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Old 08-13-2014, 06:19 PM
 
Location: Seattle Area
1,716 posts, read 1,591,624 times
Reputation: 4125

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Escort Rider View Post
It doesn't have to be all or nothing. On can spend money on travel and other enjoyable experiences when young at the same time one has one's eye on the ball in terms of retirement planning. One aspect doesn't have to be totally ignored in order to absolutely maximize the other aspect. There is such a thing as balance, such a thing as a happy medium between two extremes.

I did some pretty cool travel when young - Alaska and the Caribbean for example. But I didn't choose to blow all my money on such stuff. Now, at age 70, I am very glad not to be destitute.

Just last night I returned home from a 25-day car trip extending as far east as Blue Ridge, Georgia. It was very enjoyable. Lots of people are still active and enjoying life in their 70's.
Of course it doesnt HAVE to be. But lets assume you chose to not focus on retirement and had extra money available when younger. Did you ever NOT do something because it was too expensive? Did you NOT buy that brand new BMW because of the price? But if you had, oh imagine the times you might have head, the places you may have gone and the people you may have met. You compromised those things in order to do some short term travelling or purchases, while still holding some back for 40 years later. I just prefer to do anything I want when I'm younger and not compromise for the sake of having something when I'm retired. It just isn't the same to travel when old. It isn't as much fun to drive a new Mercedes and pick up women at 30 as it is at 70. Honestly, having to drive anywhere for 25 days in a car seems like a special kind of hell for those who couldn't afford flying. The only thing worse would be a bus. Now if you took that trip at 40 with a diesel pusher and a toad, it could have been a lot different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Travelassie View Post
Ok, then as I see it you live with the consequences of your decisions. You can spend all your resources, traveling, living the high life, doing anything you fancy when you're young, and saving nothing for later when you no longer earn those resources.

If that is your choice, you have no right when you're old and destitute, to demand that others who have denied themselves some of those pleasures/adventures- to save for a later day, support you because you insisted on instant gratification of your whims and now have nothing to show for all those years of fun.

And no amount of pontificating, appealing to civic responsibilities, trying to lay blame or guilt-trips on
the savers changes this basic fact.

I'm not saying you personally do any of this, but we do know there's an entire establishment who does. Look left.
You are right,m I absolutely agree and I have done all i can to make that happen. The only way it doesn't is if my wife and I are both instantly into a comma and unable to communicate, and estate executor dies at the same time and nobody sees the documents. But your assumption that the only outcome is old AND destitute is incorrect. I'd like to be destitute about the same time as the money runs out, or the first time i cant do something because of my financial condition. That's when it's time to check out with a zero sum balance.
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Old 08-13-2014, 07:05 PM
 
39 posts, read 76,598 times
Reputation: 53
<I am a TN native, and while I think you would be totally fine *financially* in most of TN, please DO NOT move there just because of the taxes. We receive thread after thread on the TN boards where "I'm moving from (insert liberal state) and want everything CHEAP, low taxes, great schools, etc." It doesn't work that way. Taxation is important to consider, but certainly shouldn't be your only reason (or even a main reason) to move to or from somewhere.

Sure, taxes are very low in TN, but you also get very little in return. Schools aren't very good, social/public services are overburdened or nonexistent, and crime (particularly drug and domestic crime) is high all throughout the state. Lots of transplants think rural TN is some kind of quaint Mayberry, but the truth is that rural TN is plagued by poverty, crime, and drugs.

If you stay within a suburb of Knoxville, Nashville, or Chattanooga, or within those cities, you'll be fine. Rural and small town TN is struggling immensely.>

No, no. I'm not moving to TN just because of the taxes. My family is originally from there and I've spent time there with my parents when they would go back to visit. I've also returned as an adult for a few visits. That's why we chose TN. It's familiar and I like it. Good people. Beautiful country.

