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Old 01-06-2015, 09:08 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,651 posts, read 17,632,423 times
Reputation: 27759

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Quote:
Originally Posted by brava4 View Post
Do tell.
Someone with mechanical skills fixes cars for cash under the table. Bartering. Illegal activities like drug dealing and prostitution.
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Old 01-06-2015, 09:38 AM
 
5,400 posts, read 6,548,967 times
Reputation: 10477
Even I have to snort at this one.

will buy the under the table car repairs except almost everything is computer assisted repair replacement now not shade tree type
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Old 01-06-2015, 09:43 AM
 
Location: Central Massachusetts
4,800 posts, read 4,857,647 times
Reputation: 6379
Quote:
Originally Posted by Escort Rider View Post
DaveinMtAiry is correct that the taxes cited by Mathjak are an extreme example, being that he is talking about Long Island. I pay a little over $2800 a year in property taxes on a two-bedroom plus loft, two and a half bath townhouse with a two-car garage and a swimming pool, the latter shared with 25 other home owners. But our complex is now 34 years old, and expenses are steady and more than negligible in order to keep up with maintenance. At that age, in fact starting some years ago, there is wood rot, roof leaks, replacement of pool equipment, and so forth. We have a perimeter fence made of wood, sections of which we had to have rebuilt after letting the repainting go a little too long. (No rest for the weary board members, of which I am one.)

That doesn't even count stuff which the individual homeowners have to pay for directly themselves (as opposed to through their HOA fees): Heating/air conditioning units, water heaters, interior painting and re-carpeting, plumbing repairs, etc.

So Mathjak's point about continuing expenses is valid despite his extreme example of property taxes, namely that there are continuing expenses with home ownership. However, I don't think that home ownership is more expensive than renting in the long run in most cases. For one thing, the owner of the rental unit(s) has the same expenses (taxes, maintenance) which he has to recover through the rents, so the renter is ultimately paying those expenses. One main difference is the renter doesn't get large, nasty surprises and doesn't have the hassle of choosing and dealing with contractors.

Nor do they have to deal with the maintenance itself. I can tell you that I will gladly give up my 350ft driveway maintenance (snow removal) or the lawn of a 1/2 acre to mow when I am in my 70s. I don't want that to deal with. Renting is an option as is a condo or a HOA.
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Old 01-07-2015, 05:11 AM
 
Location: Mount Airy, Maryland
10,485 posts, read 5,947,197 times
Reputation: 16194
Now if you do not want to shovel a driveway at 70 that's another discussion But there are virtually no examples that will show that renting is less expensive than owning.

Let's use my area as an example. The house across the street rents for $1,600 a month and would probably sell for $300,000, taxes are probably $3,500/year. When you rent you are still responsible for utility costs in most instances, if not then the rent is increase to account for this expense to the owner. So some are arguing that maintenance, taxes etc on that home will add up to $1,600/month? Not a chance. How often do you replace the carpet in a home anyway? You would need to do it 3 times a year to have that math add up. A roof is a HUGE expense, but one that needs to be done no more than once every 15 years. Cost is around $10,000, which is less than the cost of rent for 7 months.

Our house was built in 1900. It also sits on 5 acres with lots of trees and grass to mow. I know a thing or 2 about a house with high maintenance costs. There is not a chance my maintenance and taxes come close to $1,600/month. And this is a high maintenance single family home, a condo has much lower maintenance costs obviously. Sure there is a condo fee but that's factored in when the rent is calculated so the renter is basically paying that too.

There are very very few examples of renting being less expensive than owning. The only argument I can see is it frees up cash to be invested but even at a great return of say 9% it still won't come close to covering your rent.

Last edited by DaveinMtAiry; 01-07-2015 at 05:30 AM..
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Old 01-07-2015, 07:01 AM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
30,714 posts, read 49,503,410 times
Reputation: 19152
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveinMtAiry View Post
Now if you do not want to shovel a driveway at 70 that's another discussion But there are virtually no examples that will show that renting is less expensive than owning.

Let's use my area as an example. The house across the street rents for $1,600 a month and would probably sell for $300,000, taxes are probably $3,500/year. When you rent you are still responsible for utility costs in most instances, if not then the rent is increase to account for this expense to the owner. So some are arguing that maintenance, taxes etc on that home will add up to $1,600/month? Not a chance. How often do you replace the carpet in a home anyway? You would need to do it 3 times a year to have that math add up. A roof is a HUGE expense, but one that needs to be done no more than once every 15 years. Cost is around $10,000, which is less than the cost of rent for 7 months.

