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Old 10-01-2011, 10:03 AM
 
10,092 posts, read 14,200,665 times
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FIrst of all (disclaimer) I am smack in the middle, born in 1953. I do think the end of the baby boom demographic event was about 1957 (when each cohort was larger than the previous) and the 1964 inclusion for boomers is a media and marketing game.
If this huge bulge of some 75 million people is going to be clobbering Medicare and Soc. Sec., doesn't it also stand that there was/is a huge bulge in people paying into it while working?
After the big Die-off (that's us, gang!) the population might well stabilize to some extent. So the issues are really during the bulge.
Is it that the government long ago raided and continues to raid the Soc.Sec. "lockbox?"
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Old 10-01-2011, 12:28 PM
 
Location: WA
4,052 posts, read 13,207,284 times
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I agree... I paid SS from 1964 until 2005 with many later years at the maximum. A huge number have done the same.

Although demographics are a challenge the real issue is mismanagement by government.

Most politicians are simply not qualified to make long term financial decisions and are motivated to be popular and be reelected in the near term. We really need a different structure or at least different rules if we are going to let elected officials allocate our money.

There are two issues here… salvage the existing system and change the structure that got us into this mess.
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Old 10-01-2011, 01:22 PM
 
Location: Phoenix
354 posts, read 584,078 times
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Well, I have been contributing for ~45 years now and at the maximum level in recent years. In truth the politicians treated it as a general income tax revenue. Just more money and power to Washington under the pretext that we would be entitled to something they couldn't necessarily deliver. It really is a government sponsered Ponzi scheme. The paid benefits to qualified people and spent the surplus leaving nearly worthless IOUs. I have heard one aggravating rumor in that SS benefits are being given to a lot of familys being given asylum in the U.S. after being relocated from areas of conflict around the world. I guarantee they do not have anything in the "lock box" and these are young people so how many years are they going to be a drag? Their are more claims on SS than many realize.

Everything has been said before, we were screwed.

Now we need to take care of people who are totally dependent and gradually dismantle the existing program and if necessary transform it into something that precludes those bastards from stealing the money again to redistribute however they think best.
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Old 10-01-2011, 01:23 PM
 
42,375 posts, read 46,156,512 times
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Not really has it more a numbers paying in and noumbers receieve ;even i the furture.Its was like 4 to 1 with boomers paying.It lile yto be just the same problem the japansese face now in the future also from lower birth rates .But in mnay respects its also few contributing of smaller numbers also.
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Old 10-01-2011, 01:28 PM
 
3,177 posts, read 2,541,869 times
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For the people today over 55 it's pretty much a lock. All they have to do to strengthen the system for the others is get more people paying into the system or in short expand employment. That's not going to happen on a large scale. the real big issue boomer need to consider is how many will have Soc. Sec and pension income. I think not many and many people just don't have the side funds to invest long term. Either way for the boomer masses it's going to get ugly..

Something people need to understand is the people who are making the decision are pretty much set. If you send a person with a full belly to shop for a hungry person how soon do you think they are going to bring the food? When they get good and ready and they may not like what they bring..
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Old 10-02-2011, 07:57 AM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
21,797 posts, read 28,255,217 times
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Each tax-payer pays into their SS account, when each tax-payer has paid 40-quarters into their account it is 'fully-funded'. Keep working and paying into your account and it only serves to build your account more.

Assuming that all of this money is invested properly, there will always be enough funds in the pool to pay each of our retirements.

This is of course assuming that nobody steals those funds and uses them for road-building or other illegal purposes.
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Old 10-10-2011, 07:39 PM
 
Location: Florida -
4,827 posts, read 3,414,379 times
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Thomas Jefferson Quote (para): "May God protect us from politicians who take our money under the pretense of taking care of us."
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Old 10-10-2011, 09:24 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles area
9,192 posts, read 7,060,153 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
Each tax-payer pays into their SS account, when each tax-payer has paid 40-quarters into their account it is 'fully-funded'. Keep working and paying into your account and it only serves to build your account more.

Assuming that all of this money is invested properly, there will always be enough funds in the pool to pay each of our retirements.

This is of course assuming that nobody steals those funds and uses them for road-building or other illegal purposes.
That is a bit misleading. Yes, Social Security keeps records of the payroll taxes we pay, both the number of quarters and the amounts, because that information is used later to compute our benefits using the formulas which have been in place for some time. But there is no account sitting their with our name on it analogous to a bank account or a 401K account, with a dollar amount that belongs to us or to our heirs. Social Security is best thought of as insurance; we pay the premiums through the years, and if we live long enough we can collect retirement benefits. The 40 quarters is the minimum pay-in of premiums in order to collect retirement benefits. To say anything is "fully funded" after 40 quarters is extremely misleading. "Minimally funded" would be more like it, as 40 quarters equals ten years, and they average our top 35 years of earnings to apply the benefit formulas. A person with only 40 quarters is not going to have a very big Soc. Sec. retirement benefit because that person will have 25 zeros to average in with the 10 years of premium payments.
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Old 10-10-2011, 09:55 PM
 
