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Old 08-13-2014, 11:03 AM
 
Location: SW Florida
9,743 posts, read 7,025,154 times
Reputation: 14219

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bUU View Post
Easy to take a self-centered, avaricious position when one is talking about someone else's life, someone else's worth, someone else's dignity.

I'm sorry you felt threatened by moral repudiation of the antisocial perspectives you prefer. Regardless, I'm talking about the morality of the decisions regarding the nation's economy and its impact on people, not any specific person's money. This highlights a critical lesson you need to learn - that life is not always just all about you.

It is sad to read about the puerile and petulant nature of NC politics.
I'll cut through all the self-righteousness and pretension expressed in your post to inform you that when it's MY dime that's expected to support someone else's life, dignity, and self-worth, when so many of those I must support through MY efforts and hard work won't do it themselves, it damn well is about me.....and about everyone else who works to keep the public trough supplied.
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Old 08-13-2014, 11:06 AM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 67,141,087 times
Reputation: 22373
Quote:
Originally Posted by Emigrations View Post
At a very cursory glance, NC has kind of been a "worse of both worlds" in my assumption. You have the low wages of Southern states, but some of the highest taxes for a red state in the South.
Actually, when our manufacturing base - textiles and furniture - were in good shape, we were definitely NOT a low wage state nor were we a state with a strained budget. And we have always had very reaonable housing (and overall COL) in this state.

The problem is jobs, not taxes.

I don't know where you are getting the info about our state being one of the highest tax states, especially when you consider what those taxes are buying. We have one of the finest higher education systems in the entire country. There is a lot more to quality of life than tax rate (be it high or low).

You have to consider the demographics of the population when looking at social programs, too. And outmigration and inmigration. Who are the people coming here? Who are the ones leaving? What corporations are here, what corporations have left - and where did they go? What percentage of the population are retirees? Crime rate? And what type of crime and who is committing the crime? How much is that costing any given state?

Yes, there is a lot more to consider than just taxes. I, for one, will gladly pay higher taxes if it means a lowered crime rate, robust infrastructure, and economic stability (jobs).

NC needs jobs. Bottom line.
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Old 08-13-2014, 11:13 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,093 posts, read 72,469,891 times
Reputation: 27565
Quote:
Originally Posted by TuborgP View Post
You make a good point, it can be easier to move from some states because of high taxes than to move to another because of low taxes. Long Island, Jersey etc are easy to identify as high. Finding low and nice might not be as easy. I am fine with NC even if they go up some.
Finding the low is easy. It's finding the "nice" part that throws many people off.
They want all the amenities and services that high taxes provide; they just don't want to pay those high taxes.

That is one of the big reasons I like Texas. The taxes are localized.
I left the Austin area because they are trying to be the next Seattle, Portland, etc.
I'm now near College Station which is quite content to remain the sleepy college town it is.
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Old 08-13-2014, 11:15 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,093 posts, read 72,469,891 times
Reputation: 27565
Quote:
Originally Posted by anifani821 View Post
Actually, when our manufacturing base - textiles and furniture - were in good shape, we were definitely NOT a low wage state nor were we a state with a strained budget. And we have always had very reaonable housing (and overall COL) in this state.

The problem is jobs, not taxes.

I don't know where you are getting the info about our state being one of the highest tax states, especially when you consider what those taxes are buying. We have one of the finest higher education systems in the entire country. There is a lot more to quality of life than tax rate (be it high or low).

You have to consider the demographics of the population when looking at social programs, too. And outmigration and inmigration. Who are the people coming here? Who are the ones leaving? What corporations are here, what corporations have left - and where did they go? What percentage of the population are retirees? Crime rate? And what type of crime and who is committing the crime? How much is that costing any given state?

Yes, there is a lot more to consider than just taxes. I, for one, will gladly pay higher taxes if it means a lowered crime rate, robust infrastructure, and economic stability (jobs).

NC needs jobs. Bottom line.
High taxes though won't bring jobs especially since we're now service oriented and those are typically low paying jobs.
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Old 08-13-2014, 12:51 PM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,554 posts, read 17,535,380 times
Reputation: 27591
Quote:
Originally Posted by anifani821 View Post
Actually, when our manufacturing base - textiles and furniture - were in good shape, we were definitely NOT a low wage state nor were we a state with a strained budget. And we have always had very reaonable housing (and overall COL) in this state.

The problem is jobs, not taxes.

I don't know where you are getting the info about our state being one of the highest tax states, especially when you consider what those taxes are buying. We have one of the finest higher education systems in the entire country. There is a lot more to quality of life than tax rate (be it high or low).

You have to consider the demographics of the population when looking at social programs, too. And outmigration and inmigration. Who are the people coming here? Who are the ones leaving? What corporations are here, what corporations have left - and where did they go? What percentage of the population are retirees? Crime rate? And what type of crime and who is committing the crime? How much is that costing any given state?

Yes, there is a lot more to consider than just taxes. I, for one, will gladly pay higher taxes if it means a lowered crime rate, robust infrastructure, and economic stability (jobs).

NC needs jobs. Bottom line.
It's not among the highest tax states, but NC still has an income tax of nearly 6%. That's 6% more I have to earn in NC vs. TN/FL/TX, assuming all other things equal.

I live in Indiana - not what most people would consider a high tax state. I have to pay almost 4% in state income tax (roughly $120/month), another 1% to Hamilton County, IN ($30/month), and there are other miscellaneous taxes and feeds here that way higher than TN. TN has no county/state level earned income tax. Registering/tagging my Hyundai Elantra cost nearly $500 here - it was $31.50 out the door in TN. Simply going onto the premises of Brown County State Park is $5/visit - in TN, admission to a state park costs nothing. If you go once a week, that's a $20/month bill just to go to the park.

