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Old 05-15-2010, 02:18 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by albion View Post
I don't know how you expect your posts to be treated seriously YSM when you keep on insisting that the Sun revolves around the Earth, you need serious help.
Firstly, it is flaming me to say I "need serious help", and that is against the rules for posting on this forum.
Secondly, it is God who says that the sun goes around the earth and that the earth is fixed in place.

I believe in a geocentric, geostatic earth because the Word of God teaches us that is what He made it to be. Science has not and cannot prove that the earth goes around the sun, for all the data work, for the way God said it is, from the beginning of creation.
Quote:

geocentrism.com GWW

Catholic Apologetics International - Robert Sungenis (http://www.catholicintl.com/oldgeo/gibbson.htm - broken link)
Robert Sungenis:...Contrary to Einstein's reluctance to accept an aether-based universe, its existence was proven by Sagnac (1913), Michelson-Gale (1925), Dalton Miller (1933) and Herbert Ives (1943).

... But you must realize that Einstein's theory of Relativity was actually a scientific apology for the fact that the Michelson-Morley experiment of 1887 found that the earth was standing still in space. Einstein's biographer says as much...
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Old 05-16-2010, 12:09 AM
 
1,220 posts, read 781,074 times
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Default The Prophet

With fainting soul athirst for Grace,
I wandered in a desert place
And at the crossing of the ways
I saw the sixfold seraph blaze;
He touched mine eyes with fingers light
as sleep that cometh in the night:
And like a frightened eagle's eyes
They opened wide with prophecies.
He touched mine ears, and they were drowned
With tumult and a roaring sound:
I heard convulsion in the sky,
And flights of angel hosts on high,
And beasts that move beneath the sea,
And the sap creeping in the tree.
Then bending to my mouth he wrung
From out of it my sinful tongue,
With all its lies and idle rust,
And twixt my lips a-perishing
A subtle serpent's forked sting
With right hand wet with blood he thrust.
And with his sword my breast he cleft
My quaking heart thereout he reft,
And in the yawning of my breast
A coal of living fire therein he pressed.
Then in the desert I lay dead,
And God called unto me and said:
'Arise, and let my voice be heard,
Charged with my will go forth and span
The land and sea, and let my word
Lay waste with fire the heart of man.'

A.S. Pushkin
tr. Maurice Baring in
Have You Anything to Declare? (Heinemann 1936)
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Old 05-16-2010, 05:05 AM
 
Location: Went around the corner & now I'm lost!!!!
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D Mc Clellan, what would be a good website to go to find and read these various lost writings? I would to read these books for my own personal spiritual growth. Thanks in advance.
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Old 05-16-2010, 02:19 PM
 
Location: Oxford, England
1,266 posts, read 987,417 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eyewrist View Post
D Mc Clellan, what would be a good website to go to find and read these various lost writings? I would to read these books for my own personal spiritual growth. Thanks in advance.
As far as websites go, earlyjewishwritings.com has a great deal of the deuterocanonical and pseudepigraphical books, as well as Josephus, Philo, and a link to some Dead Sea Scrolls texts. There is also an earlychristianwritings.com that has similar apocryphal and pseudepigraphical Christians texts.
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Old 05-16-2010, 05:55 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel O. McClellan View Post
A bit of rhetoric (Ps 90:4; 1 Pe 3:8) that states that a thousand years are like a day to him does not mean that God "computes weeks of thousand year days." It's just rhetoric.
The ancient Jewish writings, and Enoch teach a "week" of seven thousand year days for this present creation, before the regeneration of the heavens and the earth.
God numbers years and days different ways for different purposes. He has the seven, 24 hour day week, and the Jubilee year of seven weeks of years with the 50th a Jubilee year, and He has declared that this creation has 140 Jubilee years before the regeneration of the heavens and the earth [7,000 years].
Before the flood, He gave the population 120 years of 364, 24 hour days to repent, and He stated that the Adam spirit [our spirit -the nature of Adam that we all have our share of when we come into our being, as the seed of Adam] will remain before His face, on earth, for 120 [Jubilee] years [6,000 years of 364 days each] from the time that He sent Noah and Methusaleh to preach righteousness, pre-flood.

