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Old 06-19-2014, 05:27 PM
 
Location: St. George, Utah
756 posts, read 886,516 times
Reputation: 1971

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BayAreaHillbilly View Post
Ski off into the wilderness. At some point the combo of hunger, hypothermia plus perhaps some little helpers. Or maybe end up like Brad Pitt's character near the end of "Legends of the Fall."

It was a good death.
Please leave a note so that search and rescue workers don't risk their lives trying to find and "save" you!
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Old 06-19-2014, 08:24 PM
 
Location: Near a river
16,042 posts, read 19,017,552 times
Reputation: 15649
Quote:
Originally Posted by texan2yankee View Post
I am a younger than you, early retired from private industry, and am finding this time, right now, is the BEST time of my life. No stress, no kids to raise, a happy marriage and time, precious time, to do whatever I want.
Did you read the OP? She has a specific question.
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Old 06-19-2014, 08:26 PM
 
Location: Near a river
16,042 posts, read 19,017,552 times
Reputation: 15649
Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post
I'm planning on living to 150. Hope to still be working in my 80's and 90's. If everything works to plan our net worth should be in the $5million range by the time I am 75. I can't see the future or have any idea how the markets will react but I have an idea how they have reacted over time. Our home will be paid off in the next 10 years. We are working to position ourselves to purchase rentals as well and hope to include that in our retirement portfolio. I have been working at the hospital for close to 17 years now. A former Director retired after 51 + years and that gave me a goal to shoot for. I plan on putting in 55 or more years here.

Now here is the deal. I live on the coast in California. The ocean is something that I see everyday. I don't need to retire and move to a destination city. I live that life now. I know people work 40 or more years then retire to Florida or some other destination place. They want mild weather year round, access to outdoor activities, places to have fun. I live that now. That is my life now. To top it off I love working at the hospital and do not want to end my job for many years to come.
Did you read the OP? She doesn't want to know how well you're doing. She has a question for herself and others in her situation.
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Old 06-20-2014, 12:27 AM
 
10,824 posts, read 8,090,324 times
Reputation: 17038
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaryleeII View Post
This is a great idea----rental income! We currently live in a 5 bdr/3 bath home, which is more than adequate for us and our 2 kids. We plan on keeping this home into retirement. It can be a "dorm" for the kids as they attend nearby colleges, its nice just for the two of us, it has a nice, private section we could rent out. Then, if we needed to go into ALF, well, we could rent out the home for a positive cash flow---we intend to have the home paid off in about 10 years. Great idea---now I have all bases covered
Specifically, this is how it's working for MIL:

ALF fee: $3900 a month
Incidentals (Depends, prescription meds, haircut, dry-cleaning): $120 a month
Total Outgo: $4020 a month

Social Security income: $1250 a month
Veteran's (widow) Aid&Assistance income: $1100 a month
Rental income: $1350 a month
Total income: $3700 a month

Shortfall: $320 a month, which comes out of her savings/investment of approx. $60000.

Property taxes and maintenance for her house also come out of the 60K. Last year those costs ran about 4K, including replacement of a sewer line*.
With this basis, we figure she's good for several years. Her ALF costs will increase with inflation but so will her rental income. Increases in property taxes will be passed on to renters.
We opened one credit card in her name to cover her incidentals and costs for maintenance on the house. This greatly simplified tracking expenses and taxes.

(* Replacement of sewer line was due to house sitting vacant for several months while dh's siblings dithered over whether to rent it. Moral: vacant houses are NOT a good investment; either rent 'em or sell 'em, but keep someone living in them.)
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Old 06-20-2014, 05:18 AM
 
3 posts, read 2,180 times
Reputation: 23
After dealing with a very sick husband and watching my 94-year-old dad not age gracefully, I've planned according:
1. Got LTCI as family does have some longevity on both sides.
2. I am overweight, but my health numbers (cholesterol, blood sugar, etc) are all good, so I am committed to walking and other daily exercise.
3. I changed from a tri-level to single level house.
4. I plan on staying in my own house until early or mid 70's, when I will move into assisted living, hopefully somewhere with continuum of care.
5. If I have a serious health issue before then, would have to commit to full rehab hospitalization before going home, and would have to arrange for at least a couple of hours of daily help.
6. Have done most of the legal paperwork, so have will, living will, medical POA, etc. Still need to work on the "springing" POA as I am researching elder care issues / trustees. Also will pre-plan funeral.

