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Old 09-20-2014, 03:50 PM
 
Location: SoCal desert
8,093 posts, read 13,244,051 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BucFan View Post
Most of my concern is the recent discussion that these programs are going to be jacking up premium rates soon and often.
It also depends on where you live when it comes to increases.

Last year, the California Department of Insurance approved a 40 percent rate hike for some LTC policies covered by John Hancock Life Insurance Co., and gave Genworth Financial Inc. the go-ahead for an 18 percent increase.
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Old 09-20-2014, 04:59 PM
 
71,767 posts, read 71,875,234 times
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they were getting caught up on the mis-priced policies. they had been denied the increases they needed the years prior. genworth was increasing rates on policies bought between 1994 and 2001 in 2010.

A John Hancock study found that the number of claims, the length of claims and the use of benefits from 1990 to 2010 were much higher than the company had expected particularly the open-ended expense of providing lifetime benefits to an aging population with an increasingly long life expectancy.

rates are much better adjusted to costs the last few years now that there is a decent history.

boy ,when we first looked in to ltc many years ago they were offering lifetime coverage and you could even pay lump sum up front and be done .

we blew that by waiting but it shows you how mis-priced these were..

Last edited by mathjak107; 09-20-2014 at 05:21 PM..
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Old 09-20-2014, 05:23 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
10,014 posts, read 16,688,406 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
....

boy ,when we first looked in to ltc many years ago they were offering lifetime coverage and you could even pay lump sum up front and be done .

we blew that by waiting but it shows you how mis-priced these were..
We bought one of those, paid up in 10 years.

They are no longer offered.. wonder why??
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Old 09-20-2014, 05:29 PM
 
71,767 posts, read 71,875,234 times
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We debated and debated and said we are to young yet ,lets wait.

Worst decision we made was too wait because we didn't want to lay out the bucks. So we missed the lifetime policies at those insane low rates.

Now folks do not realize how low these policies were priced so when they finally got the approval to raise the old policies it scared the new customers when they saw these rate hikes. But there was a reason behind them.

Last edited by mathjak107; 09-20-2014 at 05:32 PM.. Reason: d
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Old 09-22-2014, 06:01 PM
 
Location: Tampa, FL
27,798 posts, read 26,239,955 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalara View Post
It also depends on where you live when it comes to increases.

Last year, the California Department of Insurance approved a 40 percent rate hike for some LTC policies covered by John Hancock Life Insurance Co., and gave Genworth Financial Inc. the go-ahead for an 18 percent increase.
guess if the premiums become too outrageous and unaffordable, I'll drop the policy......and take the consequences of a catastrophic injury/illness if it happens (and empty my bank acct/investments/sell the house, car, beg on the corner, etc).
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Old 09-23-2014, 02:18 AM
 
71,767 posts, read 71,875,234 times
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eventually it may be like life insurance where rates are pretty stable.

the rules of large numbers rarely change dramatically from what is expected. these policies were new and had no history for the actuaries to work with and as you see the lifetime deals killed the insurers.

huge rate hikes happened but there was a good reason for it. now they pretty much not only have it under control but if the insurers are as careful as genworth appears to be as to who they take the insurers are cutting their risks better.
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Old 09-23-2014, 11:38 AM
 
4,490 posts, read 4,751,034 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BucFan View Post
guess if the premiums become too outrageous and unaffordable, I'll drop the policy......and take the consequences of a catastrophic injury/illness if it happens (and empty my bank acct/investments/sell the house, car, beg on the corner, etc).

Don't know how this works but am thinking... if you drop the policy then you lose all the money you put into it? Like thousands possibly?
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Old 09-23-2014, 11:44 AM
 
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Just like auto insurance ,term life or your home insurance. your premium you pay only covers you for a year .

why would you think otherwise with LTC insurance?
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Old 09-23-2014, 12:32 PM
 
2,429 posts, read 3,227,603 times
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Yes, mathjack, you're right.
LTCI is like most other insurance.....you pay premiums, and you're covered for as long as you pay. Just like with car, renters, or homeowners -- if you quit paying, you're not covered.

During the MONTHS of learning about LTCI as I was deciding about it -- realizing that issue was one of the things that finally clicked for me.

Personally, I still can't get past (hopefully) not needing the coverage for 30 years. For example, I really don't fear or have a concern that my car insurance premium would ever increase to the point where I can't afford it. But 20 years from now that could very well happen with a LTC policy. I guess it's a 'mental thing' but to start paying for something that's not cheap in the first place -- AND that you hope you don't need for 30 years, AND have a concern about being able to afford in the closer you get to needing it, AND not know if the insurance company might try to stall you and not pay -- for me that's asking a lot.

As a side rant I know it makes no sense to be upset because federal workers get better benefits than other workers, because I'm sure I get better benefits that someone else. But the lower rates that Fed workers get for LTC are a lot better than what most people get. It's just envy I guess.

Below are some of the LTCI rates I got.....being single with no kids.....I'm self insuring.....I'm just not tying up this kind of money for the 'concerns about the unknowns' that I have. (The hybrid policy rates were slightly higher)

AGE....POLICY MAX.....Max Monthly Benefit*..... Inflat Prot.....CASH Benefit.....Monthly Premium
53........160,600.........3,300................... .......3%................partial.............$211. 71
53........139,200.........2,900................... .......CPI...............none................$200. 10
53........123,744.........2,578................... .......3%...............partial..............$200. 03
54........219,000.........150 A DAY*...................3%...............none...... .........$202.45

Besides....it buoys me in my decision that you also have said if you were single you wouldn't get it either.
I don't even know you but your advice and counsel have been dead on.....about so many other things....you're my "E.F. Hutton" !!
(Young people won't even know what that reference is.....but this is the retirement forum so most readers might remember it)
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Old 09-23-2014, 04:51 PM
 
1,227 posts, read 1,261,865 times
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This reminds me very much of the TV commercial where there are 4 people in a car and the action suddenly stops. The driver turns to the passengers and says: "we are about to have an accident. Is everyone buckled up?" and everyone checks their seat belt, and when the last person has made sure they were safely buckled in, the action resumes and the car is hit.

There is no way to know at what age, or on what date, you will need long-term care. Life doesn't stop so that you can purchase it 30 seconds before a fall or an illness or an accident. I needed long-term care in my 20's. I wasn't the youngest one there either. My husband just needed long-term care last year. One minute he was fine. The next minute he was incapacitated and needed a home nurse.

Insurance is not bought because you know with certainty that you are going to need it. It is purchased because you hope you won't need it but will have it in case you do need it.
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