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View Poll Results: What kind of Christian would Jesus be?
Catholic 2 4.88%
Baptist 1 2.44%
Pentecostal 1 2.44%
Evangelical 4 9.76%
Eastern Orthodox 0 0%
Oriental Orthodox 0 0%
Anglican 2 4.88%
Mormon 3 7.32%
Presbyterian 0 0%
Other 28 68.29%
Voters: 41. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-29-2010, 03:59 PM
Status: "Build the damn wall!" (set 6 days ago)
 
Location: The Haunted Mansion
15,140 posts, read 8,226,063 times
Reputation: 1544

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Quote:
Originally Posted by tongpa-nyi View Post
jimmiej:Your comment is consistent with my assertion that Jesus would not be a member of a particular church. As you seem to imply, "the Church" is not a particular denomination or set of beliefs or a building that houses a Christian community. It is a metaphor for the collective practitioners of The Way, or (to use Buddhist terminology) it is the Sangha (community of those who practice the Dharma.)

While I don't hold your beliefs, it's at least refreshing to see that you understand what you believe and have a consistent perspective about it.
The Church consists of all those who believe & accept Christ's redemptive work on the cross.

 
Old 03-29-2010, 05:07 PM
 
701 posts, read 658,148 times
Reputation: 128
Quote:
Originally Posted by tongpa-nyi View Post
Didn't the Romans actually start Christianity as we know it today? They chose which transcriptions of oral accounts about Jesus would be included in the Bible. Those decisions were political in nature. The Gnostic gospels were excluded because they advocated individual contemplation and revelation rather than obedience to a higher authority (God or the Roman Empire.)

The entire notion of Jesus being a member of a Christian church is ludicrous. Everything he taught was antithetical to what has been done in his name.

It's funny you mention that because I feel it is one of the things that speaks to the divine preservation of the scriptures. The RCC was responsible for canonizing scripture, and because of this, they were left in quite a quandary when the protest reformation start to unlock the secrets of Daniel and Revelation, which point to the RCC, as the Antichrist/Beast power, mentioned in the two books. They were stuck because they knew they could not undo what they had canonized.

As to your second statement. Do not forget countless kind acts have also been done in the name of Christ. Christ himself said there would be many "false christ's". those that waged war and persecuted innocent people in the "name of Christ" were not following the message Christ brought, but many have traveled the world over seeking to bring healing to the sick, food to the hungary, and clothes to the poor. that is the Christian church Christ could be a part of.
 
Old 03-29-2010, 07:02 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,296,261 times
Reputation: 806
Quote:
Originally Posted by shibata View Post
History? Show me a scholar who believed this before Bill Gates made his name. The notion that Paul started Christianity would almost certainly never have got off the ground but for the internet- and the vast multitude of liars who flock to it.

At least, that's my opinion. If someone can provide evidence that Paul started Christianity, and I have never seen even an attempt to provide that evidence, I am willing to admit I could be wrong.
Your kidding right?? Paul really did change the early Christian church... He preached to the gentiles. He moved the early christians away from the Jewish law and circumcision. Iit is not about the Internet its about early church history. What the heck does Bill Gates have to do with it???

Why is it that Christians have such a hard time acknowledging the truth of the early church much less who Jesus really was? A Jew...... A practicing Jew...... Paul was the guy who brought Christianity to the multitudes of gentiles... Not Jesus.
 
Old 03-29-2010, 07:09 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,296,261 times
Reputation: 806
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmiej View Post
The Apostle Thomas called Jesus God when he saw Him after the resurrection (John 20) & Peter said He was the Messiah (Mark 8).

God did ask Abraham to sacrifice his son. When Abraham obeyed God, He (God) provided a substitute.

You are correct in that we are responsible for our sins, but there is nothing we can do on our own to make ourselves righteous. That is the work of the Messiah (Isaiah 53).

The prophet Isaiah prophesied that the Messiah would be sacrificed (Isaiah 53).
Your twisting the Hebrew scripture to fit what you as a Christian believe..... Isaiah was speaking to the Jewish people and not about a future messiah...

