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Old 09-08-2014, 08:52 PM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,587 posts, read 17,574,904 times
Reputation: 27677

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Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
Your post is a good example of the dangers of focusing too much on the goal of retirement.

Man does not live by bread alone. We have a Mary Engelbreit Calendar in our kitchen that has a saying "Its not the number of breaths you take in your life; Its the number of moments that take your breath away".

I want to retire at some point and I think we have made very reasonable progress towards that goal. We have a health government pension, a 401 K account that has grown rapidly the last 4 years, and high social security benefits to look forward. Unlike many of the people I've seen post here, I positively love my job and will be happy to retire at 70.

People who put away half their income for the illusory goal of retirement make me either want to cry or laugh. There is no guarantee you will live that long. If you don't, what does all that money you saved represent? It represent missed opportunities and missed chances to enjoy your life a bit more. Let's look at your list:

1. Live below your means (I don't believe in living below the poverty line simply to have a higher retirement benefit at age 65 or whenever)

2. Don't have kids (Sure, pass up one of life's greatest joys. Don't bother being a human being and living a real life)

3. Multiple incomes (a good idea)

4. Adopt an anti-consumerist lifestyle. (There is a term economists refer to called the "paradox of thrift". If everyone stopped consuming, this economy would go into a tailspin and millions would lose their jobs. That's billions of dollars that wouldn't be contributed in the form of taxes into Social Security or savings. Its really a crappy idea for an entire country to follow.)

5. Eat healthy and exercise daily (A good idea until it becomes an obsession. Every meal you buy doesn't have to be organic food, purchased from Whole Foods. The American food supply is one of the safest in the world. We simply need to do a better job watching calories)

6. Read finance books and blogs (Ok to a point. However, if you read nothing else than you really have a narrow view of life. I spend my reading time reading Current Events, History, and Literature. I haven't listened to Dave Ramsay in years)

7. Invest as much money as possible for retirement. (Depends on what you are giving up to do it. I would rather live in a two bedroom apartment than not pay to send my kids to college)

8. Stop watching so much t.v. (Agreed. Unless its news and current events. Every citizen should be informed of the events in this world instead of reading cliches from some financial guru)

9. Find a field of work for which demand will increase in the future. (Harder than you think. Becoming a computer engineer is more difficult than anyone can imagine. Only a few really make the cut. Its not a question of hard work either. Its more a question of aptitude that many are simply born with. Even jobs in the STEM fields are more limited than many believe. Its not an excuse to give up or quit. But what is in demand today may not be tomorrow.)

You see, I advocate that people stop fixating so much on retirement--or any single thing--and instead simply focus on leading a balanced life. A balanced life is one that prepares for retirement without obsessing about it. There are other goals in life and a happy, adjusted person will focus on those as well.
Totally agree. I can't tell you how many savers I've seen miss out on awesome life moments I've had by 28, things they missed, risks they didn't take, etc, all trying to squirrel something back for an increasingly uncertain future. While you do need to put money back, I wouldn't completely deprive myself doing so.
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Old 09-08-2014, 09:39 PM
 
28,242 posts, read 39,901,543 times
Reputation: 36757
Quote:
Originally Posted by MckinneyOwnr View Post
That's your opinion, which isn't backed up by any facts. When you have a Masters in Econ and have studied this very subject extensively as both an academic and professional insider, let me know.
What I have are three older brothers, a sister, and parents that actually lived through it and told me stories of what it was like. It is obvious that you are uninformed even though you claim to be "educated".
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Old 09-09-2014, 12:23 AM
 
1,198 posts, read 1,575,240 times
Reputation: 779
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_grimace View Post
I'm a guy in my mid twenties. With social security going bankrupt and pensions disappearing from jobs left and right, I am dreadfully afraid of what life is going to look like once I get to retirement age. Sometimes I even wonder, will people even BE ABLE to retire anymore? The job market is bad today, and the middle class is falling lower and lower towards poverty lines. Most young people (even those with college degrees) are struggling to find work, and a traditional career path is a thing of the past, instead replaced by 3-5 year spurts of employment with different companies. Let's not forget plummeting wages as globalization grows and more jobs are off-shored. Having to actively save and invest for retirement is more important than ever, but it's so tough to do when finding well paying employment is often so far out of reach.

Am I crazy to be ridiculously worried about what things will be like when the twenty and thirty year olds of today reach retirement? I see a bleak future and many having to work till they are on their death beds. The only exception being the diminishing upper class and the 1%.
You have to remember that when our generation hits our 60 and 70, our quality of health will likely be vastly different. It's very possible that-with the way medicine is advancing these days and the pace it is- life expectancy and quality of life will vastly different in 30-40 years.
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Old 09-09-2014, 02:45 AM
 
71,626 posts, read 71,751,865 times
Reputation: 49225
we are adding 1 year of life expectancy every 4 years now.
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Old 09-09-2014, 07:05 AM
 
Location: Prosper
6,268 posts, read 12,915,585 times
Reputation: 9377
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tek_Freek View Post
What I have are three older brothers, a sister, and parents that actually lived through it and told me stories of what it was like. It is obvious that you are uninformed even though you claim to be "educated".
So, no knowledge of what you're speaking of. You seem to have a nasty habit of that. Why am I not surprised you seem to have disdain for "education." Maybe you should get some? Just a thought.
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Old 09-09-2014, 09:21 AM
 
Location: Texas
1,029 posts, read 1,217,707 times
Reputation: 1985
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
1. Live below your means (I don't believe in living below the poverty line simply to have a higher retirement benefit at age 65 or whenever)
There is a HUGE difference, for most people, between living below your means and living below the poverty line.

