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[quote=Escort Rider;36313036]You are totally missing the point. This is not about agreeing with or disagreeing with a given ideology or viewpoint. It is about respect for other viewpoints in a debate or discussion. It is the sneering, the blatant contempt for others, the total rudeness of the put-downs, that I object to. I don't know why you of all people can't understand that, as you exhibit civility in your responses to other people, much to your credit. It is the lack of civility that I object to. [
ER, TY for the kind words. I understand how you and others feel. I just don't usually emotionally engage people here or pretty much anywhere. The poster in question gets ignored by me some times and other times I read and respond. If I don't like their response I just go on. I know my involvement in this forum is limited to a few topics of discussion interest. We are having a fantastic long Labor Day Weekend at the Beach with one son and family. If I let any anonymous person or just about anything much bother me shame on me.
Location: Subconscious Syncope, USA (Northeastern US)
2,365 posts, read 2,148,500 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107
lots of folks have no employer sponsered plans. so what? that isn't much of a factor. you can do roths and taxable account savings on your own.
to often folks use that excuse and it only reflects the fact they don't want to learn about what to do , nor do they want to seek advice.
many are funding a family full of i-phones , premium channels on cable and new cars for the kids and then complaining they have nothing left to save.
there are some there are no answers for but for many it is only poor choices and bad decisions that are keeping them from saving.
If you have the extra cash and the knowledge - yes, you can do those things on your own. Some people earn so little they cant even afford a bank account. They will be happy to be employed long enough to slide into Social Security.
Sometimes people dont think they can swing it. I didnt think I could swing it. It took someone explaining to me how I could balance out savings in a way that saved for retirement while reducing my annual tax liability, and even helped produce a higher refund.
Its Allegory of The Cave time - if no one is talking about it, how is anyone in that socio-economic circle going to ever hear about it? On the surface, it doesnt seem possible to make end meets and actually save too - but it is, at least in a lot of cases.
I understand your point, and 'keeping up with the jones' takes its toll on all classes. Just pointing out that you can't lump everyone that doesnt have savings or enough savings to retire under one 'frivilous umbrella'.
We havent all been frivilous.
Worse still is I have co-workers that although everything they need to have more than social security in retirement is offered, and even with the knowledge of how to do it, they still dont think they can afford either the Pension Plan or any of the other offers. Not even 2% can they spare, and they earn more than I do. That's call leading a horse to water, and still it wont drink, lol.
Even without having a fraction of a million saved yet, Im still planning on retiring early. I will have my pension at age 57. I will begin drawing on my TDA at 59 1/2. I will collect Social Security at 62. I will have health insurance provided by my employer when I retire at 57 and onward.
At 57, I will probably still need to work somewhat, although I can certainly switch out to more of a no-brainer position. I might still need to do that at 60 too, but by 62 I hope all 3 will be enough to get by modestly but comfortably on. Im at least hopeful.
While we all believe our life situation is what it is and beyond our control you have to wonder if someone else was in your shoes what would they have done with your life differently.
Of course there is no answer but in life there are always very similiar situations and yet one thrives and one doesn't.
We will always have poor, we will always have a supply of low end workers just because of the fact some can and some can't in life,some will find a way and some won't.
As most know marilyn and i are avid photographers and except for some internet sales we really have no exposure for our work.
On the other hand my sons friend has his photo's in art gallary shows, philidelphia commisioned his work for a campaign. He has a tee shirt line that is selling.
I have no idea how an unknown got this kind of exposure and notariety.
But the fact is he did it. I could have done it if i knew what to do to get those connections or switched to the type of photography he does but the fact is he did it and we didn't.
If someone asked us why we are not in galleries we would say because we are an unknown.
The truth is my sons friend is an unknown as well but he did it.
To us it was an impossibility yet someone else did it.
That is the whole point of this discussion.
Last edited by mathjak107; 08-31-2014 at 05:36 PM..
You get the point. We all think we do or did all we could to help our situation but the fact is someone else always finds a different outcome to the same situation.
If you have the extra cash and the knowledge - yes, you can do those things on your own. Some people earn so little they cant even afford a bank account. They will be happy to be employed long enough to slide into Social Security.
Sometimes people dont think they can swing it. I didnt think I could swing it. It took someone explaining to me how I could balance out savings in a way that saved for retirement while reducing my annual tax liability, and even helped produce a higher refund.
Its Allegory of The Cave time - if no one is talking about it, how is anyone in that socio-economic circle going to ever hear about it? On the surface, it doesnt seem possible to make end meets and actually save too - but it is, at least in a lot of cases.
I understand your point, and 'keeping up with the jones' takes its toll on all classes. Just pointing out that you can't lump everyone that doesnt have savings or enough savings to retire under one 'frivilous umbrella'.
We havent all been frivilous.
Worse still is I have co-workers that although everything they need to have more than social security in retirement is offered, and even with the knowledge of how to do it, they still dont think they can afford either the Pension Plan or any of the other offers. Not even 2% can they spare, and they earn more than I do. That's call leading a horse to water, and still it wont drink, lol.
Even without having a fraction of a million saved yet, Im still planning on retiring early. I will have my pension at age 57. I will begin drawing on my TDA at 59 1/2. I will collect Social Security at 62. I will have health insurance provided by my employer when I retire at 57 and onward.
At 57, I will probably still need to work somewhat, although I can certainly switch out to more of a no-brainer position. I might still need to do that at 60 too, but by 62 I hope all 3 will be enough to get by modestly but comfortably on. Im at least hopeful.
Your pension and medical i bet put you right in the equivelant worth of a high 6 figure savings.
You get the point. We all think we do or did all we could to help our situation but the fact is someone else always finds a different outcome to the same situation.
The OP is a statistical statement and not much else so I lost the discussion flow awhile ago. I thought the discussion would be about the challenges we as a society face and not our individual place in the scheme of things.
it is more about the fact the choices and decisions we make in life all have ramifications down the road. whether someone earns enough or has enough to save for retirement is usually more under their control then they realize.
generally when black swan events happen ,folks blame them for their financial issues but the fact is most of the time it is decisions and choices up to that point that cast the outcome in stone.
it goes back to job choice and going where the money is , as well as spending, lifestyle and emergency fund decisions.
it is more about the fact the choices and decisions we make in life all have ramifications down the road. whether someone earns enough or has enough to save for retirement is usually more under their control then they realize.
generally when black swan events happen ,folks blame them for their financial issues but the fact is most of the time it is decisions and choices up to that point that cast the outcome in stone.
it goes back to job choice and going where the money is , as well as spending, lifestyle and emergency fund decisions.
i think we beat this enough.
We beat that enough but we have only begun to skim the surface of real solutions for real problems as a society. Not how we individually feel about things but what are future alternatives good and bad. Care to share your Thoughts on solutions or outcomes if we do nothing?
The OP is a statistical statement and not much else so I lost the discussion flow awhile ago. I thought the discussion would be about the challenges we as a society face and not our individual place in the scheme of things.
Sadly, when one is bent on touting their wonderfulness and disparaging any and all they feel are beneath them ad infinitum, ad nauseum, discussions will always gravitate toward them and away from the intended flow. I agree with ER that you are measured and civil in your responses, even the ones I don't always agree with.
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