If you are a native of TN I don't think you can imagine the difference between TN and CA. We have all the meth heads you could possibly want..or not want. And crime. But it's the people and the way they treat others that makes the difference to me between the two. Most people in TN still have manners. It's just a "different vibe"...to use CA jargon .. I'm a native Californian...the last child of 8 and the only one born here. But when I go to TN for some reason I feel at home.
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Old 08-13-2014, 08:11 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles area
14,018 posts, read 17,765,919 times
Reputation: 32309
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yakscsd View Post
...... Honestly, having to drive anywhere for 25 days in a car seems like a special kind of hell for those who couldn't afford flying. The only thing worse would be a bus. Now if you took that trip at 40 with a diesel pusher and a toad, it could have been a lot different.
It's not hell at all if you like to drive, as I do. And I can afford to fly. But flying is a greater hassle if you have to fly to place, rent a car, fly to another place, rent another car, over and over again. I had significant people to visit and/or sights to see in the following places during my 25-day trip: Las Cruces, New Mexico; Austin, Texas; College Station, Texas; Baton Rouge, Louisiana; New Orleans, Louisiana: Jackson, Mississippi; Nashville, Tennessee; Chattanooga, Tennessee; Blue Ridge, Georgia; Little Rock, Arkansas; Santa Fe, New Mexico, and Albuquerque, New Mexico. Maybe you don't like road trips. Fine, but some people do and they are "a special kind of hell" only for those of you who don't. Suppose I picked something you liked and called it hell because it isn't my cup of tea. What arrogance on your part.

Flying is better if the distance is considerable and you are going to that particular place only and then are returning. In October I flew to Little Rock for my niece's wedding.

Speaking of flying, when I was in my 30's my ex-wife and I owned our own small private airplane. That was a great, incomparable experience.

You seem so intent on the correctness of your particular approach that just can't seem to fathom people who have favorable experiences which lie outside of your particular paradigm. You just can't conceive of having a good time unless you spend ALL of the money available to you at a given time. You have a sad lack of vision and imagination, my friend.
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Old 08-13-2014, 08:16 PM
 
Location: middle tennessee
1,926 posts, read 995,239 times
Reputation: 7002
Quote:
Originally Posted by Escort Rider View Post
You seem so intent on the correctness of your particular approach that just can't seem to fathom people who have favorable experiences which lie outside of your particular paradigm.
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Old 08-14-2014, 02:14 AM
 
1,734 posts, read 1,952,756 times
Reputation: 3901
Quote:
Originally Posted by CRobin4564 View Post
My husband is 64, I'm 65. We got married later in life and neither one of us knew much throughout our lives about saving or investment. So here we are. If we're lucky we might end up with $250,000 in investments, $300,000 when we sell our home plus $3000 approx. from SS per month. We live in CA but are planning on moving to a small town in TN. I wonder if we can manage? I mean we have to manage but it is scary.
Credit to nicet4 for driving home the following point: your SS payment goes up 8% for every year you don't collect beyond your FRA. So, if your FRA is 65 and you work an extra year, the SS payout goes up 8%. The 8% escalation extends through age 70, an 8% per year increase. Quite a raise - if you have the option to continue working, and can tolerate putting in the extra time. (Personally, I would not want to do it, but everybody's mileage varies).

Again personally, I think your strategy is sound. Move to low cost state - check. Limit housing costs - check. Limit expenses - check. $3K/mo is a lot to live on (IMHO) if your expenses (particularly housing) are contained, and you don't have expensive tastes. You'll need to check out Medicare plan availability and cost in your target town - somebody else on these boards made the comment that plan costs, and Medicare availability, can vary drastically depending on the zip code. You can find out costs and availability on the medicare govt web site. If I remember correctly, NE Girl posted the site. So, move with eyes wide open!

Again personally: if I were in your shoes at your age, I'd simply plan around the constraints. They're quite live-able, especially if you like one another's company! Very best to you.
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Old 08-14-2014, 02:28 AM
 
1,734 posts, read 1,952,756 times
Reputation: 3901
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948 View Post
After 65
???
it is better here
here is the biggie
medical infrastructure friends and a home you already have here
Leaving shangrala is a one way ticket
...
I'd like to understand your point better - is it just SoCal that is better after 65? Or do you advocate retiring where you are regardless? I recently returned from a trip there, and boy has it changed from how I remember it from the previous time. Everybody's tastes are different, but it seemed a LOT more crowded, a lot drier and a LOT more expensive than the previous time (which was 14 years prior).