I don't think I get much for my tax dollar here, except at the municipal level, which is more of a function of Hamilton County's wealth (median HHI in Carmel is right around $100k) than the tax itself. We have a terrific municipal park system that is free, a walking track in a state of the art gym facility that is free (membership to use the facility and waterpark is only $35/month). Schools in most of Indiana are average to slightly below, crime in a lot of areas, particularly Indy proper, is as bad as TN. It just doesn't feel like I get any value for what I pay.
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Old 08-13-2014, 01:28 PM
 
1,979 posts, read 1,789,454 times
Reputation: 1251
Geez this thread is long.

I don't have the time to read through all of it, so I will just go ahead and get back on OPs topic.

I am generation X. We slack. We also didn't get the opportunity of those older than us for cool things like pensions. It's 401ks and ROTH IRAs all day, everyday. My entire retirement, and hope of retirement, is based on the whims of the stock market.

I have literally been saving since I was 20 something. My "retirement" savings (all 1,000 of it maybe) would get wiped out, with the next layoff around the corner (I'm in Tech), or the nosedive hellride that has been the market for the last few years. I faithfully put away at least 10% of my salary in my 401K now, and a little bit more in my ROTH.

But between the max limits set and the number of years I have left 'til retirement age the math simply does not work out to plan for enough to live on for an additional 30 years.

One thing people of my generation have got going for us, is that the Echo boomers are as large a population as the Baby Boomers were, and there's a lot less of us, so unless Republicans succeed in fulling gutting Social Security, at least there will be that.

I'm not betting on it though - because when it comes to retirement my generation consistently gets screwed. Join a company or agency that has a pension program, and before you can get vested, they've done away with it. lol

Currently my retirement plan is to die before the money runs out.

And that's what Slouching towards Gommorrah is all about.
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Old 08-13-2014, 01:34 PM
 
Location: Glenbogle
730 posts, read 1,026,458 times
Reputation: 1046
The ironic thing is that with all the multitude of taxing entities that bloat our property tax bills, NY does NOT have a yearly tax on your car. I'd honestly never heard of such a thing before a few years ago. Our license plate registrations renew every other year (the cost is based on the weight of the car, only; but if you don't have one of the fancy or customized license plates which are an extra charge, it's typically less than $100 for the 24 mos) and the cost of the yearly safety inspection is $37... but that's it.

Of course our sales tax rate (state + county) is currently 8.625%, while some other states who do have annual car taxes have a lower sales tax rate. The money has to come from somewhere, whether it be annual excise taxes or sales taxes. *sigh*
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Old 08-13-2014, 01:39 PM
 
Location: Florida
4,103 posts, read 4,271,822 times
Reputation: 10054
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tryska View Post
Geez this thread is long.

I don't have the time to read through all of it, so I will just go ahead and get back on OPs topic.

I am generation X. We slack. We also didn't get the opportunity of those older than us for cool things like pensions. It's 401ks and ROTH IRAs all day, everyday. My entire retirement, and hope of retirement, is based on the whims of the stock market.

I have literally been saving since I was 20 something. My "retirement" savings (all 1,000 of it maybe) would get wiped out, with the next layoff around the corner (I'm in Tech), or the nosedive hellride that has been the market for the last few years. I faithfully put away at least 10% of my salary in my 401K now, and a little bit more in my ROTH.

But between the max limits set and the number of years I have left 'til retirement age the math simply does not work out to plan for enough to live on for an additional 30 years.

One thing people of my generation have got going for us, is that the Echo boomers are as large a population as the Baby Boomers were, and there's a lot less of us, so unless Republicans succeed in fulling gutting Social Security, at least there will be that.

I'm not betting on it though - because when it comes to retirement my generation consistently gets screwed. Join a company or agency that has a pension program, and before you can get vested, they've done away with it. lol

Currently my retirement plan is to die before the money runs out.

And that's what Slouching towards Gommorrah is all about.

You do realize that you can invest OUTSIDE of a retirement account don't you?
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Old 08-13-2014, 01:44 PM
 
1,979 posts, read 1,789,454 times
Reputation: 1251
I am doing that as well. The math still doesn't work out. Clearly I'm just not making enough to support myself for 30 years on savings alone. Which kinda sucks because I am making in roughly the 75th- 80th percentile, depending on what scales you look at.

What does that say about all those folks who are making less?

Frankly I think the "invest in the stock market for retirement" thing is a racket thing anyway, because it leaves too much to chance.
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Old 08-13-2014, 01:50 PM
 
Location: Florida
4,103 posts, read 4,271,822 times
Reputation: 10054
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tryska View Post
I am doing that as well. The math still doesn't work out. Clearly I'm just not making enough to support myself for 30 years on savings alone. Which kinda sucks because I am making in roughly the 75th- 80th percentile, depending on what scales you look at.

What does that say about all those folks who are making less?

Frankly I think the "invest in the stock market for retirement" thing is a racket thing anyway, because it leaves too much to chance.

Right and it doesn't have to just be stocks. You can also invest in real estate, hedges, bonds, precious metals, etc. There are quite a few people I work with that mortgage cheaper homes in my area and rent them out. The tenants are in effect buying them a home by paying rent. Once family I know has 6 of these houses and only had to put in a downpayment.

You have to be creative in times like these. In general I agree with you though, its a sad state of affairs.
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