Our house was built in 1900. It also sits on 5 acres with lots of trees and grass to mow. I know a thing or 2 about a house with high maintenance costs. There is not a chance my maintenance and taxes come close to $1,600/month. And this is a high maintenance single family home, a condo has much lower maintenance costs obviously. Sure there is a condo fee but that's factored in when the rent is calculated so the renter is basically paying that too.

There are very very few examples of renting being less expensive than owning. The only argument I can see is it frees up cash to be invested but even at a great return of say 9% it still won't come close to covering your rent.
I agree with your general idea.

In 2003 we were in a building in Norwich Ct, when it's roof exceeded it's useful lifespan. The lowest quote we could find to re-shingle that 2,000 sq ft roof was $18,000.
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Old 01-07-2015, 12:47 PM
 
18 posts, read 21,260 times
Reputation: 92
If you are married and worked full time for most of your adult life, you should be able to get at least a $1000 in Social Security even if you made no more than $20,000 a year. If your wife or husband had also worked during their lifestyle he/she will also make at least $1000 in Social Security. If you watch your money you can survive comfortably, on two thousand in Social Security as a couple, without working, after you reach 65 on benefits alone in most of the country. (Unless you live in expensive places like Washington DC, NYC or California).

My Grandparents lived comfortably on Social Security only (About $2100 between them) up to their death last year.
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Old 01-08-2015, 09:10 AM
 
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, originally from SF Bay Area
29,873 posts, read 54,582,197 times
Reputation: 31268
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Professional View Post
If you are married and worked full time for most of your adult life, you should be able to get at least a $1000 in Social Security even if you made no more than $20,000 a year. If your wife or husband had also worked during their lifestyle he/she will also make at least $1000 in Social Security. If you watch your money you can survive comfortably, on two thousand in Social Security as a couple, without working, after you reach 65 on benefits alone in most of the country. (Unless you live in expensive places like Washington DC, NYC or California).

My Grandparents lived comfortably on Social Security only (About $2100 between them) up to their death last year.
That's the key, move to an area you can afford. My mother-in-law also passed last year at age 95, and her social security was only $700/month.
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Old 01-08-2015, 09:21 AM
 
33,046 posts, read 22,099,000 times
Reputation: 8970
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveinMtAiry View Post
Now if you do not want to shovel a driveway at 70 that's another discussion But there are virtually no examples that will show that renting is less expensive than owning.

Let's use my area as an example. The house across the street rents for $1,600 a month and would probably sell for $300,000, taxes are probably $3,500/year. When you rent you are still responsible for utility costs in most instances, if not then the rent is increase to account for this expense to the owner. So some are arguing that maintenance, taxes etc on that home will add up to $1,600/month? Not a chance. How often do you replace the carpet in a home anyway? You would need to do it 3 times a year to have that math add up. A roof is a HUGE expense, but one that needs to be done no more than once every 15 years. Cost is around $10,000, which is less than the cost of rent for 7 months.

Our house was built in 1900. It also sits on 5 acres with lots of trees and grass to mow. I know a thing or 2 about a house with high maintenance costs. There is not a chance my maintenance and taxes come close to $1,600/month. And this is a high maintenance single family home, a condo has much lower maintenance costs obviously. Sure there is a condo fee but that's factored in when the rent is calculated so the renter is basically paying that too.

There are very very few examples of renting being less expensive than owning. The only argument I can see is it frees up cash to be invested but even at a great return of say 9% it still won't come close to covering your rent.

How much of the cost of roof replacement is labor? My landlord reroofed the house himself in perhaps 15 hours tops.
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Old 01-08-2015, 09:24 AM
 
673 posts, read 2,030,179 times
Reputation: 875
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemlock140 View Post
That's the key, move to an area you can afford. My mother-in-law also passed last year at age 95, and her social security was only $700/month.
At that low income she would have been eligible for foodstamps and Medicaid (if she didn't have a lot of savings), so with no income taxes, it certainly would be doable for a mostly housebound person, with no car, etc.
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Old 01-08-2015, 09:26 AM
 
33,046 posts, read 22,099,000 times
Reputation: 8970
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Professional View Post
If you are married and worked full time for most of your adult life, you should be able to get at least a $1000 in Social Security even if you made no more than $20,000 a year. If your wife or husband had also worked during their lifestyle he/she will also make at least $1000 in Social Security. If you watch your money you can survive comfortably, on two thousand in Social Security as a couple, without working, after you reach 65 on benefits alone in most of the country. (Unless you live in expensive places like Washington DC, NYC or California).

My Grandparents lived comfortably on Social Security only (About $2100 between them) up to their death last year.

Depends largely on housing costs. Rent will cost a couple $1000 or more per month in many areas; owning will be much cheaper in many places especially if you have no mortgage payment.
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