evenings at prayer meeting the prayer lists were a foot long. Everybody in the church either had a family member or close friend who was dying from heart disease or cancer. Back in those days there was nothing the doctors and hospitals could do for them. If a cancer patient was operated on, which was the only remedy, the cancer usually metasticized and within a few months to a year they died. Heart patients had the first heart attack and if they were lucky they survived. If they survived they were disabled...laid around for a year or two and died. Was god ignoring the billions of prayers or did he just not give a..................??

Now with sophisticated electronic diagnostic methods like MRI, CATscans, treadmill benchmarks, better diets, therapeutics and remedials like heart bypass, stents, transplants, chemo, radiation, stem cell transplants etc. the same kind of patients live into their eighties and sometimes nineties. A question for you...did god ignore the hundreds of billions of prayers being offered back then or did he hear them and not give a big........??

If you have doubts about the way folks used to die check the actuarial tables used by the insurance companies and compare those death rates with those of today. I don't know whether or not there's a living god in this universe and you don't either! If there is he/she/it is one cavalier individual

[rifleman]

Originally Posted by Reverend1111

It's really sad that you see God that way. There is a God just not the one you have been taught. When you wake up in the spirit world and realize where you are, you'll go searching. Unless you are so far in your own hell to find the hope that is needed to start your journey.

Neither MG nor I nor a host of others with a good dash of common sense see "God" that way, because it'd be like going looking for the Wizard of Oz. He t'ain't around, no way, no where, no how. It's all just an illusion aimed at controlling people's minds.

F'instance, Tom (C34) has changed his own timeline belief over the past year, flipping around from the calculated 6036+ yr timeline to allow, now, his stated 13,000+ years. Keep going, Tom; soon you'll have it out to 14 billion where it should be. Note that this is just the Earth: it formed well after the overall beginning of the larger, older universe.

Nowadays, the facts speak for themselves. Innocent science, not knowing what to expect, started looking into the application of common sense and of established techniques and technologies to answer larger questions. Imagine their surprise, they having no preconceived ideas of anything, when the age of things turned out to be VERY OLD!

Faced with such evidence, they investigated several dozen ways from Sunday, so to speak, and found, amazingly, that most all of their investigations dovetailed with the careful observations of others. That there was a general, worldwide consensus on that ancient timeline, and that such a schedule also explained many otherwise confusing events and discoveries. It all came together, so to speak. Unlike the ever-more-inexplicable and irrational fundamentalist Christian version.

Eventually, the larger, more knowledgeable world agreed on this.

The burden of proof in some other easily debunked and nonsense timeline and belief resides firmly on the shoulders of those who support it and simultaneously deny all the more believable research results. Go for it though; we're waiting. Just one simple, elegant but well-thought-out and believable research study that supports an "Insta-Poof" 2000 yr old, or 6000 yr old, Genesis, with "nothing"* existing before that.

Just one. Please.
________________________

PS: *"nothing": would that be the same "nothing" theists say science can't explain? But you can? Please then. By all means! Explain.

[Reverend1111]

Originally Posted by Melvin.George

How's about you prove to me that there's a living, caring god??

In the 1940's and 1950's when I was young we were always in church at least two days a week and on Wednesday evenings at prayer meeting the prayer lists were a foot long. Everybody in the church either had a family member or close friend who was dying from heart disease or cancer. Back in those days there was nothing the doctors and hospitals could do for them. If a cancer patient was operated on, which was the only remedy, the cancer usually metasticized and within a few months to a year they died. Heart patients had the first heart attack and if they were lucky they survived. If they survived they were disabled...laid around for a year or two and died. Was god ignoring the billions of prayers or did he just not give a..................??

Now with sophisticated electronic diagnostic methods like MRI, CATscans, treadmill benchmarks, better diets, therapeutics and remedials like heart bypass, stents, transplants, chemo, radiation, stem cell transplants etc. the same kind of patients live into their eighties and sometimes nineties. A question for you...did god ignore the hundreds of billions of prayers being offered back then or did he hear them and not give a big........??

If you have doubts about the way folks used to die check the actuarial tables used by the insurance companies and compare those death rates with those of today. I don't know whether or not there's a living god in this universe and you don't either! If there is he/she/it is one cavalier individual

Only you can prove God exists because God is a part of us all. In order to actually know He is real, you have to look within and not out side of yourself. I have found Him within me and I know you can do the same. I went from darkness and found the Light of God. I made it grow through prayer. Prayer for His Love. It's the only way to prove God exists. no one can prove it to you.

