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There is absolutely NOTHING that I am doing to prohibit the LL from entering the house. IF there is an emergency, there is a dozen ways for him to get ahold of us. If he can't find a way, then he's not trying. There's really no excuse. I cannot, in good conscience, give my LL the code. He will then give it to other associates and contractors. I have a right to a safe place to live. What good is an alarm system if a dozen people know the code AND have keys to my house? These contractors come and go. I wouldn't feel comfortable with them having my code.
Doesn't matter if you're "comfortable" with it or not, the landlord has the right to control his property. You're not the owner, and you're *not* on equal legal footing with the owner. The owner can and will go to jail on felony charges if they abuse their right of entry, but they do have a right of entry. You're the one being given access & use of a (potentially) $100,000+ asset with *only* your promise to pay and a $1000 deposit.
Landlords take tremendous risk for very little reward, even if they're jerks. Would you hand over the keys to a Ferrari to someone who put $1000 in your hand and "promised" not to damage it? Landlords do that kind of thing every day. One tenant cooking meth in a property can completely wipe out the value of a property in just a few days.
I don't really care. I will show him the very same courtesy he has shown us over the years. When we moved in, the landlord refused, straight up refused, to put in a lock on the back sliding glass door. I bought one and installed it.
That's different. He's REQUIRED to have working locks and doors and windows, the property has to have the ability to be locked/secured from entry. He is not required to have a security system
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaredC
Ask me to remove it? I would challenge the crap out of you and ask you to show me, in the lease, where it clearly states I'm not allowed to have an alarm system. This alarm system is non invasive to the house. The contacts are held on by glue strips that are easily removed.
You can challenge till you're blue in the face. By the simple action of ADDING the security system without prior written approval you are modifying the premises. The lease doesn't have to specifically have a clause "you cannot install a alarm system" in the lease. All that needs to be written is that you cannot modify the property. There is no way a lease can have every nuance of a modification written in it so it's a all encompassing modification clause basically stating you can't make changes to the property. If you sat there and added EVERY possible CANT DO you would have a lease the size of a phone book. By adding the alarm you changed the property. That is covered under modification clause. And it's even worse because you did it without prior written approval
You can fight it all you want you would lose. You would have 3 days to remove it, if you don't I would start eviction.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaredC
There is absolutely NOTHING that I am doing to prohibit the LL from entering the house. IF there is an emergency, there is a dozen ways for him to get ahold of us. If he can't find a way, then he's not trying. There's really no excuse. I cannot, in good conscience, give my LL the code. He will then give it to other associates and contractors. I have a right to a safe place to live. What good is an alarm system if a dozen people know the code AND have keys to my house? These contractors come and go. I wouldn't feel comfortable with them having my code.
Sure there is. You're installing a item that hinders the LL from entering the property. You can't always get a hold of someone and I'm not going to jump through hoops to get a hold of you if I need to enter. I'm not going to go through that. It's still my property. When I lease it to you I'm giving up certain rights to the property but not all the rights. You can't just do as you please. The reason there is a lease is for this EXACT reason. It specifies everything you and I are responsible for and what is expected. Read your lease. It has a modification clause.
Here is what I do. I call my tenants and tell them I will be entering the property on x date between x time. I look at whatever I may need done. Thats it. I open the door do what I need and walk out.
You have the ability to rent a property from another. You have the right to rent a property that has working sewer, water electric and to be safe to live. Safe meaning the condition of the property.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaredC
What terms, exactly, of the lease am I violating? There's absolutely nothing in the lease that says I cannot protect my family with an alarm system. Absolutely. Nothing.
Ok. One more time. By adding the alarm system you are MODIFYING the premises. I'm not sure why it's is so hard for you to understand. It's no different than painting the walls or removing a closet door or adding lights or anything that modifies the property. It's the modification itself that's a violation. What the modification is is inconsequential. Like I stated before you are violating the modification clause of the lease. Obviously for some unknown reason this fact escapes you.
It doesn't matter what you want or if it makes you feel safer. It's not your property to do as you please with. I had tenants ask if they can install alarms. I pointed the modification clause on the lease and always said no. In writing.
Last edited by Electrician4you; 02-27-2017 at 09:09 PM..
I wanted to get the take from the Landlords here, and heck, tenants too. Landlords, do you feel it is an obligation for your tenants to furnish this code? Tenants, would you furnish the code upon request?
We are a bit different as we provide the systems in place and provide the codes to the tenants. With that said, even in those buildings not equip with a system, tenants must obtain permission to install an alarm. The reason is that all alarms that are monitored usually require a permit and the permit usually holds the property owner responsible for false or nuisance alarms. As such, most jurisdictions tend to uphold a landlord's right to approve alarms even if alarms are not specifically listed in the lease.
The second reason many courts side with landlords is that unless the alarm communicates via a completely wireless method to the central station, if the homes telephone wiring is used, an alternation to the wiring must be made in order to obtain line seizure. That alone is a material modification of the premise that requires landlord approval. It doesn't even matter that the alarm company will come back and rewire to standard wiring upon vacating, the fact that it exist is the modification.
So, you may want to research your municipal codes related to alarm systems, permits and actual alarm trips and see who is the responsible party. If it clearly indicates the property owner, you run the risk of being told to get rid of it. If it's vague, doesn't say or there are no regulations, it's your personal call at this point.
