U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 04-02-2010, 09:01 AM
 
Location: Earth, Milky Way
290 posts, read 332,281 times
Reputation: 128

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by teagal View Post
He put us here to save us!
Why do you say God put is here to be saved, if we were created by God (assuming a theistic position)?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 04-02-2010, 12:58 PM
 
6,221 posts, read 6,409,710 times
Reputation: 682
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafius View Post
Yep, you were right sparrow. It is a long post . But I think it can be covered by just answering the following.
...and the answer is.....exactly the same way in which Logoman said it is going to be done in his heaven. So in effect, the question still stands. If in heaven we will have the knowledge of sin without having to directly experience sin, why couldn't that be the situation here and now? If you are saying that we cant know something without actually experiencing it then that must also apply in your heaven...or am I missing something?

So how is it going to be done in your heaven? You appear to agree with Legoman when he says that in his heaven we won't have to have the experience of something in order to get the knowledge of it. I don't understand why your god is perfectly capable of giving the knowledge of something without having to experience it in one place but not in another.
Just a "short" answer here Rafius:

In order to know something, we must experience it. Once we have experienced it (at least once), we know it. So we don't have to keep experiencing it over and over to continue to know it, which is what it seems you are implying.

When in heaven, we won't experience evil any more, but we will still know and understand what it is because of our previous experiences here and now.

Gotta run for now...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-02-2010, 01:37 PM
 
5,739 posts, read 4,587,463 times
Reputation: 4161
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafius View Post
Logoman
Logs? Man, forget legos... I want to see someone build a deathstar out of logs. lol... I can't count how many times I've typed logoman instead of legoman.

Hey rafius and SpidrAkirE,
yay. thanks for asking good questions. This is all part of the stuff that I think about too. and what about babies who died? What about them? They didn't really experience ANYTHING. I know what you're saying and I'll be back on tonight so I can be in late-night mode. This kind of stuff, I gotta be in late-night mode so people (in my house) don't interrupt my thought process. It's a bit more abstract, and it's hard to put into words. I'll try to cut down on the rambliness.

ramble, I mean talk at ya later,
sparrow
Have a blobby day!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-02-2010, 02:47 PM
 
Location: Metromess
11,798 posts, read 21,366,178 times
Reputation: 5054
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
In order to know something, we must experience it...
Or find out about it from a CREDIBLE source.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-02-2010, 02:57 PM
 
Location: Southeast
175 posts, read 527,703 times
Reputation: 154
God does not exist. It's very simple.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-03-2010, 02:29 AM
 
5,739 posts, read 4,587,463 times
Reputation: 4161
All right. In case you guys are still following the discussion, (which I hope you are) I'm not a slacker... but it's 3:30 in the morning and I got distracted with something else on the other forum. I'll be back at some point later. This is such a good conversation. But now I'm all rambled out. Be back soon during my next night-time mode.
peace.
sparrow.
(slacker blob)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-03-2010, 04:10 AM
 
Location: Earth, Milky Way
290 posts, read 332,281 times
Reputation: 128
Haha Hurry back sparrow! Our conversation has stalled...we're waiting for You!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-03-2010, 02:17 PM
 
Location: Valencia, Spain
13,904 posts, read 9,668,418 times
Reputation: 2403
Quote:
Originally Posted by .sparrow. View Post
All right. In case you guys are still following the discussion, (which I hope you are) I'm not a slacker... but it's 3:30 in the morning ......
Dirty 'stop-out'.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-05-2010, 11:37 PM
 
5,739 posts, read 4,587,463 times
Reputation: 4161
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafius View Post
Dirty 'stop-out'.

I had to google that, I had no idea what the heck you were talking about.

Then I started thinking, well maybe I'm just getting old. And I don't understand all this new-fangled slang. Which gave me a picture in my head of me as June Cleaver sitting on the couch trying to figure out what the heck is going on with Wally's new-fangled hair:



YouTube - Leave It To Beaver Wally's Haircomb (Clips)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-06-2010, 12:12 AM
 
5,739 posts, read 4,587,463 times
Reputation: 4161
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafius View Post
Yep, you were right sparrow. It is a long post . But I think it can be covered by just answering the following.
...and the answer is.....exactly the same way in which Logoman said it is going to be done in his heaven. So in effect, the question still stands. If in heaven we will have the knowledge of sin without having to directly experience sin, why couldn't that be the situation here and now? If you are saying that we cant know something without actually experiencing it then that must also apply in your heaven...or am I missing something?
Well, ok.. so you're sort of saying why couldn't God have just put on a puppet show to help us understand the difference between good and evil? (or as I see it good = love, evil = non-love) instead of making us actually EXPERIENCE it? Like, why couldn't we have just watched a movie or something about it? Because I just don't think we wouldn't understand what we were seeing. We wouldn't FEEL it, more importantly. Let me think about this a little more, so I can explain what I mean. It's on the tip of my tongue, but I can't quite get it into words. I'll come back to this. (I will.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafius View Post
So how is it going to be done in your heaven? You appear to agree with Legoman when he says that in his heaven we won't have to have the experience of something in order to get the knowledge of it. I don't understand why your god is perfectly capable of giving the knowledge of something without having to experience it in one place but not in another.
I don't really agree with that, though. I believe that we DO have to experience something in order to gain knowledge. But... we are ALL experiencing things in different ways. We don't ALL have to experience the same EXACT things, though. As a WHOLE, we're all going to learn what we need to learn. It's like we're all learning the SAME thing we came to learn (In my eyes, the main thing we need to learn is the power of LOVE and the destructive nature of NON-LOVE throught ALL of creation) but we are learning this in different ways. SAME LESSON. But different experiences. Different intensities. And every life lived... will be a testimony to the power of love/destructive nature of non-love. And we will ALL understand EACH testimony (maybe like I said that is what the books of life are) because we EACH had our OWN experience of love and non-love. So we will have a reference point. Man, the puppet show thing... I get what you are saying. I DO! But, it's like what I was saying about when you're a baby. How would we know what the puppet show WAS, how would we know what the props were, and what the figures were, and what the heck they were even saying if we first didn't learn what all of that stuff WAS in the first place? How would we even know that we were watching a puppet show if we weren't first slowly experiencing things that led up to us KNOWING that it WAS a puppet show. And what puppets were, and what the props were, etc.?

I am sober.
However I am starting to feel as if I were not.
Before this gets TOO weird... do you understand what I'm saying about the puppet show? I'm starting to feel like I'M in a puppet show right now and it's freaking me out. Maybe I just need to go eat something.

Be back later.

Again, I am ABSOLUTELY NOT trying to force you down my path. I'm not. I totally respect everyone's views. I'm just putting my viewpoint out there. Because come on, we're all human beings, and we all have different interesting perspectives to share. Sorry if I've said this before... but I'm just not into debating people in an effort to force them down my path. Other folks beliefs are their business and everyone has their own path to walk. I just like talking about stuff and sharing.

talk at ya soon..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top