As to the prayers, it depends on the intent of the person who is praying. Do they do it selfishly or do they do it for the greater good. God will not answer any prayer if the material world is the outcome. God is all about the spiritual part of man. When I pray for others, the other person will need to be open to those prayers or they don't work. People misunderstand what prayer actually is.
Sometimes when we pray for others who have diseases, we can help them tolerate the disease and help them deal with it. But, if the heart of the person who is being prayed for is not well, the prayers will not work.

I have an aunt who is a hypocondriac. It would do me no good to pray for her because if she were to heal from one disease, she would imagine another and be right back where she started. She would truely want to behealed for my prayers to work. If someone asked for prayers for healing and while you are praying had negative thoughts, the prayers wouldn't work. Prayer is a two way street where both parties have to meet halfway or prayers don't work. If someone were being prayed for and was all excited and giddy and ready for a healing and saw themselves healed, they would be healed for as long as they kept a positive outlook and their intention was to stay well. Most people who get healed in churches are there for the show and most end up right back where they started, disease and all. They believe in God and that He is loving and kind and merciful but then they leave the church and are just the same person they were before they put the mask on for the show.

I've seen some real healings and prayers do work but the intent has to be there. i've also seen healings without prayer and I've also healed myself without prayer. (That's another story and another type of healing)

[Reverend1111]

Originally Posted by rifleman

Neither MG nor I nor a host of others with a good dash of common sense see "God" that way, because it'd be like going looking for the Wizard of Oz. He t'ain't around, no way, no where, no how. It's all just an illusion aimed at controlling people's minds.

F'instance, Tom (C34) has changed his own timeline belief over the past year, flipping around from the calculated 6036+ yr timeline to allow, now, his stated 13,000+ years. Keep going, Tom; soon you'll have it out to 14 billion where it should be. Note that this is just the Earth: it formed well after the overall beginning of the larger, older universe.

Nowadays, the facts speak for themselves. Innocent science, not knowing what to expect, started looking into the application of common sense and of established techniques and technologies to answer larger questions. Imagine their surprise, they having no preconceived ideas of anything, when the age of things turned out to be VERY OLD!

Faced with such evidence, they investigated several dozen ways from Sunday, so to speak, and found, amazingly, that most all of their investigations dovetailed with the careful observations of others. That there was a general, worldwide consensus on that ancient timeline, and that such a schedule also explained many otherwise confusing events and discoveries. It all came together, so to speak. Unlike the ever-more-inexplicable and irrational fundamentalist Christian version.

Eventually, the larger, more knowledgeable world agreed on this.

The burden of proof in some other easily debunked and nonsense timeline and belief resides firmly on the shoulders of those who support it and simultaneously deny all the more believable research results. Go for it though; we're waiting. Just one simple, elegant but well-thought-out and believable research study that supports an "Insta-Poof" 2000 yr old, or 6000 yr old, Genesis, with "nothing"* existing before that.

Just one. Please.
________________________

PS: *"nothing": would that be the same "nothing" theists say science can't explain? But you can? Please then. By all means! Explain.

Not sure why you're going off on a tangent as you know full well I don't believe the same things that the ones who read the bible do. It would truely surprise you what I really knew and thought of the world and how old it actually is incuding our solar system. And I'm not threatening anyone with anything. I merely made a statement. Hell is darkness of the soul and even being ignorant of God can be darkness. That is what I was referring to and not the burning fearful crap portrayed by others here. You know full well I do not adhere to that garbage and fear. Hell is only darkness and it can be rid of by becoming a nonignorant person.

As to the OP, Jesus came to get rid of the ignorance that the OT portrays of God and who we are. It seems to me no one listened.

[Melvin.George]

Originally Posted by Reverend1111

Jesus came to get rid of the ignorance that the OT portrays of God and who we are. It seems to me no one listened.

The man who walked on water, turned water into wine, cured advanced leprosy by touching, raised others from the dead, fed 5,000+ women and children with two fish and five loaves, was resurrected...or so they said.

Primitive Hearsay...nothing more!!

[Reverend1111]

Originally Posted by Melvin.George

The man who walked on water, turned water into wine, cured advanced leprosy by touching, raised others from the dead, fed 5,000+ women and children with two fish and five loaves, was resurrected...or so they said.

Primitive Hearsay...nothing more!!

