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Old 03-22-2010, 12:07 PM
 
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
3,334 posts, read 5,123,429 times
Reputation: 2028

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
You people have a weird opinion of the world. And you abuse terms such as Socialism just because it is a scare word that triggers a certain reaction in certain people. On a scale from 0 (Capitalism) to 100 (Socialism), the US would be at, say, 30, Europe maybe at 35 or 40 max.
Even the US has always been more egalitarian than hard-core capitalists would like. It is simply a different form of redistribution. In the US it is soup kitchens, volunteers, etc., that help masses of people survive and limit the damage capitalists are causing. Without them the US would have long collapsed.
And there is nothing wrong with that as the people who do those things voluntarily give their time and money. The problem is when the government comes in and confiscates the property of the nation's producers via the force of law. No government has the right to do so. My Constitution is for a Congress...not a Parliament. Unfortunately, over the past 70 years, Congress has consolidated more and more power unto itself with the current bunch of "MPs" being the natural culmination of 70 years of urination upon the US Constitution.
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Old 03-22-2010, 03:03 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
19,865 posts, read 18,348,585 times
Reputation: 7965
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fullback32 View Post
And there is nothing wrong with that as the people who do those things voluntarily give their time and money. The problem is when the government comes in and confiscates the property of the nation's producers via the force of law. No government has the right to do so. My Constitution is for a Congress...not a Parliament. Unfortunately, over the past 70 years, Congress has consolidated more and more power unto itself with the current bunch of "MPs" being the natural culmination of 70 years of urination upon the US Constitution.
I disagree, the hard-core capitalists are abusing the social awareness and conscience of the volunteers just so they can continue their exploitation.

Why do people always look back to a time when, supposedly, things were better or more to their liking? Times change, who doesn't change with them will be left behind. Nothing is sacred, no Bible, no constitution... Everything should be updated regularly.
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Old 05-23-2010, 06:22 PM
 
1 posts, read 906 times
Reputation: 11
there is no bad , and no good, only TRUTH
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Old 05-23-2010, 06:50 PM
 
2,997 posts, read 2,262,740 times
Reputation: 470
there is no bad, true. but capitalism is a beast none the least.
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Old 05-24-2010, 06:09 AM
 
4,512 posts, read 6,586,217 times
Reputation: 811
must it be god's fault when the watchdogs over creativeness go from one extreme to the other?
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Old 05-24-2010, 06:33 AM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,532,141 times
Reputation: 1573
If capitalist believe that they can solve the global credit crisis by using more credit, it is indeed a sin.
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Old 05-24-2010, 08:34 AM
 
4,512 posts, read 6,586,217 times
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did you say using?
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Old 05-24-2010, 04:06 PM
 
Location: Ohio
18,077 posts, read 13,280,695 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QuixoticHobbit View Post
Nope. Merely having a trade does not make one a capitalist.
But Jesus was a capitalist.

Jesus owned his own tools (ie capital -- the means of production) and worked for himself, and not for Calvary Crosses and Cabinets, Incorporated.

Also, Jesus was not a card-carrying union member of Carpenter's Local 666.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tigetmax24
Indeed! They voluntarily sold their own possessions and gave voluntarily to each having need.

They didn't give it to the government and they weren't forced to give what the government had previously deemed to belong to all.
That's true. Christians lived in communes. To be a Christian, you gave all that you had to "community property." The communes took care of the poor, the widows, the orphans and the outcasts.

The overwhelming vast majority of Christians today, better than 90% wouldn't be Christians, because they would refuse to do as Jesus commanded and give away all they own.

Christianity changed once the idiot Constantine made it an official religion. The Christian clergy, the apostles who ministered, were exempted from taxes and from work conscription, just like the pagan clerics and it all went down-hill from there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooseketeer
Capitalism is about "me, me, me".
That is NOT capitalism, that is American Culture.

Where is Tom & Betty's hardware store, and Alice's beauty shoppe, Mike's Groceries, and Jane's Clothing Boutique?

Well, they're out of business because everyone thought that saving $0.02 was more important than patronizing non-corporate businesses that were part of the community and contributed to the community in numerous ways.

It was more, um, "convenient" to drive the fancy SUV to the shopping mall (after all, that's why the fancy SUV was needlessly purchased) and patronize the Big Corporate Hardware Store, and the Corporate Hair Salons, and the Huge Corporate Grocery Store and the Corporate Clothiers, so that people could throw their money at the stinky rich in their nice silk suits, and just giving the money away wasn't enough, they wanted to give away their hard earned money and pay interest on the money they gave away (with their credit cards and their revolving credit Home Equity Loans).

For those people who have been on unemployment for 27 weeks or more, and the "marginalized" who haven't worked in over two years, you might want to ask them how much money they really saved, and how convenient was it really to shop at the big shopping mall.
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Old 05-24-2010, 04:21 PM
 
4,512 posts, read 6,586,217 times
Reputation: 811
still, what is sinful with capitalism?

everyone has unlimited choices, yet all the CEO's were only heard whining they were driven, with no choice.

thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.

what false witness, huh?

if i am not "christian", then where are my ethics, to choose from?
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Old 05-24-2010, 04:42 PM
 
Location: North Central Ohio, to be exact :)
360 posts, read 386,931 times
Reputation: 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
But Jesus was a capitalist.

That's true. Christians lived in communes. To be a Christian, you gave all that you had to "community property." The communes took care of the poor, the widows, the orphans and the outcasts.

The overwhelming vast majority of Christians today, better than 90% wouldn't be Christians, because they would refuse to do as Jesus commanded and give away all they own.

Christianity changed once the idiot Constantine made it an official religion. The Christian clergy, the apostles who ministered, were exempted from taxes and from work conscription, just like the pagan clerics and it all went down-hill from there.
"Christianity"? What's that?

Christianity consists of over 30,000 denominations, none of which are exactly the same. The only thing all Christian religions have in common is that they all teach Jesus is your savior.

Talking of Christianity in the way you talk of it is impossible, because which Christians live in communes? Furthermore, which denomination taught you needed to give away all of your belongings? Perhaps you could enlighten us on that by being a little more specific?

Not everyone in this forum knows exactly what you mean. They may read your argument and believe that all Christianity is the same. The thing is, it isn't. There's really no such "religion" as Christianity; it's way too broad and diverse to be a formal religion.
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