Location: Exeter, NH
4,494 posts, read 2,150,193 times
Reputation: 3880
Quote:
Originally Posted by brightdoglover View Post
FIrst of all (disclaimer) I am smack in the middle, born in 1953. I do think the end of the baby boom demographic event was about 1957 (when each cohort was larger than the previous) and the 1964 inclusion for boomers is a media and marketing game.
If this huge bulge of some 75 million people is going to be clobbering Medicare and Soc. Sec., doesn't it also stand that there was/is a huge bulge in people paying into it while working?
After the big Die-off (that's us, gang!) the population might well stabilize to some extent. So the issues are really during the bulge.
Is it that the government long ago raided and continues to raid the Soc.Sec. "lockbox?"
First, you are correct that what I call the "tail end" of the Baby Boom, should not be considered part of the Baby Boom. My spouse and I were born in 1961 and 1962, and while the early Baby Boomers got lots of jobs and increasing prosperity, it was the EXACT opposite for us. There has been NO prosperity for my age group, and with wages stagnated since the late 1970s, our ENTIRE work lives have been defined by Recessions and unemployment. We got the "backlash" to all the good deals that the early Baby Boomers got.

As to Social Security and Medicare, in 1983 the tax rates for these were massively increased to pay for the eventual retirement of the Baby Boom. We were the first to pay for BOTH current retirees, and a "Trust Fund" for our own retirement. Naturally, my spouse and I graduated college in 1983, starting our work careers to the new high tax rates.

We were promised that the "Trust Fund" would not be raided. It was in a "Lock Box" and couldn't possibly be spent by politicians. It would be there for us -- we could TRUST our leaders in Washington. Right? Wrong. It took only a few years before Washington started STEALING the excess money collected under Social Security, and spending it on foolishness like foreign wars. All the way up until 2009, the last year the SS system had a surplus, every single penny that would have gone in the Trust Fund was spent on other things (in effect, making deficits look far smaller than they actually were).

Even today, politicians refer to the "$2.6 Trillion Social Security Trust Fund" and claim the system won't be bankrupt until 2035 or so--at least when they want to kick the can down the road. And it would be true would be true IF THEY HADN'T ALREADY SPENT THE $2.6 TRILLION. But they did spend it. It's gone. And in 2010, Social Security for the first time gave out more money in benefits than it collected in taxes. Even the government office of Management and Budget admits there is no SS Trust Fund to tap:

"These [Trust Fund] balances are available to finance future benefit payments and other Trust Fund expenditures – but only in a bookkeeping sense.... They do not consist of real economic assets that can be drawn down in the future to fund benefits. Instead, they are claims on the Treasury that, when redeemed, will have to be financed by raising taxes, borrowing from the public, or reducing benefits or other expenditures." Social Security Trust Fund - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Politicians will try to argue that it DOESN'T MATTER that the Trust Fund money was spent--that it is an obligation of the government, and that makes it 100% insured and reliable. However, our government simply has no money to meet those obligations, and the economy and workforce are no longer prosperous and growing. The government CANNOT simply increase taxes to pay these liabilities. You can't get blood from a stone.

Already my age group doesn't get to collect SS until age 67; heavens knows what it will be when we get close (the majority of those now retired, retired at age 62). In short, Social Security and Medicare WILL collapse when a significant number of Baby Boomers hit the system. Our government has been so incredibly fiscally irresponsible, for so long, that it has ZERO capability of dealing with that crisis. What will happen will be a domino effect, with Medicare going bankrupt, then Social Security, then the overwhelming weight of government debt will swamp the economy, and EVERY system we have will fail at once.

A final note on workers per SS retiree: "In 1950, each retiree's Social Security benefit was paid for by 16 U.S. workers. According to new data from the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, there are now only 1.75 full-time private sector workers for each person that is receiving Social Security benefits in the United States." http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/a...er-should-know
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Old 10-11-2011, 07:12 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles area
9,192 posts, read 7,060,153 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NHartphotog View Post
Already my age group doesn't get to collect SS until age 67; heavens knows what it will be when we get close (the majority of those now retired, retired at age 62). In short, Social Security and Medicare WILL collapse when a significant number of Baby Boomers hit the system. Our government has been so incredibly fiscally irresponsible, for so long, that it has ZERO capability of dealing with that crisis. What will happen will be a domino effect, with Medicare going bankrupt, then Social Security, then the overwhelming weight of government debt will swamp the economy, and EVERY system we have will fail at once.

A final note on workers per SS retiree: "In 1950, each retiree's Social Security benefit was paid for by 16 U.S. workers. According to new data from the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, there are now only 1.75 full-time private sector workers for each person that is receiving Social Security benefits in the United States." The Top 100 Statistics About The Collapse Of The Economy That Every American Voter Should Know
How many times have you been corrected about your mis-statement which I placed in bold above? Your age group can collect Social Security benefits at age 62, just like all the age groups which came before you. At age 62 the benefits will be reduced for taking them "early" as has been the case for all the age groups which came before you. Sixty-seven will be your "full retirement age", up from 65 for my parents (born in 1914) and 66 for me (born in 1944).

The very name of the website you cited calls into question its objectivity. What point of view would we expect from "the economic collapse blog"? Or from you, if we have been reading your posts?
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