Guess I've turned into a country gal, and my tastes have settled into a preference for woods and streams and a cooler temperature profile and more rain, etc... If I had to STAY in SoCal rather than visiting and then returning to my place of origin, I would feel a tad vulnerable.

I realize that lots of people like it there, and live their for that very good reason. I just don't think I'm part of the club that does.

Thanks for any insight.
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Old 08-14-2014, 09:43 AM
 
3,351 posts, read 3,059,017 times
Reputation: 4885
Quote:
Originally Posted by CRobin4564 View Post
If you are a native of TN I don't think you can imagine the difference between TN and CA. We have all the meth heads you could possibly want..or not want. And crime. But it's the people and the way they treat others that makes the difference to me between the two. Most people in TN still have manners. It's just a "different vibe"...to use CA jargon .. I'm a native Californian...the last child of 8 and the only one born here. But when I go to TN for some reason I feel at home.
Different strokes. I lived in Northern California for 25 years and I've now been in Tennessee for two and cannot wait to leave. I will take the vibe of California any day.
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Old 08-14-2014, 01:59 PM
 
Location: Seattle Area
1,716 posts, read 1,591,624 times
Reputation: 4125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Escort Rider View Post
Suppose I picked something you liked and called it hell because it isn't my cup of tea. What arrogance on your part.
My apologies then. It wasn't meant to offend you. To me it would be hell, to you its not. If you called something I like hell, I would think nothing of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Escort Rider View Post
Flying is better if the distance is considerable and you are going to that particular place only and then are returning. In October I flew to Little Rock for my niece's wedding.

Speaking of flying, when I was in my 30's my ex-wife and I owned our own small private airplane. That was a great, incomparable experience.

You seem so intent on the correctness of your particular approach that just can't seem to fathom people who have favorable experiences which lie outside of your particular paradigm. You just can't conceive of having a good time unless you spend ALL of the money available to you at a given time. You have a sad lack of vision and imagination, my friend.
Actually, you couldn't be further from the truth and we are not friends. My approach is unusual and most people wouldn't want to do it. The populace treats retirement as a holy right that everyone should work towards. i don't buy into it, but I'm no evangelist for it. By NOT buying into conformity, I am actually the definition of vision and imagination. There is no vision in doing what society expects right? there is certainly no imagination in going with the masses.

you are right about the private plane. I grew up with private planes and helicopters with pilots on the payroll, it is truly the only way to fly.

Last edited by Yakscsd; 08-14-2014 at 02:59 PM..
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Old 08-14-2014, 03:48 PM
 
Location: Silicon Valley
18,134 posts, read 23,045,598 times
Reputation: 35392
Quote:
Originally Posted by N.Cal View Post
Different strokes. I lived in Northern California for 25 years and I've now been in Tennessee for two and cannot wait to leave. I will take the vibe of California any day.
Amen. I am from CA, then went to WA, then to TN for 5 years. Couldn't wait to get back to CA.

There is a lot to love about TN. #1 for me is fireflies. Really miss fireflies. #2 would be redbirds. So pretty and have a great song.

When I was there, Al Gore was a representative (forget which branch, etc.) and was convincing the state not to go for a big contract to store nuclear waste in the state. I was very impressed with how he gently and persistently educated and convinced the citizens of TN that even though it would mean jobs, nuclear waste was not a good thing to have crossing the state on trains, then then being buried there.

But, the culture was not for me long-term. Southerners can look very sweet and friendly to your face, but there is a whole undercurrent of communication going on that unless you are from that culture, you won't realize is happening.

I'm not saying every person in TN is two-faced. I'm saying that someone from CA can be naive about whether a person really likes you or is genuinely friendly, as opposed to just behaving in a way that is thought to be "good manners." I'm from a more straightforward culture, and I don't like mixed messages. I'll take a New Yorker over a southerner any day, as far as not feeling like I need to figure out what they really mean.