Quote:
7. Invest as much money as possible for retirement. (Depends on what you are giving up to do it. I would rather live in a two bedroom apartment than not pay to send my kids to college)
Quote:
You see, I advocate that people stop fixating so much on retirement--or any single thing--and instead simply focus on leading a balanced life. A balanced life is one that prepares for retirement without obsessing about it. There are other goals in life and a happy, adjusted person will focus on those as well.
I agree with this. Life is a series of choices. The problem is many people choose to live in the big fancy house, pay for their kids to go to a school and study liberal arts, indulge today's wants, and put little to nothing into retirement savings. There needs to be a realistic balance, and I think a lot of people have no idea what that looks like.
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Old 09-09-2014, 10:15 AM
 
2,079 posts, read 2,604,631 times
Reputation: 3947
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
Your post is a good example of the dangers of focusing too much on the goal of retirement.
this is a retirement forum....

and at least half of those things are not even directly related to retirement

that is like going into the atheist forum and saying "jesus died for your sins"

Quote:
Man does not live by bread alone. We have a Mary Engelbreit Calendar in our kitchen that has a saying "Its not the number of breaths you take in your life; Its the number of moments that take your breath away".
thanks for the philosophical point of view, Confucius, but that's not going to keep a roof over your head or put food on the table.

Quote:
I want to retire at some point and I think we have made very reasonable progress towards that goal.
i'm happy for you.

Quote:
We have a health government pension, a 401 K account that has grown rapidly the last 4 years, and high social security benefits to look forward. Unlike many of the people I've seen post here, I positively love my job and will be happy to retire at 70.
not everybody loves their jobs or wants to retire at 70. keep this in mind

Quote:
People who put away half their income for the illusory goal of retirement make me either want to cry or laugh.
laugh and cry all you want. i don't really care what you think. my goal is semi-retirement by 45

Quote:
There is no guarantee you will live that long. If you don't, what does all that money you saved represent? It represent missed opportunities and missed chances to enjoy your life a bit more.
oh god, the "you could die tomorrow argument". such a common retort by all consumerist sheep to diligently saving for retirement. i live frugally enough to save a bunch for retirement, yet still have fun and create moments that "take your breath away" as you eloquently put it. who says you can't do both?

Quote:
Let's look at your list

1. Live below your means (I don't believe in living below the poverty line simply to have a higher retirement benefit at age 65 or whenever)
nobody mentioned living below the poverty line. living below your means and living below the poverty line are not the same thing

Quote:
2. Don't have kids (Sure, pass up one of life's greatest joys. Don't bother being a human being and living a real life)
life's greatest joys? that is subjective. not everybody wants kids. birth rates have gone down for a reason. kids are expensive. people are waiting until they're older to have kids and foregoing having them in the first place. which is a good thing because i believe many people, including myself, should not reproduce.

3. Multiple incomes (a good idea)

Quote:
4. Adopt an anti-consumerist lifestyle. (There is a term economists refer to called the "paradox of thrift". If everyone stopped consuming, this economy would go into a tailspin and millions would lose their jobs. That's billions of dollars that wouldn't be contributed in the form of taxes into Social Security or savings. Its really a crappy idea for an entire country to follow.)
i'm not saying everybody should follow this. only those that put retirement(or early retirement) as a top priority. to me, more stuff=more hassle. i prefer the simple life

Quote:
5. Eat healthy and exercise daily (A good idea until it becomes an obsession. Every meal you buy doesn't have to be organic food, purchased from Whole Foods. The American food supply is one of the safest in the world. We simply need to do a better job watching calories)
i don't eat organic/gluten free and all that jazz. i do not take it to extremes

Quote:
6. Read finance books and blogs (Ok to a point. However, if you read nothing else than you really have a narrow view of life. I spend my reading time reading Current Events, History, and Literature. I haven't listened to Dave Ramsay in years)
i have other interests outside the realm of finance. you don't have to worry about that. and dave ramsey is a joke. sure, most americans that are completely ignorant of finance could use his advice, but all of it seems like common sense/stuff i already know.

Quote:
7. Invest as much money as possible for retirement. (Depends on what you are giving up to do it. I would rather live in a two bedroom apartment than not pay to send my kids to college)
not giving up much. obviously if you have kids, you want to make sure they have a fighting chance of success. and i commend you for that.

Quote:
8. Stop watching so much t.v. (Agreed. Unless its news and current events. Every citizen should be informed of the events in this world instead of reading cliches from some financial guru)
i get my news from the internet.

Quote:
9. Find a field of work for which demand will increase in the future. (Harder than you think. Becoming a computer engineer is more difficult than anyone can imagine. Only a few really make the cut. Its not a question of hard work either. Its more a question of aptitude that many are simply born with. Even jobs in the STEM fields are more limited than many believe. Its not an excuse to give up or quit. But what is in demand today may not be tomorrow.)
there are other fields that will be more in demand than a computer engineer. many of which you don't have to be born with a special ability to do.

Quote:
You see, I advocate that people stop fixating so much on retirement--or any single thing--and instead simply focus on leading a balanced life. A balanced life is one that prepares for retirement without obsessing about it. There are other goals in life and a happy, adjusted person will focus on those as well.
you're posting about not fixating on retirement on a thread that is meant to specifically hone in on the concept of retirement. am i missing something here? as i mentioned before, you can live a frugal, balanced life with all the life experience you want, and still save boatloads for retirement. it can be done. nobody needs a spendthrift partner, expensive iphone + data, expensive cable package, cadillac escalade, etc
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