Being in denial and avoiding the associated planning just didn't make sense, although I see that all around me. I would not be comfortable without thinking about possibilities and contingencies to deal with various scenarios.

When I retire, hopefully in a few years, I want to just enjoy doing what I want to do.
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Old 06-20-2014, 08:14 AM
 
Location: St. George, Utah
756 posts, read 886,516 times
Reputation: 1971
For my grandmother (92), she remained in her home long past the point where she could not care for herself properly--let alone the home. He elderly sister took her grocery shopping every week or two, and some extended family checked in on her. I encouraged her to come live with us when I visited and found she was not eating well and was weak. Her sons did not make a move to change the situation, saying "She refuses to leave her home." This has been their out for failing to make a better plan for her for years.

Finally her weakness took a toll--she fell and ended up in the hospital. What was wrong with her? Malnourishment, essentially. After rehab, she left the home she'd lived in for 70+ years and her remaining siblings with whom she's extremely close, and came to live with us in MT.

She has VERY little SS income, about $1k/month I believe (I do not have POA so no access to this info). She owns half of a house in common with her late SIL/BIL's estate, so that is tied up.

Right now she lives in my home where I care for her general needs--bathing, meals, laundry, etc. She is still mobile enough to use the bathroom on her own, get in and out of bed, shuffle around the house, read books, etc. Her memory slips but other than that she is in her right mind.

As her needs increase, we will have in-home care to the extent that she is able to afford it and her sons are willing to subsidize. Obviously we will take on some of that cost, but I have issues with bailing the sons out further than we have so we have to draw a line somewhere. If her needs exceed what we can take care of in my home, I believe my father will try to get her on Medicaid and find a home that takes Medicaid. This is a small town; there won't be a lot of choices. The decision will not be based on most ideal placement. It will be based on what's easiest for my dad to do. At that point I'll have to decide whether to find a better placement and pay for it myself.

Sigh. So that's what NOT having a plan looks like with no LTCI and a very modest SS income, because three people deluded themselves that Grandma would live out her life in her own home with no assistance, and die peacefully in her sleep. In a nutshell, to the OP's question, the plan I suppose was "Leave it to whoever in my family will take me to figure it out." I don't mean that in a cruel way, but that is the reality of it. DH and I are trying to do what's best for her with the very limited power we have to do so. She is safe, comfortable, and loved with us now, but I worry what the next few years will bring.
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Old 06-20-2014, 08:30 AM
 
20,260 posts, read 11,233,056 times
Reputation: 20316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Townandcountrygal View Post
Assuming you live to be in your 80s and 90s and may require assisted living, how are you planning for it if you have only SS plus a modest pension, don't have Long Term Care Insurance or relatives to depend on?
LTC insurance, IMO, is going to be found to be a boondoggle expense for elderly care--insurance is simply not a viable model for a near 100% risk, unless the companies have it worked that they won't have to make the payments anyway. I suspect that's likely the case--I suspect that their fine print makes Medicare and pensions the "first payers" and no bill ultimately gets to them even after you've paid into them for years. One way or another, they've got to have some kind of "fix' in the game, because insurance simply doesn't pay for a risk that nearly 100% of people will encounter.


As has been mentioned, in the situation you described SS/Medicare/private pension is usually sufficient for a nursing home. They will simply take all assets and that will be that.

