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Old 03-23-2015, 07:19 AM
 
29,774 posts, read 34,856,103 times
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Seems as if the wealth/income gap is a source of much discussion in this forum without actually being mentioned or discussed directly. Perhaps it is why so many threads become contentious as topics get discussed that play out differently across income groups. There are not very many opportunities at redo's once we hit our sixties. Relationships and marriage is one area we can have redo's. Regardless of luck, fate, choices or whatever by the time we hit our sixties much of our future financial life is on a path with limited ability to change on our own. Many of the changes that do occur will be negative and a result of fate and or decisions that didn't work out. Yes some will inherit and some will marry into wealth however most won't. Our choices and behavior and lifestyles in retirement are often financially driven and personal, yet we have a knack for making value judgments about others choices. Even the adaptation of technology can be considered a waste of money and not needed by some. Yes seniors as one thread noted are a 7.1 Trillion dollar market but is that wealth distributed equally? No! Are all seniors equal in opportunity/targeting? You decide! Even senior housing choices vary by income level and the ability to transplant can often be income driven and difficult to discuss if ignored.
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Old 03-23-2015, 07:35 AM
 
Location: Idaho
1,452 posts, read 1,153,447 times
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TurborgP,
I glanced at the news headline this morning and this article caught my eyes:

The Growing Divide Between the Retirement Elite and Everyone Else - TIME

"But truth is, most workers end up retiring well before age 65, and few have enough saved by that point. The least prepared workers, some 32% of those surveyed, were on track to receive just 38% of their income in retirement, which would be largely Social Security benefits.

By contrast, an elite group of workers, some 20%, are on track to replace 143% of their current income, Empower found. And it’s not just those pulling down high salaries. “The key success factors were access to a 401(k) and consistently saving 10% of pay, not income"

then I came across your thread topic which follows the same line.

I have not been on CD-forum very long but based from the few threads that I have followed, I totally agree with your observation and comment:

"Perhaps it is why so many threads become contentious as topics get discussed that play out differently across income groups. There are not very many opportunities at redo's once we hit our sixties".

It's clear that many of us are wearing different color or shade life-outlook glasses. I think that the majority of the posters here mean well in stating their point of view. Some of the comments/advices were not meant to be condescending, putting down or lecturing but they are probably more appropriate for younger folks who still have the time and the opportunity to do over, to make changes to improve their financial situation.
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Old 03-23-2015, 07:47 AM
 
29,774 posts, read 34,856,103 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BellaDL View Post
TurborgP,
I glanced at the news headline this morning and this article caught my eyes:

The Growing Divide Between the Retirement Elite and Everyone Else - TIME

"But truth is, most workers end up retiring well before age 65, and few have enough saved by that point. The least prepared workers, some 32% of those surveyed, were on track to receive just 38% of their income in retirement, which would be largely Social Security benefits.

By contrast, an elite group of workers, some 20%, are on track to replace 143% of their current income, Empower found. And itís not just those pulling down high salaries. ďThe key success factors were access to a 401(k) and consistently saving 10% of pay, not income"

then I came across your thread topic which follows the same line.

I have not been on CD-forum very long but based from the few threads that I have followed, I totally agree with your observation and comment:

"Perhaps it is why so many threads become contentious as topics get discussed that play out differently across income groups. There are not very many opportunities at redo's once we hit our sixties".

It's clear that many of us are wearing different color or shade life-outlook glasses. I think that the majority of the posters here mean well in stating their point of view. Some of the comments/advices were not meant to be condescending, putting down or lecturing but they are probably more appropriate for younger folks who still have the time and the opportunity to do over, to make changes to improve their financial situation.
I'll Bada Bing that!
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Old 03-23-2015, 08:17 AM
 
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, originally from SF Bay Area
29,772 posts, read 54,408,375 times
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A good example is my own family, and my 7 siblings. All of us expect to get social security, but some never made a lot of money and will have minimal benefits. One younger brother in the CA retirement system retired already at age 56 and is now looking for another job to supplement but can manage on that until SS kicks in. I will work to 68 or 70 and have a decent pension, and a younger sister will have a good pension when she retires but like me, enjoys her work and will likely stay to 67. The other 4 (1 is 64, others late 50s now) will have SS only, and have to work as long as they are able to make it or move to much lower cost areas. Three of those do not own a house to sell and take out the equity, and none of those 4 has any children to help them out in their old age. I'm the only one that has longterm care insurance.
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Old 03-23-2015, 09:55 AM
 
Location: WA
5,394 posts, read 21,388,001 times
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I was really taken recently when reading about billionaires worldwide and saw the common thread with all the self-made individuals... constant effort, hard work, dedication to building for the future. Some came from the most destitute beginnings to build a fortune.

When I look at my family the trends are exactly the same (but no billionaires), the 30% of us that have or will retire with adequate assets are the ones that worked, planned, and put more effort into providing for ourselves and family as compared to the ones that focused on their current lifestyle.

I know that life throws all of us difficult challenges but hard work and capitalizing on the little dumb luck that all see at times can result in a productive life including adequate late life resources. I get very tired of hearing about income inequality when it is primarily brought on themselves.

So yeah, people make up their own reality.
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Old 03-23-2015, 10:16 AM
 
1,769 posts, read 2,441,374 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdelena View Post
I was really taken recently when reading about billionaires worldwide and saw the common thread with all the self-made individuals... constant effort, hard work, dedication to building for the future. Some came from the most destitute beginnings to build a fortune.

