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Old 11-03-2011, 08:27 AM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 67,220,362 times
Reputation: 22375

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Quote:
Originally Posted by songbird52 View Post
Some of us need social interaction but we don't need to be married. If a woman doesn't need a man to support her financially, and she doesn't want to have children, then she doesn't necessarily need to be married. If she needs a lot of sex, that is another story, and then she would need a romantic relationship, although not necessarily married or living together.

I find that some people look down at me because I am not married. I have a romantic relationship, but don't live with him. I think I am lucky I don't have to spend a lot of time cooking and cleaning. I am no good at either.

Also, I don't have to fight with anyone about money. I can make all my own decisions. I have lots of free time and lots of interests and I have friends. I like spending time alone or with people I have things in common with.

I think some women (including me) don't need as much sex when they are over 50. So that driving motivation to be in a live-with relationship is lessened. Do I really want sex so much that I would be willing to be a cook and maid and nurse for a man?

Nah.
Sounds like you are very realistic about how you wish to live your life!

We all have to do what works for us - regardless of what works for someone else who may be viewing our lives from a distance.

And in the end, it is NO ONE'S BUSINESS how we choose to spend our time, or what structure our relationships may have. One of the benefits of growing older is being able to let go of concern about what anyone else thinks about our life decisions. As long as our behavior isn't affecting anyone else's quality of life . . . NO ONE'S BUSINESS.

ETA: I always admired Jackie Kennedy Onassis' decision to have the relationship she wanted despite social "obstacles" . . . it was no one's business except the folks involved . . . I will never understand why some people think it is their right to judge how other human beings decide to live their lives, lol.

 
Old 11-03-2011, 08:40 AM
 
Location: zippidy doo dah
895 posts, read 1,333,644 times
Reputation: 1928
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariadne22 View Post
Absolutely. LB needed a bit of amusement.


It's hormone thing for some women, plus they're plumb tuckered out from all the work of catering to kids and hubby. A good choice of mate can make the drudgery tolerable, and all the hard work worthwhile, however.


Along that line,

In general, men need women far more than women need men. Over the years, women being the nurturers often get tired of the demands.

Most men can't be alone. Thus, serial marriages/relationships. In general, if men are leaving wife, girlfriend, etc., there is another woman in the wings. Not always, but usually.

Wives often replace mothers. Since those mothers usually had to divide their time and attention among children and husband, some men are needy for more attention - often marrying women like their mothers.

The need for shmoozing - constant validation - is a component to many men. In my family, my father didn't need or want this. Which drove my stepmother crazy. She said he wasn't affectionate enough.

On the other hand, my father's brother (my uncle) and his son (my cousin) were the opposite of my father. Uncle's son, in particular, it was always ALL ABOUT HIM. My aunt was very good at laughing at the jokes, constant schmoozing, stroking the ego, as was her daughter when she married. However, aunt also favored the daughter, not the son, which explains son's exaggerated neediness as an adult. He married three times, first two ended in divorce. Third wife is an alcoholic.

As it happened, my ex-husband was not a problem in this area at first. Later, he resented competing for my attention after our son was born. Both talking to me at the same time at dinner. Each competing with the other. Turns out he, too, had his abandonment issues when his younger brother was born and was sickly for a while, depriving him of his mother's attention. Younger son became the favorite.

Next man I met was a PITA in a major way. I couldn't believe his expectations - especially coming from a household (and marriage) where I had never seen this. Five or more phone calls in a day, etc. He also very much resented his own children (and my one child). Lots of abandonment issues with him. Holocaust survivor, whose mother died when he was 8. An orphan in Europe. Never got over it. Very wealthy and successful. Also, a textbook case for child abandonment issues. Ended up with a woman 27 years younger who put up with it. No children in that marriage, of course. He'd learned his lesson the first time.

Emotional self-sufficiency has a lot to do with one's internal makeup/DNA, family modeling and childhood nurturing - or lack thereof. And how much work a person has done in their lifetime to understand and overcome these issues.

As for me, along with many of the other female posters, these days I have zero tolerance.
Great post and hopefully helps the guys realize that the vast majority of women are not opportunist or male users.

So many things, be they DNA-Hormones-Social Norms- whatever- do have women assume a great deal of the nurturing responsibility. Whether this shifts over the generations to come, we'll see but there's enough information out there to reflect that women within a family role assume more of the child and elder parent care than men.