But from the situations I faced with my mother and my father in law--both of whom had both lifetime military income as well as SS/Medicare, there could be difficulty actually finding a "Medicare bed" in a good facility. There will have to be some changes in the market as the Boomer generation passes into that situation, possibly with facilities being required to have a larger proportion of 'Medicare beds."
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Old 06-20-2014, 08:40 AM
 
Location: Glenbogle
730 posts, read 1,030,694 times
Reputation: 1047
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montanama View Post
A lot of people say they don't ever want to get "old" and would hate to live in assisted living, so they'll just off themselves (or whatever) before that will happen. Maybe some of them will. But an awful lot of them just use this "plan" to avoid thinking about and planning for the possibility that they will be incapacitated to one degree or another by age or another vagary of life. Stuff happens. And in reality when most people get "old," they still would like to keep on living.
Sometimes, even when we are "certain" that we will react in a specific way to a situation we find that if we end up actually IN that situation our thinking changes.

After seeing several of my friends die from cancer after spending months horrendously ill from chemo and radiation after surgery, I was "certain" that if it ever happened to me I would go the 'tragic heroine suffering in silence' route, no surgery, no chemo, not even tell family about it until the very end.

But when it did happen to me, when I got that dreaded phone call, you know what? I had about a half hour of conflicting emotions, alternating between my "absolute definite plan" and "hell no, I won't go". And even though I had no health insurance and thus was probably facing financial ruin, the "hell no, I won't go" won out. Survival instinct, baby.

And yet, I was SO VERY SURE that I would "never consider" handling cancer any other way... BEFORE push came to shove and it actually happened.

I'm not saying this to diminish or disparage anyone's feelings or plans on the subject of aging or death or quality of life vs continuance of life. Just pointing out that we can't always know what our feelings will be when faced with reality versus projection/imagination.
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Old 06-20-2014, 08:45 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,734 posts, read 17,677,734 times
Reputation: 27801
Quote:
Originally Posted by StressedOutNYer View Post
Sometimes, even when we are "certain" that we will react in a specific way to a situation we find that if we end up actually IN that situation our thinking changes.

After seeing several of my friends die from cancer after spending months horrendously ill from chemo and radiation after surgery, I was "certain" that if it ever happened to me I would go the 'tragic heroine suffering in silence' route, no surgery, no chemo, not even tell family about it until the very end.

But when it did happen to me, when I got that dreaded phone call, you know what? I had about a half hour of conflicting emotions, alternating between my "absolute definite plan" and "hell no, I won't go". And even though I had no health insurance and thus was probably facing financial ruin, the "hell no, I won't go" won out. Survival instinct, baby.

And yet, I was SO VERY SURE that I would "never consider" handling cancer any other way... BEFORE push came to shove and it actually happened.

I'm not saying this to diminish or disparage anyone's feelings or plans on the subject of aging or death or quality of life vs continuance of life. Just pointing out that we can't always know what our feelings will be when faced with reality versus projection/imagination.
Did you end up losing your house, retirement, or anything else significant trying to stay afloat?
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Old 06-20-2014, 09:10 AM
 
13,060 posts, read 15,433,007 times
Reputation: 15325
I plan to die before I get to that point. I'm serious. That is exactly what my dad did. His prostate cancer had returned and I am sure he knew it, but he kept quiet about it. He was always adamant that he didn't want to live in a nursing home or assisted living or anything like that. He was also adamant that he was not going to be a burden on anyone. I think he made a decision to let nature take its course. He took care of my mom and always got the best of care for her, but not for himself. He knew if he let us know that he was sick, we'd insist on getting care/treatment for him, and he didn't want that. He didn't want to live longer, only to have to spend that time in a care facility or hospital or whatever.

We were all surprised when he died suddenly, and found out after the fact that his prostate cancer had metastasized all over his body. I don't know how he kept going so long. He was living in his own house and driving until one day before he died. If I need to stop taking medication and/or refuse care to hasten things, I will. And they'd better not determine me in incompetent and force me to get care!

In retrospect, I think his plan was a good one and I think I will do the same thing. When it becomes clear that I am on a downhill course, I will let nature take its course.
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