And I agree with you. Jesus didn't do all those things that the false writers of the bible proclaim. He was a man just like everyone else. The only thing He did that no one else has done so far is raise His consciousness to that of God's. He isn't God but He is like Him. That is what He came here to show the world, only the world is living in too much fear to give it a try for themselves because of their religion or lack of belief in God. When the fear subsides and those who have no belief finally find the Truth of Jesus's words, you will then have your proof of God, not before. If you continue to dwell on the falsities that are written in the bible instead of what is actually Truth, you will not ever find God. When you put away the idea that there is no God and look within, you will find Him there.

Everything we believe about God is only an idea of God until we put asside all beliefs. It is then that God reveals Himself. He cannot abide in untruth. To find that Truth, we only have to listen to the still small voice within.

[lovemaine]

Originally Posted by Reverend1111

Only you can prove God exists because God is a part of us all. In order to actually know He is real, you have to look within and not out side of yourself. I have found Him within me and I know you can do the same. I went from darkness and found the Light of God. I made it grow through prayer. Prayer for His Love. It's the only way to prove God exists. no one can prove it to you.

As to the prayers, it depends on the intent of the person who is praying. Do they do it selfishly or do they do it for the greater good. God will not answer any prayer if the material world is the outcome. God is all about the spiritual part of man. When I pray for others, the other person will need to be open to those prayers or they don't work. People misunderstand what prayer actually is.
Sometimes when we pray for others who have diseases, we can help them tolerate the disease and help them deal with it. But, if the heart of the person who is being prayed for is not well, the prayers will not work.
I have an aunt who is a hypocondriac. It would do me no good to pray for her because if she were to heal from one disease, she would imagine another and be right back where she started. She would truely want to behealed for my prayers to work. If someone asked for prayers for healing and while you are praying had negative thoughts, the prayers wouldn't work. Prayer is a two way street where both parties have to meet halfway or prayers don't work. If someone were being prayed for and was all excited and giddy and ready for a healing and saw themselves healed, they would be healed for as long as they kept a positive outlook and their intention was to stay well. Most people who get healed in churches are there for the show and most end up right back where they started, disease and all. They believe in God and that He is loving and kind and merciful but then they leave the church and are just the same person they were before they put the mask on for the show.

I've seen some real healings and prayers do work but the intent has to be there. i've also seen healings without prayer and I've also healed myself without prayer. (That's another story and another type of healing)

Wow! It never fails to amaze me how many excuses there are for your god not answering prayers. My mother was diagnosed with terminal brain cancer last year. She was a christian. Many of her christian friends and also family prayed for her. Prayer circles were formed for her. She believed with all her heart that the prayers were going to help her. Guess what? Didn't happen. When she was first diagnosed, she was given a life expectancy of 12 - 18 months. She made it 9 months. She died helpless in a hospital bed not even knowing her own family.

But of course I know what's coming next: god works in mysterious ways, right? I know that's what Christians believe. I say bull. I am SO incredibly grateful to be an atheist. To not be a slave to a made-up story is the ultimate freedom. But that's just my humble opinion...

[Reverend1111]

Originally Posted by lovemaine

Wow! It never fails to amaze me how many excuses there are for your god not answering prayers. My mother was diagnosed with terminal brain cancer last year. She was a christian. Many of her christian friends and also family prayed for her. Prayer circles were formed for her. She believed with all her heart that the prayers were going to help her. Guess what? Didn't happen. When she was first diagnosed, she was given a life expectancy of 12 - 18 months. She made it 9 months. She died helpless in a hospital bed not even knowing her own family.

But of course I know what's coming next: god works in mysterious ways, right? I know that's what Christians believe. I say bull. I am SO incredibly grateful to be an atheist. To not be a slave to a made-up story is the ultimate freedom. But that's just my humble opinion...

God works openly and not mysteriously. The bible christians tell you that because they don't have an answer. Prayer comes from the heart of the giver as well as it needs to come from the receiver. Maybe your mother was unbeknowingly blocking the prayers because of something she had hidden in her soul. Sometimes, people die anyway because of the path that they designed throughout their life. It matters not how many prayer circles one can go to. It's the intent that matters. I know prayers work when done right. Don't be angry at me because someone else made you angry. I don't read the bible nor do I follow it but someone who did sure made you angry about it.

I mean no disrespect to you or your mother. My own mother has had cancer twice and has recovered. It's very hard to deal with for those who go through it.