He also gave the descendants of AbraHAm the sign of the Adam spirit being cut off in the 8th day of creation, to wear in their flesh, as that prophetic sign, from the 8th day of their coming into their being,

The "Eighth Day" is the "New Beginning", as typed in the sign of the "8th day" celebration, after the seven day Feast of Tabernacles, in the Law given to the namesake people of the New Man name, to rehearse, once yarly until it is fulfilled.

In Ezekiel 47, He measures a thousand years as a cubit each, showing that the Living Spirit- "Christ"- depicted/typed as a "River of Life" flowing out from the throne room for the Millennial reign, was so deep and wide after the fourth thousand cubit that a man could not cross over, nor measure. Christ came in flesh, at the end of the fourth thousand year days, and atoned for Adam's transgression, so that whosoever "will" may become joined to that Living Spirit by adoption. For that reason, the parable/sign of the four thousand cubits of Ezekiel's river, flowing out from beneath the throne room, is the coming in flesh of the Christ, after four thousand years of this present creation.


God's "years" are cycles, and they are like wheels, within wheels, within wheels.
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Old 05-16-2010, 05:57 PM
 
2,981 posts, read 4,464,827 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel O. McClellan View Post
As far as websites go, earlyjewishwritings.com has a great deal of the deuterocanonical and pseudepigraphical books, as well as Josephus, Philo, and a link to some Dead Sea Scrolls texts. There is also an earlychristianwritings.com that has similar apocryphal and pseudepigraphical Christians texts.
Welcome to the Christian Classics Ethereal Library! | Christian Classics Ethereal Library, also.
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Old 05-17-2010, 02:12 AM
 
1,220 posts, read 781,074 times
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Default The Truth

If geocentric, one must bear in mind that it is physically impossible to prove that the earth is not in motion. One can only rely on the plain text of scripture...the sun rises, and the sun sets. No where does God's written word intimate or directly say that the earth is in motion. On the other hand, if heliocentric, it is physically impossible to prove that the earth is in motion around the sun. Scripture is on the heliocentric view that the earth rises or sets. This much however should be considered...if according to the Bible Jerusalem is the navel of the earth, a geocentric earth in the universe makes scriptural sense. While YSM is in our opinion scripturally incorrect about a number of doctrinal viewpoints, it's not necessary for any one to insult her...she is to be loved as Jesus loves you.
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Old 05-17-2010, 03:51 AM
 
Location: Oxford, England
1,266 posts, read 987,417 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yeshuasavedme View Post
The ancient Jewish writings, and Enoch teach a "week" of seven thousand year days for this present creation, before the regeneration of the heavens and the earth.
Like I said, this is just rhetoric.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yeshuasavedme View Post
God numbers years and days different ways for different purposes. He has the seven, 24 hour day week, and the Jubilee year of seven weeks of years with the 50th a Jubilee year, and He has declared that this creation has 140 Jubilee years before the regeneration of the heavens and the earth [7,000 years]. Before the flood, He gave the population 120 years of 364, 24 hour days to repent,
There are several interpretations of Gen 6:3, and yours isn't the most widely accepted.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yeshuasavedme View Post
and He stated that the Adam spirit [our spirit -the nature of Adam that we all have our share of when we come into our being, as the seed of Adam] will remain before His face, on earth, for 120 [Jubilee] years [6,000 years of 364 days each] from the time that He sent Noah and Methusaleh to preach righteousness, pre-flood.
Or it can mean he has limited the lifespan of humans. Both interpretations have problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yeshuasavedme View Post
He also gave the descendants of AbraHAm the sign of the Adam spirit being cut off in the 8th day of creation, to wear in their flesh, as that prophetic sign, from the 8th day of their coming into their being,

