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Old 04-01-2010, 06:10 PM
 
608 posts, read 515,306 times
Reputation: 33

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Konraden
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryrge
You insist on that because you don't want to bring in God the first processor of everything that is in process and is the result of a process.
I've given the following logic to explain, without supernatural entities, how this is possible.

1 Cause is movement or change.
2 Everything requires a cause.
3 If everything requires a cause, necessarily there must have been a "first cause."
4 Something cannot come from nothing.
5 Necessarily, there was always "something."
6 If there was always something, and everything needs a cause,
7 Necessarily, something was always being "caused," i.e., always moving or changing.
8. Therefor, something always changing requires no causing entities to cause.
You mean there has always been something.

In which case you mean the totality of existence.

Is that totality of existence one entity or several entities?



I like to pursue this line of investigation.





Ryrge
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Old 04-01-2010, 06:15 PM
 
3,614 posts, read 2,951,912 times
Reputation: 909
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryrge View Post
You mean there has always been something.

In which case you mean the totality of existence.

Is that totality of existence one entity or several entities?



I like to pursue this line of investigation.





Ryrge
If all of our gathered knowledge points to only one plane of existence: one entity.
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Old 04-01-2010, 06:20 PM
 
Location: alabama
200 posts, read 258,688 times
Reputation: 55
All of our gathered knowledge in physics seem to point to one singularity at the "big bang".

Everything "seems" to come from that.
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Old 04-01-2010, 06:21 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,038 posts, read 30,680,506 times
Reputation: 12213
Quote:
Originally Posted by offthefence View Post
I just can't let this slip by.
Most believers in evolution, to this day, say we evolved from apes.
Classroom walls used to be adorned with the chart showing the progression from monkey to man.
In Darwin's own writings he made the case that we evolved from the great apes.
Ask just about anyone that believes in evolution what the "missing link" is and they will tell you it's the missing link between monkey and man.


Just for the record, to get all the christian name calling out of the way, I am not a Christian, so please, let's not go there.
I just cant let this slip by...

1...Evolution does not say that we evolved from apes. Only those that are ignorant of evolutionary theory say that.... As a matter of fact humans are a species of ape...The others are Gorillas, Chimpanzees, Bonobos, Gibbons and Urang-utans...We apes share a common ancestor.

2...I don't believe Darwin said any such thing. If he did he was mistaken.

3..Ask me and I'll say.....Since we did not evolve from monkeys, there is no missing link between us and monkeys..."Missing link" is more of a media expression than scientific, and is not important overall as evidence for evolution.
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Old 04-01-2010, 06:24 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,038 posts, read 30,680,506 times
Reputation: 12213
Quote:
Originally Posted by mmm...mabeynot View Post
All of our gathered knowledge in physics seem to point to one singularity at the "big bang".

Everything "seems" to come from that.
The big bang has nothing to do with evolution, other than provide a place where life could evolve, once begun.
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Old 04-01-2010, 07:01 PM
 
Location: alabama
200 posts, read 258,688 times
Reputation: 55
I was refering to the "one enity" concept from Konraden.

Simply stating that it "seems" that everything can be traced back to one thing.
Not a deity, but one thing.
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Old 04-01-2010, 07:03 PM
 
608 posts, read 515,306 times
Reputation: 33
By totality of existence I mean everything that exists.

There is no need to bring in this or that level or kind of existence, or anything, just that it does exist whether in your mind or outside, or in any kind of time and space or in any kind of universe or in all universes whether possible only (but not impossible), whatever that is existing even just as a possibility, or yes in no space and in no time but still existing.

Just don't include nothing if you mean by nothing nothing, not nothing and then slip in something, as some guy in his own website but not a forum discusses endlessly about how nothing can lead to something and all the time he is meaning by nothing, space.

Space is something, it is not nothing.


If you want to talk about nothing, absolutely nothing and start from that point onward, then you must state: "imagining (if that be possible which is impossible) that there has never been anything whatsoever that exists now or in the past or in the future or anywhere or at anytime or in an kind of existence," and then you must leave every space in your post blank, namely, you continue with nothing in your edit box, then we will know that you are into nothing, absolutely nothing, and we don't have to relate to you nor to react to you, because you are into nothing, absolutely nothing.


So, is that totality of existence which I like to use as a term to refer to everything and anything that is not absolutely nothing, is that one entity or several entities, namely, is it one entity or a collection of entities?



Please, if you want to talk about nothing, please don't bring in anything at all, just send a message with the this phrase "nothing = blank," and the rest of your message is totally blank, then I will know that you are into nothing and not into the totality of existence.

And everyone also, thus we will not waste our time with your post(s).




Ryrge
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Old 04-01-2010, 08:04 PM
 
Location: Richland, Washington
4,070 posts, read 4,966,246 times
Reputation: 2479
Quote:
Originally Posted by offthefence View Post
I just can't let this slip by.
Most believers in evolution, to this day, say we evolved from apes.
Classroom walls used to be adorned with the chart showing the progression from monkey to man.
In Darwin's own writings he made the case that we evolved from the great apes.
Ask just about anyone that believes in evolution what the "missing link" is and they will tell you it's the missing link between monkey and man.


Just for the record, to get all the christian name calling out of the way, I am not a Christian, so please, let's not go there.
The theory of evolution has changed since 1901. Modern evolutionary theory says humans and chimpanzees have a common progenitor. The missing link is a flawed term and it isn't talking about a transition between monkey and man. It also doesn't say humans came from apes. Humans are apes.
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Old 04-02-2010, 06:41 AM
 
5,463 posts, read 5,783,582 times
Reputation: 1803
Quote:
Originally Posted by offthefence View Post
I just can't let this slip by.
Most believers in evolution, to this day, say we evolved from apes.
And to go even further, we are apes, as were some of our most recent ancestors. Just like we are primates, as were some of our most recent ancestors. Just like we are mammals, and chordates, and animals, as were our recent ancestors. So what, it's just a name?
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Old 04-02-2010, 06:50 AM
 
354 posts, read 677,828 times
Reputation: 81
i guess the point of disbelief is why did the evolution stopped with humans, monkeys, cats,dogs, etc? no more evolution with the current form of human and animals as we know it?
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