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Old 11-04-2007, 05:52 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdelena View Post
Pensions own over 25% of corporate equities.

With the move to defined contribution retirement plans many people own stock... 'Recent data released by the Federal Reserve shows that nearly half of all U.S. households are stockholders.'

You will find more people (of all ages) own stock in public corporations than do not.
Yep, so retiring and gloating that those corporations are going to "get theirs"....is like crashing your car into a pole to teach the guy in the passenger seat a lesson.

Additionally, less workers = more wage pressure and inflation....not something people on fixed incomes like to experience.

 
Old 11-04-2007, 06:52 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverwing View Post
Apologies for taking this off on a tangent, but in coming years as the older folks retire and younger ones take their place, companies might rue the day they started pushing the older workers out

American kids, dumber than dirt / Warning: The next generation might just be the biggest pile of idiots in U.S. history

Reading the blog, one might think "one soured writer and his misanthropic views" but the 100s of comments that follow validate some of his feelings.

My own recent experience somewhat proves that. Two positions came open in my department (information technology). We figured they'd be filled with a couple of Indian or Asian contractors; that's the trend in this industry; only to see two late 40s men (one black/one white) come on board. Being on plain speaking terms with one of the bosses, I asked what's up with that? Well, foreign contract workers weren't hired because of the disgruntlement over so many non-Americans taking jobs, so that option wasn't exercised. Okayyy, but why not a couple of youngsters; probably right out of college and needing work experience? At that question I got a sour look and a grunt of an answer "Damned kids would be too much trouble. Runts come in here demanding to be paid as much as me. ME! With 30 years of experience over those wet-behind-the-ears kids! And you should have seen their resumes and cover letters! Crap the likes of which I wrote better when I was in third grade! And I know I would catch hell from you people on the floor who would have had to train them, spoiled and ignorant as they sounded when all I had to do was talk to them. Nope, we decided to hire a couple of older guys with experience; ones we knew would be willing to work for pay, not jack off".

Whoa. I prudently left him to cool down. He looked like he was about to burst from apoplexy I've also kept the notion my mate and I have: to retire early, under wraps. My mate wants to retire in a few years, when he hits the magic '62'. I'm younger but support him fully. He left home at 17 to join the Air Force (that or be drafted and sent to Vietnam) and has not had a non-working year since. He'll be able to collect SS, but we foresee that as the supplement, not the income to live on. We've saved. I know that the management we each work with day-to-day won't be happy to see us go. We've been thoroughly dependable, able to work without supervision (giving our managers a chance to have a life with their families, secure that everything at work is flowing smoothly with us at the helm), and well worth our salaries. Turn our jobs over to younger people, just to make less money? In the long run, given the up-and-coming work force, it won't really be cost effective.
Interesting. Just before the IT crash I interviewed with a large printing company. My headhunter told me that I was at the top of the "want" list but they didn't want to pay me what I was asking because they had someone just out of college willing to take the position for less.

I told my headhunter that if they wanted me they would pay for my years of experience. They hired the kid. Through mutual acquaintances I learned he was let go at the 3 month review. Apparently he didn't have a clue about what he was supposed to do, couldn't, or wouldn't learn, and was, as one friend put it "Semi-literate".

That same headhunter called me saying he had a position available and asked if i was interested. Uh, no. I had started my own business and wasn't about to work for someone else.

About a month later the bottom dropped out.
 
Old 11-04-2007, 08:20 PM
 
Location: Old Town Alexandria
14,505 posts, read 23,769,243 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
Yep, so retiring and gloating that those corporations are going to "get theirs"....is like crashing your car into a pole to teach the guy in the passenger seat a lesson.

Additionally, less workers = more wage pressure and inflation....not something people on fixed incomes like to experience.

well, some may have to work. I won't

Companies no longer have profit sharing and pensions as my father did, so I have planned and saved.

And as for future generations,early retirees, boomers and Gen X did not create the deficit that is being handed down to grandchildren now by this currrent administration. I wonder how THEY sleep at night. They are the ones who should feel guilty.
 
Old 11-05-2007, 06:20 AM
 
51,880 posts, read 41,765,307 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamofmonterey View Post
well, some may have to work. I won't

Companies no longer have profit sharing and pensions as my father did, so I have planned and saved.

