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Old 04-25-2014, 07:07 PM
 
Location: middle tennessee
1,925 posts, read 990,367 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
You're not even a senior until you're 65. So what does anything pre-age 65 have to do with most stuff seniors deal with? Robyn
we must have read different articles
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Old 04-25-2014, 10:16 PM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 67,179,255 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua Blue View Post
Does anyone have the statistics of the percentage of persons needing nursing home care? I have in my mind that it is a low number like 25% or one in four.
In 2011, stats are that only about 3.6% of folks 65 and older were in nursing home facilities.

That increases with age, as one would expect.

About 11 % of folks over 85 were in nursing home care, in 2011.

you might find this report a good read (I did)

http://www.aoa.gov/Aging_Statistics/...012profile.pdf
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Old 04-25-2014, 10:40 PM
 
Location: Southwest Washington State
21,867 posts, read 14,390,517 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biscuitmom View Post
Assisted Living eligibility requirements are that the person needs assistance with activities in these categories: bathing, dressing, eating, transferring (getting out of bed, moving from one room or place to another), continence, toileting.
I don't see how remote monitoring and technology play a role in any of those.
As far as I know, anyone can pay for and live in an ALF. When my mom lived there, there were always a few more "with it" people who lived there. Some people are OK mentally but can't take care of themselves physically. Others cope fairly well, but live there for some reason. Most of course can't function at all by themselves. And of course, if you live long enough, you will deteriorate and possibly need to be housed in a locked down unit, or memory care unit.

But basically I agree with you about the inevitability of needing personal care for normal daily activities, for persons who are disabled or who have dementia. The longer we live, the more likely it is that we will need these services.
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Old 04-25-2014, 10:46 PM
 
Location: Southwest Washington State
21,867 posts, read 14,390,517 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
I quoted this part of your message:

I don't worry about not being able to pay for long term care, at home or in an institution, should I live beyond my ability to manage my own life. And before anybody jumps in to say that their tax money will be used to pay for my care, you'll have to catch me first...

The piece you re-quoted is only talking about SNFs - not ALFs or similar. According to the professionals in the field I know - about 50% of all people will need care in some kind of non-independent living place before they die. Many have various degrees of dementia and require custodial care in ALFs - which - for the most part - isn't covered by things like Medicaid. Also - my father at age 95 - can't live entirely independently (although he's pretty close). He lives in a senior independent care facility here (in a 2 bedroom/2 bath villa situation that provides meals - cleaning - transportation - entertainment - emergency calls - etc.). Costs $4500/month. His sister lives in a similar place in another more expensive state (New York). Costs her about $6000/month for a smaller residence. In the absence of money - both might be "warehoused" in more institutional settings.

I am not clear on your neighbor who calls 911. Because you haven't said anything about his personal situation. How do you think he should live?

And how old are you? It's really easy to be glib about this stuff when you're younger. Not as easy when you're older. And - to me - you're not old unless you're > 80. Although some people can develop problems at younger ages (< 80) - and some don't have problems until they're older (> 90). You should never look at someone else as an "inspiration" - or a "big baby" - because you never know what hand *you've* been dealt. Robyn
If someone is destitute, he or she can be housed in an ALF that takes the person's Medicaid benefits, leaving a small portion for personal needs. These places are generally not as pleasant as other places that do not take Medicaid patients. But these people are placed in ALFs and LTC places. Some ALFs will take a person as long as he or she can pay and then will force them to leave, and other places will continue to house them, accepting the bulk of their Medicaid payments. The laws about what ALFs and LTC places are allowed to do vary from state to state.
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Old 04-25-2014, 11:04 PM
 
Location: Southwest Washington State
21,867 posts, read 14,390,517 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rh71 View Post
I started my 401k when I was 22 so I'll have plenty by the time I retire. My point is there's no sense hoarding more for the sake of saving for later - you can still spend and not be broke later (especially if you admit to hoarding). I have to ask why you wouldn't RATHER spend money when you were younger compared to now. Big house for just the 2 (or 1) of you or nice car to go hardly anywhere when you're a senior...? Doesn't make logical sense to me. What are you doing with money having the time of your life now that you did not want to do when young? I think most would say travel. Then again, most don't travel many months of the year but make it seem like that's a huge deal. When you're older, you just have a lot of time on your hands and probably have to purposely find things to spend money on. Then there are potentially other factors like health and disability. That's just the way I see it so I'd love to hear where I'm mistaken.
I think we have to find balance as we live our lives. DH and I often talked about this. We felt that we should prepare for the future, but enjoy our lives in the present. For awhile, with our kids, we felt really poor. There were about 10 years when kids were in college that we felt strapped. When we were no longer supporting them, we began to feel less burdened, and we indulged ourselves more. There were years when the kids were younger that we tried to live in the moment more. But we did think about the spend now/save now dilemma.

I will say that having savings has made our present lives much easier. And I also want to say that we have been incredibly blessed in our lives. We had some bad luck, but had a some good luck too. Both of us worked hard. We do not have money to throw around, but we feel fairly secure, and that is very sweet at this time of life.

I still have to decide issues involving save or spend. I think I shared already that I chose to invest a small sum that I received after the death of a relative. I did spend some money though to buy something I had wanted for a long time. So, again, I seek balance.

