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Is it possible to debate Christianity without the use of its sacred book? The reason I ask that question, and mind you this is just my opinion, isI believe that because Christianity's sacred book was written by Man, every story within that sacred book was written by someone and that story is that individuals opinion as to what events happened and as we all know everybody has an opinion, so I cannot see how using the Christian sacred book could be a legitimate reason for debating Christianity. I have often said that, Christianity is man-made and cultural-based, it naturally has some of the rules and taboos of that particular culture built into it. Unfortunately for some, many cultures have chosen to use the Fear of God to enforce the man-made rules of that culture. So let's see if Christianity can be debated without the use of its sacred book.
It is an interesting question you bring up. I have tried to carry on a conversation with followers of the bible using other holy books, the response I get, "I don't believe in those books so there not valid." However, if logic is applied, if one dismisses other holy books, then they would have to dismiss their own book as not be valid, but then again, logic isn't a christian strong point.
It's interesting to note that Christianity supposedly existed some 300 years before the advent of their sacred book, prior to that they were just stories about their so-called Messiah and it wasn't until the Roman Emperor Constantine consolidated all of the different Christian beliefs within his empire at the Council of Nicaea in 325 A.D. and made them swear to the Nicene Creed that their sacred book came into existence, so apparently Christianity existed at least 300 years before their sacred book came into existence. So how was Christianity debated before 325 A.D... is it that Christians simply want to ignore the fact of the beginnings of their sacred book.
Ptsum, there were a number of books left out of the bible at the Council of Nicaea, this was due to the political climate of the times, but try telling a follower of the bible this, that their book is nothing but political indoctrination via Constantine I, the Father of the Bible, so the bible wasn't written by "god" it was written by Constantine.
Ptsum, there were a number of books left out of the bible at the Council of Nicaea, this was due to the political climate of the times, but try telling a follower of the bible this, that their book is nothing but political indoctrination via Constantine I, the Father of the Bible, so the bible wasn't written by "god" it was written by Constantine.
Commissioned and censored by a pagan emperor, that's interesting to think that the Christian sacred book came into existence because of a pagan emperor, how ironic. Maybe they should be worshiping Constantine I, because without him their sacred book wouldn't exist.
Well Terry, you are pretty much onto something here. Let's keep in mind a few key points that today's church completely ignores, and thereby gets way off base.
#1: The Messiah NEVER came with the intent that a religion would be build around HIM, but rather gave ALL praise honor and glory to the Father YHVH. HE always followed and upheld every word from the original Torah. Too bad the ruling party of the Jewish Rabbinate at the time (the Pharisee's and Sadducees) didn't and chose to add to the Torah, which is why Messiah Yahshua was constantly at odds with them. They had attempted to rewrite the Torah so to speak.
#2: The Messiah AND all of HIS Talmadim (apostles) followed ALL of the Moadim (the Appointment Times of YHVH or the Holy days) which the Jews of their day observed as well. They NEVER failed to do so and NEVER did away with ANY of them. chrisianity, via the Church of Rome and pagan Emperor Constantine DID just that! They forbade christians from following ANYTHING that the Jews did, hence those things that Messiah AND HIS Talmadim did, so what the heck kind of religion is that?
#3: For those that never read the detailed accounts and Canon's listed in the Council of Nicea and Council of Leodicea, they had better get with it. Those accounts are by far the most antisemetic of all that ever came down the pike, not to mention they literally "Raped" the entire original intent and following of the Messiah literally chapter and verse. What they left behind was a paganized religion ruled by men, with doctrine written and enforced by men, and this remains today, a complete pollution and far cry of the original faith and following of the Messiah and the words HE spoke and taught from. HE and HIS Talmadim taught from the Torah pure and simple with NO man added junk. NOT the new testament.
#4: Here's the most difficult thing for christians to swallow. They think THEY have replaced Israel as the Chosen of YHVH. Got a news flash for them. It NEVER happened and it NEVER will. As it has already been abundantly stated in scripture, you are either native born or grafted into the commonwealth of Israel or you are NOT a part of the covenant with YHVH, and you will NOT be going through one of those 12 gates named for the Tribes of Israel stated in Revelation 22. I could go on till the cows come home, but I'll leave it at this.