And as for future generations,early retirees, boomers and Gen X did not create the deficit that is being handed down to grandchildren now by this currrent administration. I wonder how THEY sleep at night. They are the ones who should feel guilty.
<shrug> Personally, I've yet to see a fiscally responsible house\senate\pres. Pin the deficit on the current admin if it helps you feel better about one-party voting.

However, if you are talking solely about the SS "deficit" then yes...the boomers DID cause the "problem" but it's not thier fault. It's just the nature of a pay-go system.
 
Old 11-05-2007, 09:05 AM
 
8,009 posts, read 7,292,844 times
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You need much higher interest rates in the treasury market and the Fed Reserve Funds to force the politicians to live within their means. Until they feel the economy is threatened by higher interest rates, the politicians will continue to do what they feel is in their interest to get reelected. The last time that happened was in 1994.
 
Old 11-05-2007, 09:27 AM
 
208 posts, read 368,556 times
Reputation: 252
I think it's sad that such a large segment of our society can't wait to retire early.

I don't think people should work until they drop. I don't think work is everything. I do wish more people enjoyed working in careers that they found fulfilling.

If that was the case I think there would be less of rush to cash in and get the h3ll out. To live a life where the golden carrot is a free check at 62 seems to be emblematic of a larger social problem.

With the current state of social security funding, the number of boomers set to begin receiving benefits at one time, insane (inane) national debt, the falling dollar and fewer people paying into the system - I can understand the desire to stem the tide of people drawing for so many years.

Wrapping your mind around the weight of the situation and the societal expectations – Yeah, I can see folks asking for more time.

I always found it curious that many people see social security as an early retirement fund where they envision that they’ll get every penny back because “it’s theirs.”

It’s a social program – one that oddly runs counter to so many of our other beliefs. You’re paying for your neighbors, co-workers and strangers. Some may get more. Some may get less. The money isn’t yours so much as it belongs to society as whole.

I think the statements they send in the mail are just a way to appeal to and calm the individual and to sustain buy in.

I would love to live until the end of the century to see what changes are going to come about.
 
Old 11-05-2007, 02:31 PM
 
Location: Monterey Bay, California -- watching the sea lions, whales and otters! :D
1,918 posts, read 6,238,888 times
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Quote:
Mathguy: You would have been entering the workforce in the 60's....I wonder what people in their 60's etc. would have said about your generation at that time?
Probably drugs, immoral, lazy, stupid.....am I even close?
Well, sort of, but not really......

I, for one, in my twenties during the 60s, worked for a large company with about 30 other people in my division. About 14 of us were doing similar jobs. Granted, the "older" folks (to me) were of a generation that was equally educated....however, I had more energy and was faster at working efficiently. I was literally taken aside by a group of women who said to me, "Don't work so fast and get so much done because you're making us look bad." That really happened.

Now, with the new generation of kids coming up (and I have a nearly 18-year-old and I adore her...but it's still an observation...) their educational level is dismal. My kid is an "honor student," but to me, compared to the education I received at her age, I am shocked at how little she is being taught! I'm exhausted supplementing her education -- and I know I can't cover everything, but I'm trying to do as much as I can because I believe an educated worker, is a better worker.

So, in spite of sex, drugs and rock and roll, our generation "multi-tasked" (I know many of us did many things at the same time we worked) and still did a good job at the same time!

I think we better get used to a lower quality of workmanship -- be it in sales, service, or whatever, because my experience with a younger generation of kids not well-educated, but with a big ego because they have "a college degree" (which is like what we had in high school), will sure to have some negative repercussions -- or maybe those younger just won't know the difference! But hey, I'll be retired then, too, so the younger generation can't complain about us .... it's in their hands!
 
Old 11-06-2007, 06:14 PM
 
51,880 posts, read 41,765,307 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wisteria View Post
Well, sort of, but not really......

I, for one, in my twenties during the 60s, worked for a large company with about 30 other people in my division. About 14 of us were doing similar jobs. Granted, the "older" folks (to me) were of a generation that was equally educated....however, I had more energy and was faster at working efficiently. I was literally taken aside by a group of women who said to me, "Don't work so fast and get so much done because you're making us look bad." That really happened.