I also want to mention that I did not feel the need to save when I was much younger. I wanted what everyone wants at that time in their lives. As we aged we began to be concerned about our financial future. I wish we had put money aside and invested it intelligently much earlier.
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Old 04-26-2014, 05:51 AM
 
29,782 posts, read 34,876,173 times
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Another reason to have so much is that maybe just maybe some of our planned for resources like pensions/annuities may have payout issues down the road and we may need a sizable nest egg to fall back on. There have been financial instrument failures and those dependent on probably wish they had big nest eggs if they didn't.
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Old 04-26-2014, 07:52 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles area
14,018 posts, read 17,744,100 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silibran View Post
As far as I know, anyone can pay for and live in an ALF. When my mom lived there, there were always a few more "with it" people who lived there. Some people are OK mentally but can't take care of themselves physically. Others cope fairly well, but live there for some reason. Most of course can't function at all by themselves. And of course, if you live long enough, you will deteriorate and possibly need to be housed in a locked down unit, or memory care unit.
Good point. There are also "independent living" facilities which resemble assisted living facilities but without the personal help with bathing/dressing/etc. My mother lived in one the last two months of her life. Included in the rent were two meals a day in the dining hall (although her apartment had a small kitchen and a refrigerator), once-a-week maid service which included washing the towels and sheets, and a van which provided trips to the market and to doctors' appointments. There was a beauty parlor on-site and my sister and I thought the whole set-up was very nice. One could transition to actual "assisted" living (for an increased price, of course) in the same complex.

Although my mother had stopped driving before moving in there, some of the residents still drove. The drivers probably didn't really need to be there, but I respected their wisdom in choosing a situation in which many things were taken care of before it became absolutely necessary.
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Old 04-26-2014, 08:25 AM
 
1,770 posts, read 2,443,971 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hunterseat View Post
Did anyone mention emergency funds for catastrophic events (tree falls on house, the car needs a major repair, refrigerator goes kaput)
I can sort of see what the op is saying but she has a different mentality about life, I'm guessing. She is content with what she has and can be happy with a simple life. I'm much that way myself. I like being at home puttering around, reading, cooking, doing a little yard work...Boring...just the way I like it.
You are correct about the catastrophic events. In my retirement it is the expensive and unexpected expenses that continue to plague me. Eg: 2 under concrete water leaks in the past few months each costing over $800 to repair. Then the "big freeze" in New Mexico in 2011 which did severe damage, brought in bark beetle and has affected some of my 90 year old Italian stone pines and eldarica pines. I am spending $3,000 annually on tree service since then. Add to that enormous vet bills for 3, 14 yrs old dogs, my own dental and medical, and the so-called budget is the joke of the century.

And I also enjoy the simple life now: puttering around the house but as you can see, that can become enormously expensive.

Sure I can sell out, kill off the dogs and get an apartment but I'd rather die first. I think all we retirees agree that one must save as much as possible when young, invest, and then hope for the best.
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Old 04-26-2014, 02:23 PM
 
7,928 posts, read 5,045,305 times
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Ultimately the reason for the money is psychological. It just feels good to have a large portfolio. It just feels good to have a safety cushion and to have adequate cause to regard oneself as being above the fray, above the vicissitudes and oscillations of the economy.

For some people, it feels better to enjoy the moment, to build comfortable lives, to build lasting memories enabled by the judicious spending of money. Others are more driven by fear of penury. Still others prefer to accumulate money not from concern for the proverbial rainy day, but because their self-esteem is indexed to their portfolio.

Many of us of course have families and family obligations that preclude saving as much as we'd like. Others have student-loans, or healthcare expenses. But then there's a contingent of people, who from luck or planning or just the alignment of life's forces, have no dependents and no debts, but who enjoy a reasonable salary, and have the fortitude to live on a tiny fraction of that salary. Why do this? Isn't this misery? Perhaps. But there's a deep psychological reason. Every dollar not spend, every dollar going into investments, is another climb up the ladder. It's an overwhelming feeling of doing a kind of good, of building oneself up. It can become addictive. It's certainly not for everyone.

Ultimately, we all labor under insecurities and conflict between appetite and reality. Fanatical savings for a mythical old-age is just another form of such conflict. But I'd argue that it is relatively benign. There are dumber ways to live.
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Old 04-26-2014, 05:03 PM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 17,935,948 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohio_peasant View Post
Ultimately the reason for the money is psychological...
No - the reason to have more money is to avoid dealing with a whole lot of Moderator cut: language

My husband and I had a most unpleasant encounter today at a local museum. Somehow got involved in a conversation with 2 teachers (1 high school - aged 72 - 1 university - aged 80). These people were still working because they have a middle aged son with lots of "needs" (who is costing them $40k+/year). And they were blaming every politician who's been in office in Florida over the last 3 decades for their sorry state.

Like I said - an unpleasant encounter. But the problems these and other other people have can be solved with money. Of course - most problems people have are less expensive. But I never want to be in a position where I can't afford a new set of nice tires - or to fix a roof leak - or to pick up a new washing machine if mine dies - not to mention buying a med my doctor says I should be taking - etc. because I don't have money. Robyn

Last edited by Oldhag1; 04-26-2014 at 08:19 PM..
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