Nurturing, caring, etc can be very beneficial to one's physical/emotional health but can also be absolutely draining.

So when the males see women posting what appear to be male-bashing comments, it's really somewhat a rite of passage occurring. It isn't so much AGAINST the male gender/it's for us/me/a need for some quiet time in life.

With that said, there is of course the personal make up of anyone/male-female - people that are energized externally and those that are energized internally. Everyone is not an extrovert/we tend to celebrate those who gain strength from outside stimulation and be wary of the ones that collect their personal fulfillment from within. Myself, having been raised to "extrovert" in a household of manic extroverts am now settling into the extroverted introvert that is finally getting a chance to choose............somewhat..........sometimes (stronger every day)
 
Old 11-03-2011, 08:47 AM
 
10,391 posts, read 9,403,673 times
Reputation: 16010
--->LovesBoating: you achieved your goal of getting people stirred up....now, instead of peering into other's windows and emulating Clarence Appleton, you should get a life.
 
Old 11-03-2011, 08:54 AM
 
7,341 posts, read 16,662,001 times
Reputation: 4568
Well, after reading some more of the posts, I just HAD to make a comment or two!

First, I'm not being "taken care of" by my wife! Say what you want, but wife and I know that we take care of each other! Isn't that what love/marriage is suppose to be about?
I have SS/Retirement coming in and a good possibility of another small income to come. I never made the kind of salary she makes and that's been fine with both of us. She told one poster (had me type it in for her) about what I do at home and how grateful she is. All of the chores she listed takes a great burden off of her. Heck, I cooked a nice dinner last night that we both enjoyed. She didn't have to cook or clean up. By the way, did you folks read my posting where my wife told me "I don't want to go to bed until you do!"......I love her for that!

Now, whatever poster said that I'm driving over to my wife's work and bugging her and that I shouldn't be calling her.........that made me laugh as well! I don't just drive over to her work, we go together sometimes and I have breakfast with her. One poster said "that's nice". As far as calling her, I've already said that if I don't call her, she will call me! We talk everyday during her lunch. If a person, older or younger, doesn't want a relationship with someone or, if they are married, doesn't want their spouse eating breakfast with them at work or calling them at work........that's their thing, but it sure isn't ours.

Another bit of info: My neighbor was on her patio have a smoke and I walked up and said "still having a hard time stopping, hugh?". She said, "yes, but I'm trying and keeping it to three cigarettes a day." I proceeded to tell her how/why I stopped both smoking and "chewing/dip" (which is Copenhagen and Skoal). We also talked about dogs for a minute and then she told me that she had to get ready for work. We both said "bye" and that ended that. My wife called me a minute ago and I told her about the conversation.

Something else I need to say about this lady, but forgot to: When we were discussing men/relationships, she told me that she finds the area we live in very boring. Her daughter lives in Daytona and is giving some serious thought about moving back down there. She actually told me, "I'd get out a lot more if I lived down there!" She told me her Lease is up this April and she may move. Wife and I really don't want to see her go cause she is such a nice and quiet lady......unlike her neighbor above her that I've already encountered at 4AM for talking so loud on their patio and waking wife and I up! If this lady leaves, we simply wish her "the best of luck and fun down south".
 
Old 11-03-2011, 08:58 AM
 
7,341 posts, read 16,662,001 times
Reputation: 4568
If people got stirred up on here, it's there fault, not mine! I'm a friendly guy and make comments and ask questions that don't seem to bother people here! As stated before, our neighbor or the other ladies haven't reported me to management or come to our apartment and complained to my wife. But, then again, I've talked to these ladies with my wife right next to me........and still made comments and asked questions!
SO THERE!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by katie45 View Post
--->LovesBoating: you achieved your goal of getting people stirred up....now, instead of peering into other's windows and emulating Clarence Appleton, you should get a life.
 
Old 11-03-2011, 08:58 AM
 
48 posts, read 38,772 times
Reputation: 74
I agree Ariadne22, we are not all extroverts and we are not all nurturers. But a "normal" American women is expected to be the ideal mother/grandmother, always busy making sure everyone is happy and healthy. Not every woman is like that! Some women would be miserable forced into that role -- and so many have been forced, over the millennia. I just heard a news report this morning about the declining birth rates in the developed countries, and they said it's probably because most women would rather have JOB than be a mother!

Can you believe that? As much as having a job sucks (not all the time, but overall), being a mother sucks even more!