The "Eighth Day" is the "New Beginning", as typed in the sign of the "8th day" celebration, after the seven day Feast of Tabernacles, in the Law given to the namesake people of the New Man name, to rehearse, once yarly until it is fulfilled.
This is rather cooky exegesis.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yeshuasavedme View Post
In Ezekiel 47, He measures a thousand years as a cubit each, showing that the Living Spirit- "Christ"- depicted/typed as a "River of Life" flowing out from the throne room for the Millennial reign, was so deep and wide after the fourth thousand cubit that a man could not cross over, nor measure. Christ came in flesh, at the end of the fourth thousand year days, and atoned for Adam's transgression, so that whosoever "will" may become joined to that Living Spirit by adoption. For that reason, the parable/sign of the four thousand cubits of Ezekiel's river, flowing out from beneath the throne room, is the coming in flesh of the Christ, after four thousand years of this present creation.

God's "years" are cycles, and they are like wheels, within wheels, within wheels.
This not only retrojects mystical readings into texts that have nothing to do with mysticism, but it presupposes a univocal biblical text, which is one of the most egregious of hermeneutical fallacies.
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Old 05-17-2010, 08:39 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel O. McClellan View Post


Or it can mean he has limited the lifespan of humans. Both interpretations have problems.
That YHWH gave the race of Adam one hundred twenty years to repent, before He sent the flood, through the preaching of Noah and Methusaleh, is not an "interpretation"; it is just plain fact of what is written.


Quote:
Jasher 5:
  1. And it was in the eighty-fourth year of the life of Noah, that Enoch the son of Seth died, he was nine hundred and five years old at his death.
  2. And in the one hundred and seventy ninth year of the life of Noah, Cainan the son of Enosh died, and all the days of Cainan were nine hundred and ten years, and he died.
  3. And in the two hundred and thirty fourth year of the life of Noah, Mahlallel the son of Cainan died, and the days of Mahlallel were eight hundred and ninety-five years, and he died.
  4. And Jared the son of Mahlallel died in those days, in the three hundred and thirty-sixth year of the life of Noah; and all the days of Jared were nine hundred and sixty-two years, and he died.
  5. And all who followed the Lord died in those days, before they saw the evil which God declared to do upon earth.
  6. And after the lapse of many years, in the four hundred and eightieth year of the life of Noah, when all those men, who followed the Lord had died away from amongst the sons of men, and only Methuselah was then left, God said unto Noah and Methuselah, saying,
  7. Speak ye, and proclaim to the sons of men, saying, Thus saith the Lord, return from your evil ways and forsake your works, and the Lord will repent of the evil that he declared to do to you, so that it shall not come to pass.
  8. For thus saith the Lord, Behold I give you a period of one hundred and twenty years; if you will turn to me and forsake your evil ways, then will I also turn away from the evil which I told you, and it shall not exist, saith the Lord.
  9. And Noah and Methuselah spoke all the words of the Lord to the sons of men, day after day, constantly speaking to them.
  10. But the sons of men would not hearken to them, nor incline their ears to their words, and they were stiffnecked.
  11. And the Lord granted them a period of one hundred and twenty years, saying, If they will return, then will God repent of the evil, so as not to destroy the earth.
And the 120 years granted were also a wisdom parable, with dual meaning, for 120 Jubilee years for the Adam spirit to continue before His Spirit and face, on the earth.
Quote:
Job 11:6 And that he would shew thee the secrets of wisdom, that [they are] double to that which is!
The doubling of the words of prophecy spoken by God's prophets is a theme well known and understood and applied to that which is spoken, by all scribes who serve to expound the Word of God, and that includes the NT authors, who doubly apply that which is written to that which is, speaking by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.