Do I think you hard core christians and dispensationalists out there will swallow this? Nope...and that's YOUR loss. You'll prefer to keep on being deceived by the drivel of the RCC and the Protestant derivatives. How sad indeed....
Well Terry, you are pretty much onto something here. Let's keep in mind a few key points that today's church completely ignores, and thereby gets way off base.
#1: The Messiah NEVER came with the intent that a religion would be build around HIM, but rather gave ALL praise honor and glory to the Father YHVH. HE always followed and upheld every word from the original Torah. Too bad the ruling party of the Jewish Rabbinate at the time (the Pharisee's and Sadducees) didn't and chose to add to the Torah, which is why Messiah Yahshua was constantly at odds with them. They had attempted to rewrite the Torah so to speak.
#2: The Messiah AND all of HIS Talmadim (apostles) followed ALL of the Moadim (the Appointment Times of YHVH or the Holy days) which the Jews of their day observed as well. They NEVER failed to do so and NEVER did away with ANY of them. chrisianity, via the Church of Rome and pagan Emperor Constantine DID just that! They forbade christians from following ANYTHING that the Jews did, hence those things that Messiah AND HIS Talmadim did, so what the heck kind of religion is that?
#3: For those that never read the detailed accounts and Canon's listed in the Council of Nicea and Council of Leodicea, they had better get with it. Those accounts are by far the most antisemetic of all that ever came down the pike, not to mention they literally "Raped" the entire original intent and following of the Messiah literally chapter and verse. What they left behind was a paganized religion ruled by men, with doctrine written and enforced by men, and this remains today, a complete pollution and far cry of the original faith and following of the Messiah and the words HE spoke and taught from. HE and HIS Talmadim taught from the Torah pure and simple with NO man added junk. NOT the new testament.
#4: Here's the most difficult thing for christians to swallow. They think THEY have replaced Israel as the Chosen of YHVH. Got a news flash for them. It NEVER happened and it NEVER will. As it has already been abundantly stated in scripture, you are either native born or grafted into the commonwealth of Israel or you are NOT a part of the covenant with YHVH, and you will NOT be going through one of those 12 gates named for the Tribes of Israel stated in Revelation 22. I could go on till the cows come home, but I'll leave it at this.
Do I think you hard core christians and dispensationalists out there will swallow this? Nope...and that's YOUR loss. You'll prefer to keep on being deceived by the drivel of the RCC and the Protestant derivatives. How sad indeed....
thats very interesting makes one think how authentic this book realy is.
Ptsum,The bible (book of many books) is not considered "sacred" to me..There are some of us believers/Christians who believe the books were not written from anyone's hand that was writing what God was speaking..Personally I believe that if the Bible was the written words spoken by God that there would not be any confusion or debating about it..There would be no need for some people to declare that "my interpretation is better than yours" I believe God did preserve and keep some things in the books only as a guide to faith/belief, but God is not contained between the covers of the bible..
I believe God is in all of us and we are free to accept and seek his presence or we can deny His presence, but He never leaves us..
I am truthful in saying that I am a Christian/believer because my family for generations have been Christian..What we live with and are taught in early childhood sticks with us into adulthood for many people..
Jesus was taught to me, sung to me and preached to me and He became a part of me..However as I matured and began to study other religions and observe the customs and cultures from around the world, I came to the conclusion that we worship one God, the creator, and there are many paths in this life that we each walk..If we are believers in a creator and respect each ones relationship with Him and treat our brothers and sisters (for I believe we are all His children] with kindness, and respect and replenish this world that is our temporary home for the next generation then our paths will eventually all end up before the Creator..
When I decided to seek God outside of mans religions I found the peace and joy in my faith that I had longed for and all the anger, and the guilt that man's religion had burdened me with disappeared from my life..
To answer the question is it possible to debate Christianity without the use of the book? Not here that is for sure..But then I have no reason to debate Christianity or any of my beliefs or anyones..
As they say "been there, done that" and the scars are healed and I want them to stay healed.
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