This is not true for Texans, in my experience, so there is the exception - but as we all know, TX is not really part of the south anyway. Texans are friendly, but it's genuine. But, they're also not afraid to tell you what they really think, in a nice way of course... But, I've never wasted time with a Texan. I felt like Tennesseans wasted my time a lot, as far as leading me on about whether or not we were going to do business together, or if we were becoming friends. I just felt lost at sea in TN.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CRobin4564 View Post

If you are a native of TN I don't think you can imagine the difference between TN and CA. We have all the meth heads you could possibly want..or not want. And crime. But it's the people and the way they treat others that makes the difference to me between the two. Most people in TN still have manners. It's just a "different vibe"...to use CA jargon .. I'm a native Californian...the last child of 8 and the only one born here. But when I go to TN for some reason I feel at home.
The entire state of CA is swarming with meth heads? And there are none in TN?

And same with crime?

Read above as far as people having manners in TN as opposed to CA.

I really hope you find happiness in TN, but I see you fleeing an entire state based on your experience in one area of the state. And it sounds like you don't even have family in TN anymore.

I made the mistake of fleeing the entire country in my 40's, thinking I'd be happier in Mexico where it would be cheaper. Stupidest mistake of my life. I just had to leave the country to realize how much I loved it. Coming back was like a breath of fresh air, where I understood the language and more importantly, the customs - including body language.

That was what it was like for me in TN. I didn't know the cues for their communication by their tone or their body language, etc. It's a different culture with it's own subtle unspoken language and cues. Again, couldn't wait to get back to my own "culture" on the west coast.

California will still be here, if you change your mind, OP.
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Old 08-14-2014, 04:28 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles area
14,018 posts, read 17,765,919 times
Reputation: 32309
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoMoreSnowForMe View Post
Amen. I am from CA, then went to WA, then to TN for 5 years. Couldn't wait to get back to CA.

There is a lot to love about TN. #1 for me is fireflies. Really miss fireflies. #2 would be redbirds. So pretty and have a great song.

When I was there, Al Gore was a representative (forget which branch, etc.) and was convincing the state not to go for a big contract to store nuclear waste in the state. I was very impressed with how he gently and persistently educated and convinced the citizens of TN that even though it would mean jobs, nuclear waste was not a good thing to have crossing the state on trains, then then being buried there.

But, the culture was not for me long-term. Southerners can look very sweet and friendly to your face, but there is a whole undercurrent of communication going on that unless you are from that culture, you won't realize is happening.

I'm not saying every person in TN is two-faced. I'm saying that someone from CA can be naive about whether a person really likes you or is genuinely friendly, as opposed to just behaving in a way that is thought to be "good manners." I'm from a more straightforward culture, and I don't like mixed messages. I'll take a New Yorker over a southerner any day, as far as not feeling like I need to figure out what they really mean.

This is not true for Texans, in my experience, so there is the exception - but as we all know, TX is not really part of the south anyway. Texans are friendly, but it's genuine. But, they're also not afraid to tell you what they really think, in a nice way of course... But, I've never wasted time with a Texan. I felt like Tennesseans wasted my time a lot, as far as leading me on about whether or not we were going to do business together, or if we were becoming friends. I just felt lost at sea in TN.



The entire state of CA is swarming with meth heads? And there are none in TN?

And same with crime?

Read above as far as people having manners in TN as opposed to CA.

I really hope you find happiness in TN, but I see you fleeing an entire state based on your experience in one area of the state. And it sounds like you don't even have family in TN anymore.

I made the mistake of fleeing the entire country in my 40's, thinking I'd be happier in Mexico where it would be cheaper. Stupidest mistake of my life. I just had to leave the country to realize how much I loved it. Coming back was like a breath of fresh air, where I understood the language and more importantly, the customs - including body language.

That was what it was like for me in TN. I didn't know the cues for their communication by their tone or their body language, etc. It's a different culture with it's own subtle unspoken language and cues. Again, couldn't wait to get back to my own "culture" on the west coast.

California will still be here, if you change your mind, OP.
A very sophisticated, insightful, and astute analysis. Congratulations.
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