Now, with the new generation of kids coming up (and I have a nearly 18-year-old and I adore her...but it's still an observation...) their educational level is dismal. My kid is an "honor student," but to me, compared to the education I received at her age, I am shocked at how little she is being taught! I'm exhausted supplementing her education -- and I know I can't cover everything, but I'm trying to do as much as I can because I believe an educated worker, is a better worker.

So, in spite of sex, drugs and rock and roll, our generation "multi-tasked" (I know many of us did many things at the same time we worked) and still did a good job at the same time!

I think we better get used to a lower quality of workmanship -- be it in sales, service, or whatever, because my experience with a younger generation of kids not well-educated, but with a big ego because they have "a college degree" (which is like what we had in high school), will sure to have some negative repercussions -- or maybe those younger just won't know the difference! But hey, I'll be retired then, too, so the younger generation can't complain about us .... it's in their hands!
It seems to me that you were fairly bright amongst your peers in highschool.
This probably gives you a bit of a biased viewpoint. My father didn't go to college but was plenty smart....smarter than a lot of college grads I've met for sure.

It's possible that your daughters school is not too hot...I don't know.

I just don't see how todays generation is dumber etc. although they've certainly decreased certain skills like writing etc. while generally being more computer savy....a product of the changing world.

Best of luck in your retirement.
 
Old 11-06-2007, 06:42 PM
 
Location: Old Town Alexandria
14,505 posts, read 23,769,243 times
Reputation: 8838
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wisteria View Post
Well, sort of, but not really......

I, for one, in my twenties during the 60s, worked for a large company with about 30 other people in my division. About 14 of us were doing similar jobs. Granted, the "older" folks (to me) were of a generation that was equally educated....however, I had more energy and was faster at working efficiently. I was literally taken aside by a group of women who said to me, "Don't work so fast and get so much done because you're making us look bad." That really happened.

Now, with the new generation of kids coming up (and I have a nearly 18-year-old and I adore her...but it's still an observation...) their educational level is dismal. My kid is an "honor student," but to me, compared to the education I received at her age, I am shocked at how little she is being taught! I'm exhausted supplementing her education -- and I know I can't cover everything, but I'm trying to do as much as I can because I believe an educated worker, is a better worker.

So, in spite of sex, drugs and rock and roll, our generation "multi-tasked" (I know many of us did many things at the same time we worked) and still did a good job at the same time!

I think we better get used to a lower quality of workmanship -- be it in sales, service, or whatever, because my experience with a younger generation of kids not well-educated, but with a big ego because they have "a college degree" (which is like what we had in high school), will sure to have some negative repercussions -- or maybe those younger just won't know the difference! But hey, I'll be retired then, too, so the younger generation can't complain about us .... it's in their hands!

Wisteria, I agree with alot of this. While I am a little younger, I cannot believe the mess our economy is now in with Iraq and possibly Iran. I know when I went to school spelling and grammar were important, everyone had to get into a good college, etc...

As a department manager I interview young people. Some do not even have a GED, and expect to be hired. I was shocked. I feel sorry for the situation, but seriously, in 10-15 years, where will these young people be?

If I ever have a child he/she will be headed to private school, and not a victim of this country's declining educational and professional standards.

As for quality of goods, everything is imported from China anyway, and customer service is outsourced to India and other countries. I dont even think there will be decent jobs left in the U.S. for 20 year olds in the next 15 years.

Last edited by dreamofmonterey; 11-06-2007 at 06:42 PM.. Reason: add
 
Old 11-06-2007, 06:45 PM
 
Location: southern california
55,647 posts, read 74,585,953 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goodtype View Post
I was watching George Will talking about Social Security on "This Week" on ABC. He was angry that most Americans are actually taking social security at age 62. He has talked about this many times over the years. He does not believe there should be an "early retirement option at age 62" with social security. He thinks most people should wait until they are 70 for retirement and the early option should be eliminated.

This thinking is quite common in the media, academic and government circles. They think it is crazy for someone to retire when they are in good health and have potentially another 20 years they should be working full time. Of course this is a better option for people like George Will who have the option to do interesting work for years past the typical retirement age.

Those of you who have retired on social security at age 62, do you feel guilty like George Will and others would like you to feel? And do you think the elites will eliminate early retirement at age 62 in the near future?
i dont feel guilty and i think there will be reduced social security.
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