When I look at my family the trends are exactly the same (but no billionaires), the 30% of us that have or will retire with adequate assets are the ones that worked, planned, and put more effort into providing for ourselves and family as compared to the ones that focused on their current lifestyle.

I know that life throws all of us difficult challenges but hard work and capitalizing on the little dumb luck that all see at times can result in a productive life including adequate late life resources. I get very tired of hearing about income inequality when it is primarily brought on themselves.

So yeah, people make up their own reality.

I agree with you. Anyone else's lesser income is no fault of mine and I refuse to feel any guilt about it despite the rhetoric tossed about in liberal articles. Some of us worked extremely hard to plan for retirement and didn't do drugs or abuse our bodies. An adequate retirement income was planned. No doubt some people had unfortunate circumstances that wiped out savings and retirement plans and they have my sympathy.
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Old 03-23-2015, 10:19 AM
 
29,774 posts, read 34,856,103 times
Reputation: 11687
As the OP let me note that the above posts are 100 percent appropriate as they are focused on the topic and part of the CD retirement discussion reality that often gets muted.
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Old 03-23-2015, 10:39 AM
 
Location: too far from the sea
19,832 posts, read 18,839,234 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LivingDeadGirl View Post
I agree with you. Anyone else's lesser income is no fault of mine and I refuse to feel any guilt about it despite the rhetoric tossed about in liberal articles. Some of us worked extremely hard to plan for retirement and didn't do drugs or abuse our bodies. An adequate retirement income was planned. No doubt some people had unfortunate circumstances that wiped out savings and retirement plans and they have my sympathy.
Not to pick on LivingDeadGirl (I like her) but her post and the previous one sound like we might be getting into another "here we go again...."

Some of us worked extremely hard to plan for retirement and didn't do drugs or abuse our bodies. An adequate retirement income was planned. It's statements like this. Are there really that many retirees (say age 60-90) who did drugs and abused their bodies?

A few rock stars back in the 60s are the only ones I ever heard of and I have not been living under a rock.
Everyone I have ever known worked hard, saved, had a 401K (when those became available). Many of us began our working career with a pension that was promised to us --and 401Ks didn't even exist back then.

Yet not everyone I know retired rich, in fact, I don't know anyone who is actually rich. (And no one retired before FRA--everyone in my family or friends worked until 65 or 70.) Are there really people who retire early when they clearly don't have enough money? They would have to be kind of crazy or people are making these stories up.

Most people who retired without enough money did so due to unfortunate circumstances. The OP of this thread sounded like it was going to be fair to everyone. Do we have to turn it into the usual bashing that spoils this forum again and again.
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Old 03-23-2015, 10:57 AM
 
29,774 posts, read 34,856,103 times
Reputation: 11687
Quote:
Originally Posted by in_newengland View Post
Not to pick on LivingDeadGirl (I like her) but her post and the previous one sound like we might be getting into another "here we go again...."

Some of us worked extremely hard to plan for retirement and didn't do drugs or abuse our bodies. An adequate retirement income was planned. It's statements like this. Are there really that many retirees (say age 60-90) who did drugs and abused their bodies?

A few rock stars back in the 60s are the only ones I ever heard of and I have not been living under a rock.
Everyone I have ever known worked hard, saved, had a 401K (when those became available). Many of us began our working career with a pension that was promised to us --and 401Ks didn't even exist back then.

Yet not everyone I know retired rich, in fact, I don't know anyone who is actually rich. (And no one retired before FRA--everyone in my family or friends worked until 65 or 70.) Are there really people who retire early when they clearly don't have enough money? They would have to be kind of crazy or people are making these stories up.

Most people who retired without enough money did so due to unfortunate circumstances. The OP of this thread sounded like it was going to be fair to everyone. Do we have to turn it into the usual bashing that spoils this forum again and again.
A very good and on point post. Again this is about Income Equality and Seniors and how WE feel on that topic and how WE react to it. The responses should be varied and come from multiple perspectives but hopefully it will enable us to say what we often imply in other threads after they have become sidetracked. Now it is the focus and not off the original target. So far the posts are sincere and right on the thread topic. Congrats!
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Old 03-23-2015, 10:58 AM
 
Location: middle tennessee
1,924 posts, read 988,107 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TuborgP View Post
As the OP let me note that the above posts are 100 percent appropriate as they are focused on the topic and part of the CD retirement discussion reality that often gets muted.
I agree.

My retirement life is about the same as the first 75% of my life except that I don't have to work, and that's all right with me. Income inequality doesn't bother me. You work as hard as you have to while you are able, get slapped down and get back up or not, and live on whatever you have when you're old. I am thankful that my family has been spared the tragedies that I have seen come upon others.

I don't need more than one house, or even to own a house anymore, but I enjoy reading here about what others are doing. I'm not much interested in the conversations about investments and such. I doubt many people here or elsewhere are much more content than me. I have a good income and I've worked out a plan for the future that's within my means. It may not work, but I think it will work, so I don't worry myself about it. I am prepared to be flexible.

I've always said that I paddle my own boat and I expect everyone else to do the same, but I don't mind older people getting government help. I do mind seeing younger people working the system because I think it ruins them. It's a road to nowhere.
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