So that kind of made me feel validated. I always KNEW I didn't want to be a housewife or mother. God, my mother was not exactly thrilled with the deal, even though she could afford to hire plenty of help.

Are we put on earth to do what makes us happy, or to serve others? Some of both I guess. But women have always been expected to mostly serve others, and to not be selfish and worry about their happiness.

I am somewhat introverted and I LOVE working on my projects alone. But I also love going out and singing and playing music with others. I love being able to take care of myself financially (although I can't say I always love my job, therefore I am working towards retirement).

I DO NOT regret never having raised a family. And I bet there are many millions of women in the world who would have liked to follow their dreams and be independent, but got stuck.
 
Old 11-03-2011, 09:15 AM
 
7,341 posts, read 16,662,001 times
Reputation: 4568
I can understand this! My wife is much more of a "giver" than I am. I'm more of a "giver/taker" and have no problem "taking" if something is given to me. My wife says, "thank you" for anything/everything I do for her. She told me that she was pretty much raised that way. I was pretty much raised that way as well, but when I left home for the Navy, that part of my personality changed dramatically. The two words I used more that "thank you" was "yes, Sir!".
When a man or women gets out of a bad marriage, a lot of them just want to be "LEFT ALONE" and that feeling can go on for the rest of their life. Others, who leave a bad marrige, just have the feeling "the next one will be better". This was the case of my wife and I when we met. Neither of us liked living alone and not having someone. A lot of folks don't think that's right and love being totally independant. That wasn't the case, being independant, for either of us........we like depending on each other! Actually, I'll bet there are a lot of folks out there (young and old) that do hate being alone/single!
Just like there are a lot of men and women out there that are humorous (w/some sarcasim thrown in) and have no problem making comments or asking questions. And, there are people out there don't get offended by the comments/questions!


Quote:
Originally Posted by songbird52 View Post
I agree Ariadne22, we are not all extroverts and we are not all nurturers. But a "normal" American women is expected to be the ideal mother/grandmother, always busy making sure everyone is happy and healthy. Not every woman is like that! Some women would be miserable forced into that role -- and so many have been forced, over the millennia. I just heard a news report this morning about the declining birth rates in the developed countries, and they said it's probably because most women would rather have JOB than be a mother!

Can you believe that? As much as having a job sucks (not all the time, but overall), being a mother sucks even more!

So that kind of made me feel validated. I always KNEW I didn't want to be a housewife or mother. God, my mother was not exactly thrilled with the deal, even though she could afford to hire plenty of help.

Are we put on earth to do what makes us happy, or to serve others? Some of both I guess. But women have always been expected to mostly serve others, and to not be selfish and worry about their happiness.

I am somewhat introverted and I LOVE working on my projects alone. But I also love going out and singing and playing music with others. I love being able to take care of myself financially (although I can't say I always love my job, therefore I am working towards retirement).

I DO NOT regret never having raised a family. And I bet there are many millions of women in the world who would have liked to follow their dreams and be independent, but got stuck.
 
Old 11-03-2011, 09:39 AM
 
Location: earth?
7,288 posts, read 10,871,868 times
Reputation: 8956
It's sad that after all of this feedback, you still felt entitled to harass your neighbor yesterday - if she is outside smoking on her patio, the last thing she would want or need is you marching up and commenting on it . . .

Why do you think she is REALLY thinking of moving?

Leave her alone already
 
Old 11-03-2011, 09:47 AM
 
Location: South Carolina
13,826 posts, read 18,824,106 times
Reputation: 24521
Quote:
Originally Posted by imcurious View Post
It's sad that after all of this feedback, you still felt entitled to harass your neighbor yesterday - if she is outside smoking on her patio, the last thing she would want or need is you marching up and commenting on it . . .

Why do you think she is REALLY thinking of moving?

Leave her alone already
I had a nosy neighbor like this once and I did move and I could not agree more that this woman wants or would like to be left alone the way she lives is none of your business and you really do need to find something to occupy your time with besides your neighbor . Yes I would be ready to move too with you as a neighbor .
 
Old 11-03-2011, 10:15 AM
 
5,128 posts, read 5,855,276 times
Reputation: 8396
Quote:
Originally Posted by mzfroggez View Post
relationships can be wonderful - they can also be demanding, exhausting, suffocating.

"smothering and clingy" has already been cited.
OMG this made me laugh. I have said that sometimes relationships feel like a lot of red tape.

I assume that's a sign of being in the wrong one, though.
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