As Rabritta stated pretty much every municipality requires a alarm permit or they may not dispatch. False alarms usually get billed to the legal owner as the PD works off the address dispatch if they do dispatch. Not to mention some alarm contracts may have wording or clauses that could place a lien on the property. Not to mention the city/PD can lien the property if they send dispatch bills that don't get paid
I can tell you for a fact alarm companies do not come back to take the systems back. It costs them too much to send someone to remove the unit and it's components and then patch and paint the walls and door casings/jams.
Not to mention some alarm contracts may have wording or clauses that could place a lien on the property.
Excellent point, forgot that one. Almost very alarm installation agreement I have seen specifically has wording that the person signing the contract is the owner of the property or has permission from the owner for the installation. If that's in the installation and/or monitoring agreement, the violation started upon signing if no permission was received.
Some of you might want to learn more about completely wireless alarms. They do NOT use phone lines, and the units--sensors --communicate with the base station wirelessly.
They can, with some careful choice of components, not attach to the house. I have a house with only motion sensors and cameras. The motion sensors are attached to a hutch in the dining room and a few book shelves throughout the house with double sided tape. The cameras sit on tables and plug into normal electrical outlets. The key pad is attached with double sided tape--attached to the side of the frig. There is NO modification of the house.
Now , if one chooses glass sensors or door/window sensors, maybe there is a modification to the house, maybe not if they are the taped on monitors that come off with the pull of the tape.
In my other house I actually put on a sensor on a wall and pulled to tape a few days later, it did not hurt the wall or paint at all.
BTW, for that house, all the sensors are on walls, not furniture as its a different layout and that made sense for that house.
And my community encourages security alarm systems, so they do not charge for the false alarms.
And BTW, I own the houses Just the best places for the sensors were on the furniture for that one house with curved walls.
Some of you might want to learn more about completely wireless alarms. They do NOT use phone lines, and the units--sensors --communicate with the base station wirelessly.
They can, with some careful choice of components, not attach to the house. I have a house with only motion sensors and cameras. The motion sensors are attached to a hutch in the dining room and a few book shelves throughout the house with double sided tape. The cameras sit on tables and plug into normal electrical outlets. The key pad is attached with double sided tape--attached to the side of the frig. There is NO modification of the house.
Now , if one chooses glass sensors or door/window sensors, maybe there is a modification to the house, maybe not if they are the taped on monitors that come off with the pull of the tape.
In my other house I actually put on a sensor on a wall and pulled to tape a few days later, it did not hurt the wall or paint at all.
BTW, for that house, all the sensors are on walls, not furniture as its a different layout and that made sense for that house.
And my community encourages security alarm systems, so they do not charge for the false alarms.
And BTW, I own the houses Just the best places for the sensors were on the furniture for that one house with curved walls.
I completely agree. It's a wireless system. All of the adhesive glue boards that the sensors are on can be removed and placed elsewhere ( I know, I've moved a few of these and they come off without residue remains). The keypad sits in place where the old keypad was. When we leave, we put the old keypad back where the new one sits, have all of the sensors removed by ADT. I paid for the permits, and the equipment plus the monthly monitoring. I'm actually not surprised by the reaction of LL's here. They want overlord control of thier tenants because we are lessors in thier eyes. How dare we make a decision on how we enjoy the property. Lol. Quite funny really.
Excellent point, forgot that one. Almost very alarm installation agreement I have seen specifically has wording that the person signing the contract is the owner of the property or has permission from the owner for the installation. If that's in the installation and/or monitoring agreement, the violation started upon signing if no permission was received.
Nope. You should probably give ADT a call. They have systems designed specifically for a tenant. They have systems that are designed to be moved.
Your landlord is entitled to immediate, unfettered access to HIS property in case of emergencies. He is not required to go searching for your phone number or call you to gain such access.
OP, we can debate this all day. But this ^^ is it in a nutshell.
You may choose not to share the code with him. But the bottom line is that he is within his legal rights to issue a cure or quit notice. And if you don't "cure", you will be required to vacate.
Now he may not notice that you've installed a security system or he may not care but he can demand that you provide him with the code. And if you don't, he can require you to vacate.
OP, we can debate this all day. But this ^^ is it in a nutshell.
You may choose not to share the code with him. But the bottom line is that he is within his legal rights to issue a cure or quit notice. And if you don't "cure", you will be required to vacate.
Now he may not notice that you've installed a security system or he may not care but he can demand that you provide him with the code. And if you don't, he can require you to vacate.
In this matter, the law is on his side.
A cure or quit on WHAT? On what? My alarm system? The fact that I won't share the code with him? If which is NOT IN THE LEASE btw. He can do whatever he wants. I would drag his slum lord a$$ through court over this in a heartbeat. You betcha! My LL wouldn't want that because the judge would see the myriad and blatant lease violations on his end. Hmm. Repairs not only are not done in a timely manner, but often get ignored by the LL. Refusal to install a lock on the back door upon move in.
There's also the fact that he has a history of losing in court. I've looked him up through various other previous tenants and also a quick google search revealed this. He's been labeled a slum landlord. Smeared all over the internet. When a judge see that I've had an alarm system installed, professionally, which, btw, is completely non invasive, because I had a break in, he would call the LL a nut case for trying to evict me.
Also, a landlord cannot enter the house without a 24 hour notice. If there's an emergency, he can contact one of many many emergency contacts on our list that also have the app installed that can disarm the system.
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Just the best places for the sensors were on the furniture for that one house with curved walls.
