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Old 11-22-2014, 08:40 AM
 
Location: SoCal
6,081 posts, read 9,558,163 times
Reputation: 5849

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Travelassie View Post
Ok, then as I see it you live with the consequences of your decisions. You can spend all your resources, traveling, living the high life, doing anything you fancy when you're young, and saving nothing for later when you no longer earn those resources.

If that is your choice, you have no right when you're old and destitute, to demand that others who have denied themselves some of those pleasures/adventures- to save for a later day, support you because you insisted on instant gratification of your whims and now have nothing to show for all those years of fun.

And no amount of pontificating, appealing to civic responsibilities, trying to lay blame or guilt-trips on
the savers changes this basic fact.

I'm not saying you personally do any of this, but we do know there's an entire establishment who does. Look left.
I'm looking left. I'm seeing people who are mentally or physically disabled. I'm looking at people whose work was so difficult that it left them unable to do much for themselves. I'm seeing people who raised a family on a miniscule wage. I'm seeing people who started out economically disadvantaged and who are still economically disadvantaged. I'm seeing people for whom God laughed at their carefully-made plans. Yeah, I'm seeing some people who chose to spend it all as they went ... but they are in the minority.
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Old 11-22-2014, 03:17 PM
 
Location: NYC
2,936 posts, read 1,602,755 times
Reputation: 7986
I look right & I see people who bought house's with VA mortgage loans, sent the kids to public schools, traveling to state & national parks on the interstate highways, eating sanitary food & drinking clean water out of the tap & collecting social security & using medicare all the while complaining about the "burden" of getting the government out of their lives.
"There are none so blind as those who will not see."
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Old 11-22-2014, 04:38 PM
 
4,353 posts, read 6,075,778 times
Reputation: 10475
Quote:
Originally Posted by N.Cal View Post
Different strokes. I lived in Northern California for 25 years and I've now been in Tennessee for two and cannot wait to leave. I will take the vibe of California any day.
That's the thing. People get caught up with dollars and cents and forget about vibes. We've lived in states where we were politically and geographically opposed and it was painful but the $$$ made sense. Now we're where we belong.
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Old 11-22-2014, 07:50 PM
 
Location: Mid-Atlantic
25,162 posts, read 24,051,251 times
Reputation: 31093
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hefe View Post
I look right & I see people who bought house's with VA mortgage loans, sent the kids to public schools, traveling to state & national parks on the interstate highways, eating sanitary food & drinking clean water out of the tap & collecting social security & using medicare all the while complaining about the "burden" of getting the government out of their lives.
"There are none so blind as those who will not see."
I'm mostly seeing those people on the left. Even people who were doing well were shown the door and are, were unemployed in their 50s. No one will hire them. They thought they had another ten years to prepare. That happened to my father in the 1970s. He thought he would put in his thirty years and get a pension. It didn't happen.
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Old 11-23-2014, 02:53 AM
 
33,046 posts, read 22,138,093 times
Reputation: 8970
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
no one can answer that . it is so complex that anyone who does without loads of details knows little about retirement planning.

??? If I can manage on $1000 per month and a negative net worth, why can't a married couple manage on $3000 per month plus a half million in the bank?
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Old 11-23-2014, 04:44 AM
 
72,089 posts, read 72,094,203 times
Reputation: 49627
because they may not want your lifestyle. i know i wouldn't. surviving on and living on are two different things. i have goals ,dreams and wants and that cost money. lots of money. sure i need a lot less to pay bills and get by but that isn't what i planned for in retirement.

we want to live better than we did raising a family and scrimping and saving. we want to be rewarded now at this stage , not take a step backward and do with less than we had while working.

Last edited by mathjak107; 11-23-2014 at 05:14 AM..
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Old 11-23-2014, 08:33 AM
 
29,891 posts, read 34,951,892 times
Reputation: 11793
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
because they may not want your lifestyle. i know i wouldn't. surviving on and living on are two different things. i have goals ,dreams and wants and that cost money. lots of money. sure i need a lot less to pay bills and get by but that isn't what i planned for in retirement.

we want to live better than we did raising a family and scrimping and saving. we want to be rewarded now at this stage , not take a step backward and do with less than we had while working.
Bada Bing!
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Old 11-23-2014, 08:43 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles area
14,018 posts, read 17,785,397 times
Reputation: 32309
Default A specific illustration of Mathjak's point:

Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
because they may not want your lifestyle. i know i wouldn't. surviving on and living on are two different things. i have goals ,dreams and wants and that cost money. lots of money. sure i need a lot less to pay bills and get by but that isn't what i planned for in retirement.

we want to live better than we did raising a family and scrimping and saving. we want to be rewarded now at this stage , not take a step backward and do with less than we had while working.
Quite so. Yesterday I enjoyed a Los Angeles Philharmonic concert celebrating the tenth anniversary of Disney Hall's superb organ - both the hall and the organ are among the best in the world. One of the works performed was the glorious Saint-Saens organ symphony. Cost of the ticket? $185 (the top tier ticket price). Was it worth it? Every penny. Was it an "unnecessary" splurge? You bet. Did I have to give up something else to do it? No way, and that's the beauty of what you are talking about. Man shall not live by bread alone.

Of course I don't go to something like that every week. Over the course of a year I must average about once a month or so. And though (based on your comments over the years) I probably have less money than you do, life is good.
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Old 11-23-2014, 10:38 AM
 
Location: SW Florida
9,784 posts, read 7,075,395 times
Reputation: 14365
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hefe View Post
I look right & I see people who bought house's with VA mortgage loans, sent the kids to public schools, traveling to state & national parks on the interstate highways, eating sanitary food & drinking clean water out of the tap & collecting social security & using medicare all the while complaining about the "burden" of getting the government out of their lives.
"There are none so blind as those who will not see."
Did you also see them paying the taxes- federal, state, and local taxes that support those public functions? Or how about the Medicare and SS deductions that were taken from their paychecks as they worked all those years to support themselves and their loved ones?

Yeah, THOSE people.
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Old 11-23-2014, 12:29 PM
 
72,089 posts, read 72,094,203 times
Reputation: 49627
Quote:
Originally Posted by Escort Rider View Post
Quite so. Yesterday I enjoyed a Los Angeles Philharmonic concert celebrating the tenth anniversary of Disney Hall's superb organ - both the hall and the organ are among the best in the world. One of the works performed was the glorious Saint-Saens organ symphony. Cost of the ticket? $185 (the top tier ticket price). Was it worth it? Every penny. Was it an "unnecessary" splurge? You bet. Did I have to give up something else to do it? No way, and that's the beauty of what you are talking about. Man shall not live by bread alone.

Of course I don't go to something like that every week. Over the course of a year I must average about once a month or so. And though (based on your comments over the years) I probably have less money than you do, life is good.
that is what most folks don't get. they post all their expenses and go can I retire?

life is far more than just expenses and getting by. while most of America gets by on a relatively low number you can be sure many are not thrilled with the life they have to live and if they had a choice would prefer a lot more discretionary spending.
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