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Old 06-06-2007, 02:27 AM
 
Location: Anywhere but here!
2,800 posts, read 9,059,288 times
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Ok, this question is bugging me since participating in another post. I am not trying to stir controversy or judge anyone or be mean or anything of the like. I am really just curious of what other's ideas on this are

I can understand Atheists not believing in God. I can even understand Agnostics and not being sure if they believe or not. I can even kind of understand Budaism, but I consider it more of a practice than a religion...don't beat me up on that, but that is just MY opinion because there is no God.
What I do NOT understand is how anyone can be any kind of religion without believing in at least SOME sort of a god...even if it isn't the God of our creation.

Don't all "relilgions" have some sort of god as their basis? Muslims believe in God, Catholics/Christians (don't want anyone to think that I don't consider Catholics Christians ), and don't Jews ALSO believe in God? Isn't it a given?

What are your thoughts?
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Old 06-06-2007, 02:39 AM
 
Location: Milwaukee
45 posts, read 130,498 times
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I'm not trying to be mean but from what i have learned about Judaism it is a Religion that is based more on living life by the commandments, and doing good deeds than personal faith in God (to be a "good Jew" isn't determined by how much you are certain that God exists. No human can believe 100% in something that is not tangible), but i'm not saying that Jews don't believe in God. They do.

Maybe i am wrong. I can only speak from what i have read and been taught.
I'm sorry if you don't see my point of view.
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Old 06-06-2007, 03:04 AM
 
Location: Anywhere but here!
2,800 posts, read 9,059,288 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JessD View Post
I'm not trying to be mean but from what i have learned about Judaism it is a Religion that is based more on living life by the commandments, and doing good deeds than personal faith in God (to be a "good Jew" isn't determined by how much you are certain that God exists. No human can believe 100% in something that is not tangible), but i'm not saying that Jews don't believe in God. They do.

Maybe i am wrong. I can only speak from what i have read and been taught.
I'm sorry if you don't see my point of view.
I'm not trying to come off as offensive. Please do not miscontrue my thread or responses. I'm just curious now

I understand that the Jews try to live by the Commandments, but so do so many other religions. Even a lot of Atheists try to live by the Commandments because they are indeed "good moral values" even if they do not believe in God.
But my confusion sets in when you talk about converting to a religion, but are not wanting to conform to believing in their God. It sounds like you just want to live BY the "rules" of the religion and participate in their rituals, and not FOLLOW what the religion is based on...which is God. No matter how you look at it...God is at the CORE of Judaism...If there was no God, there would be no Judaism. If there was no God there would be no Ten Commandments. If there was no God we wouldn't even need to have this discussion because we would have stopped at just trying to live a moral life and not bother with trying to convert to any religion...does that make sense?

I have posted this thought on another thread but I will again so you can see where I am coming from...
I have heard of Christians "converting" to Judaism. My problem with that is this: Ok, if one day you suddenly decide you do not believe in Jesus and His deity anymore...Ok, I can understand converting to Judaism...you still believe in God, but you do not believe in Jesus...understood.
BUT, how can one simply convert from being a Christian to a Jew just because they are marrying a Jew and trying to please him/her or his/her family? Either you believe in Jesus and His deity or you don't...It's as simple as that! So by converting to being a Jew, you would either be betraying the family by pretending to be Jewish while you still believe in Jesus as being the one and only Son of God that was sent to die for us...OR you are betraying Jesus and DENYING HIM just so that you can marry someone...either way, it just doesn't seem right!

Now, if you want to become Jewish...OK GREAT! That's a step that you at least believe in GOD! But you MUST believe in God to really be a Jew...I really do not think there are any Atheistic Jews! Either you believe in God, or you don't...again, it's as simple as that!
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Old 06-06-2007, 04:38 AM
 
Location: The Silver State (from the UK)
4,663 posts, read 7,083,686 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kawgpz550 View Post
Ok, this question is bugging me since participating in another post. I am not trying to stir controversy or judge anyone or be mean or anything of the like. I am really just curious of what other's ideas on this are

I can understand Atheists not believing in God. I can even understand Agnostics and not being sure if they believe or not. I can even kind of understand Budaism, but I consider it more of a practice than a religion...don't beat me up on that, but that is just MY opinion because there is no God.
What I do NOT understand is how anyone can be any kind of religion without believing in at least SOME sort of a god...even if it isn't the God of our creation.

Don't all "relilgions" have some sort of god as their basis? Muslims believe in God, Catholics/Christians (don't want anyone to think that I don't consider Catholics Christians ), and don't Jews ALSO believe in God? Isn't it a given?

What are your thoughts?
The definition of a religion holds that a mythical deity is involved i.e a God. Religion is thought of as a belief in a supreme being to whom one prays for redemption, security, favors or relief from suffering, therfore Buddhism for example, is not technically a religion.
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Old 06-06-2007, 05:55 AM
 
646 posts, read 1,478,586 times
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I think that a lot of people believe in a generic god, but also feel that all religions are equally valid ways of relating to that god. They don't get too hung up on the particulars, feeling that worship and the church environment are good enough.