God will not always strive with the Adam spirit, and his "days" are numbered at 120 [Jubilee] years [6 millenniums], from the time of the beginning of the preaching of Noah and Methusaleh.
The eighth day is the theme of the New Beginning, the regeneration of the heavens and the earth, which God gave the oracle of, in the "Eighth day" celebration, to be observed until its fulfillment, after the seven day Feast of Tabernacles.
The oracle of the Adam seed cut off in the eighth day [120 Jubilees from the time Noah began preaching] is the sign of circumcision given to the male offspring of AbraHAm, to wear in their flesh as that oracle, from the eighth day of their coming into their being.
```

YHWH Elohym has shortened and diminished the lives of the Adam seed, beginning from the days of Yoktan, after the fall of the tower of Babel. From the days of Yoktan's birth, the Adam seed began to die at much younger ages than those born before the flood, and that shortening/diminishing began then, and settled to what it has been since Moses wrote that we our days are numbered at threescore and ten, but that if we live more they are only years beset with trouble. -Moses himself lived to 120 and is still living in his resurrected mortal body, in Mount Zion above, with Elijah, and they two are those mortals who witnessed Christ's glory as the Son of Man come in flesh, and will return after the Church is taken out of the midst of the world, to preach Christ Jesus in the streets of Jerusalem for three and a half years.


Jasher 7:19 These are the generations of Shem; Shem begat Arpachshad and Arpachshad begat Shelach, and Shelach begat Eber and to Eber were born two children, the name of one was Peleg, for in his days the sons of men were divided, and in the latter days, the earth was divided.
And the name of the second was Yoktan, meaning that in his day the lives of the sons of men were diminished and lessened.

Last edited by yeshuasavedme; 05-17-2010 at 08:54 AM..
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Old 05-17-2010, 09:07 AM
 
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There are also cycles of 700 year weeks, in God's cycles.
1 Enoch
92 The book written by Enoch- Enoch indeed wrote this complete doctrine of wisdom, which is praised of all men and a judge of all the earth for all my children who shall dwell on the earth. And for the future generations who shall observe uprightness and peace.
2Let not your spirit be troubled on account of the times;
For the Holy and Great One has appointed days for all things....

93 And after that Enoch both gave and began to recount from the books. 2And Enoch said:
"Concerning the children of righteousness and concerning the elect of the world,
And concerning the plant of uprightness, I will speak these things,
Yea, I Enoch will declare them unto you, my sons:
"According to that which appeared to me in the heavenly vision,
And which I have known through the word of the holy angels,
And have learnt from the heavenly tablets."
3And Enoch began to recount from the books and said:
"I was born the seventh in the first week,

While judgement and righteousness still endured. 4"And after me there shall arise in the second week great wickedness,
And deceit shall have sprung up;
And in it there shall be the first end. [the flood]
"And in it a man shall be saved; [Noah]
And after it is ended unrighteousness shall grow up,
And a law shall be made for the sinners.
5"And after that in the third week at its close
A man shall be elected as the plant of righteous judgement, [Abraham]

And his posterity shall become the plant of righteousness for evermore.

6"And after that in the fourth week, at its close,
Visions of the holy and righteous shall be seen,
And a law for all generations and an enclosure shall be made for them. [Moses, the Law and the Tabernacle]

7"And after that in the fifth week, at its close,
The house of glory and dominion shall be built for ever. [Solomon's temple, the "close" was 3,500 years after creation]



8"And after that in the sixth week all who live in it shall be blinded,
And the hearts of all of them shall godlessly forsake wisdom.
"And in it a man shall ascend; [Elijah]
And at its close the house of dominion shall be burnt with fire, [the "close" was 4,200 years after creation]
And the whole race of the chosen root shall be dispersed. [first diaspora]...


9"And after that in the seventh week shall an apostate generation arise,
And many shall be its deeds,
And all its deeds shall be apostate.
10"And at its close shall be elected The elect righteous of the eternal plant of righteousness,
To receive sevenfold instruction concerning all His creation.
Now it gets tricky. the cycles actually change their order from here on out, which I cannot go into, because it is not yet all understood.

Last edited by yeshuasavedme; 05-17-2010 at 09:37 AM..
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