Who knows what would have happened with Abraham? Would he absolutely have killed his son? Or was he testing G-d?? Or was G-d teaching us that human sacrifice is not ok because at that time human sacrifice was a reality.

Those are the questions and in Judaism we ponder them. Do we know what absolutely would have happened? NO we don't we only know that it was stopped at the point of sacrifice with a lamb being offered.

I can question this and not have my faith be destroyed.
 
Old 03-29-2010, 07:31 PM
Status: "Build the damn wall!" (set 6 days ago)
 
Location: The Haunted Mansion
15,140 posts, read 8,226,063 times
Reputation: 1544
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
Your kidding right?? Paul really did change the early Christian church... He preached to the gentiles. He moved the early christians away from the Jewish law and circumcision. Iit is not about the Internet its about early church history. What the heck does Bill Gates have to do with it???

Why is it that Christians have such a hard time acknowledging the truth of the early church much less who Jesus really was? A Jew...... A practicing Jew...... Paul was the guy who brought Christianity to the multitudes of gentiles... Not Jesus.
Did not Peter preach Jesus crucified as the way to salvation (Acts 2)? Paul preached the same thing. They were both Jews. Paul was accepted by Peter & the other apostles (Galatians 2). Peter associated with the Gentile Christians.

In addition, Jesus said this:

John 10

14"I am the good shepherd; I know my sheep and my sheep know me— 15just as the Father knows me and I know the Father—and I lay down my life for the sheep. 16I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd. 17The reason my Father loves me is that I lay down my life—only to take it up again. 18No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have authority to lay it down and authority to take it up again. This command I received from my Father."

These were not Jews, but Gentiles who would soon be called to him. These would hear his voice, enter through the door, into the same fold as the Jewish Christians, so that there would be "one fold and one shepherd." There is only one Church and one door into it, and one Shepherd over it.
 
Old 03-29-2010, 07:32 PM
Status: "Build the damn wall!" (set 6 days ago)
 
Location: The Haunted Mansion
15,140 posts, read 8,226,063 times
Reputation: 1544
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
Your twisting the Hebrew scripture to fit what you as a Christian believe..... Isaiah was speaking to the Jewish people and not about a future messiah...
IA, he was speaking to the Jews, but if not about a future Messiah, them what? What is this passage about?
 
Old 03-29-2010, 09:06 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX
680 posts, read 1,167,184 times
Reputation: 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by HalfNelson View Post
Do not forget countless kind acts have also been done in the name of Christ. Christ himself said there would be many "false christ's". those that waged war and persecuted innocent people in the "name of Christ" were not following the message Christ brought, but many have traveled the world over seeking to bring healing to the sick, food to the hungary, and clothes to the poor. that is the Christian church Christ could be a part of.
Yes, it's only fair to point out the good with the bad, you're quite right.

For everyone who sets a positive example for the rest of humanity, there are countless frauds committing atrocities in that person's name but there are also many good people who are inspired to follow the path of light that heals divisions and liberates people from suffering.
 
Old 03-30-2010, 04:13 AM
 
1,243 posts, read 1,315,399 times
Reputation: 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
Your kidding right?? Paul really did change the early Christian church.
Indeed. But this is about who started it.
 
Old 03-30-2010, 10:06 AM
 
Location: Brooklyn
40,057 posts, read 29,713,783 times
Reputation: 10450
Quote:
Originally Posted by shibata View Post
Indeed. But this is about who started it.
Wrong-o. Go back and check the OP. It's about what sect of Christianity Jesus would follow. And the correct answer remains...none. Because Jesus wasn't a Christian, and wasn't trying to establish a new religion.
 
Old 03-30-2010, 10:25 AM
 
1,243 posts, read 1,315,399 times
Reputation: 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred314X View Post
Wrong-o.
'Not only didn't he want to start a new religion...he didn't. The whole thing came about through the influence of Paul, years after Jesus' death. If there was any accuracy about the thing, it would be called Paulism and not Christianity.'
Fred314X, post #122.
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