Obviously a lot of christians on this site would not consider these people true believers, but that is a different story.

So for your example of people converting to judaism for their spouse, I can see it. Some guy has a fuzzy feeling that some sort of divine being exists. Jews have a theology, and a place to go, and a set of rules. God is forgiving, so even if the jews don't have it exactly right, he will still get to go to heaven, if there is one. So why not convert? It makes his wife to be happy, means that he has to go to temple once in a while on Saturdays vs church occasionaly on Sundays. No big deal.
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Old 06-06-2007, 06:18 AM
 
Location: NJ
279 posts, read 1,240,427 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ian6479 View Post
The definition of a religion holds that a mythical deity is involved i.e a God. Religion is thought of as a belief in a supreme being to whom one prays for redemption, security, favors or relief from suffering, therfore Buddhism for example, is not technically a religion.
They believe in Buddha..isn't that their God?

And disagree that religion means you have to have relief from suffering..I think that only applies to the Christian religion....I don't know if other religions, there needs to be that component. In Christianity, Jesus suffered for his followers so therefore, suffering and sacrificing is a huge component of that particular religion...not sure if it is applicable to all the other religions in the world.
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Old 06-06-2007, 07:17 AM
 
1,703 posts, read 4,605,597 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stretch00 View Post
So why not convert? It makes his wife to be happy, means that he has to go to temple once in a while on Saturdays vs church occasionaly on Sundays. No big deal.
Yes it is a big deal a very big deal If that person is Christian.
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Old 06-06-2007, 07:25 AM
 
1,703 posts, read 4,605,597 times
Reputation: 1093
Quote:
Originally Posted by kawgpz550 View Post
But my confusion sets in when you talk about converting to a religion, but are not wanting to conform to believing in their God. It sounds like you just want to live BY the "rules" of the religion and participate in their rituals, and not FOLLOW what the religion is based on...which is God. No matter how you look at it...God is at the CORE of Judaism...If there was no God, there would be no Judaism. If there was no God there would be no Ten Commandments. If there was no God we wouldn't even need to have this discussion because we would have stopped at just trying to live a moral life and not bother with trying to convert to any religion...does that make sense?

I have posted this thought on another thread but I will again so you can see where I am coming from...
I have heard of Christians "converting" to Judaism. My problem with that is this: Ok, if one day you suddenly decide you do not believe in Jesus and His deity anymore...Ok, I can understand converting to Judaism...you still believe in God, but you do not believe in Jesus...understood.
BUT, how can one simply convert from being a Christian to a Jew just because they are marrying a Jew and trying to please him/her or his/her family? Either you believe in Jesus and His deity or you don't...It's as simple as that! So by converting to being a Jew, you would either be betraying the family by pretending to be Jewish while you still believe in Jesus as being the one and only Son of God that was sent to die for us...OR you are betraying Jesus and DENYING HIM just so that you can marry someone...either way, it just doesn't seem right!

Now, if you want to become Jewish...OK GREAT! That's a step that you at least believe in GOD! But you MUST believe in God to really be a Jew...I really do not think there are any Atheistic Jews! Either you believe in God, or you don't...again, it's as simple as that!
This is a good question kawpgz. Unfortunately I think there are far too many people that do not take their religion seriously at all and don't really care what religion they belong to. I think many people are born into a religion and just stay that way either because of apathy or to try to appease parents. It's sad how many Sunday Christians there are. Well not even Sunday but like twice a year!
What you said reminds me of (now don't laugh) a little house of the prairie episode where Nellie (a Christian) marrys Percival (a jew). They had twins and declared the boy to be a jew and the girl to be a Christian. How retarded!!
I am just as confused as you are kawpgz!
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Old 06-06-2007, 07:28 AM
 
Location: Bronx, NY
1,313 posts, read 2,715,242 times
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I found a site that lists some of the worlds' major religions. They have it broken down to percentages, when they were founded, texts they use, places of worship, etc. Keep in mind though that the statistics are 7 years old. They also include links to pages that describe what or who they believe in.

Religions of the world: numbers of adherents; growth rates
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Old 06-06-2007, 07:32 AM
 
Location: Pikeville, Ky.
13,446 posts, read 21,089,834 times
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Kaw, I think the word religion means a group of people or a society who all have the same belief, whether it is worshipping the God that most of us worship,or a stone statue,(their god) or whoever their leader is.In that case,god is anything they consider worthy of worship.
Our religion is based on God who created the world, the universe and everything in it and mankind Some groups have different rituals, and different ways of worshipping God, and may base their worship of God on specific parts of the bible. Bottom line is that they ALL believe in the same God! Why they canl't get along is another topic.






god and have different books to help them understand God.
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