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Old 12-01-2015, 01:39 PM
 
4,481 posts, read 4,743,078 times
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Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
A person can live reasonably well on relatively small amounts of income in many parts of the country. This is a cute condo is a well-maintained complex in the most affluent town in Indiana, and only over $100k.

11750 Glenbrook Court #205, Carmel, IN For Sale | Trulia.com


yes, nice place but didn't see what the condo fee is. I've yet to see real estate site list things like that and they are very important.


I have a good friend who lives in South Bend and she is forever trying to get me to move there. Her 2 bed/2 bath was very reasonable but I don't think I would like South Bend at all.
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Old 12-01-2015, 02:03 PM
 
8,849 posts, read 5,132,953 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brava4 View Post
yes, nice place but didn't see what the condo fee is. I've yet to see real estate site list things like that and they are very important.


I have a good friend who lives in South Bend and she is forever trying to get me to move there. Her 2 bed/2 bath was very reasonable but I don't think I would like South Bend at all.

Realtor.com generally does list the HOA dues and amount, but states you should verify all information.
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Old 12-01-2015, 02:53 PM
 
Location: NC
6,555 posts, read 7,977,981 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vicky3vicky View Post
If you were to look at the numbers and statistics [and Mathjak, I am fairly certain that you do...extensively] I can see how it would APPEAR that many more are abusing the system by the fact that there is a significantly higher percentage of individuals receiving assistance than a few decades back. Starting with my own story, and some of my peers, I would like to explain how those figures might lead to deceptive conclusions.


When I first started working, minimum age was somewhere around $1.30 an hour. I lived in a crappy little apartment,[ which I LOVED] and my rent, utilities, and healthcare came to about $75 a month. I worked in the food industry and most jobs there included free meals [ rarely the case now] I lost a lot of jobs because "Vicky, I have never met anyone who TRIES as hard as you do, but it is just not working out." Financially, this did not cause me problems because I made enough money on minimum wage that I was able to save enough money to last between jobs. It was EASIER to get by back then for ANYONE on minimum wage. Also, despite the fact that I was not considered intelligent enough to work those menial jobs, most of them were much less complex than now.


I am also Autistic. I was not diagnosed Autistic as a child. Most Autistic people were not diagnosed back then. A HUGE amount of us were institutionalized though, being considered "retarded," "insane," or both. They are rarely being institutionalized now . Many of the people on assistance are homeless. Among adults, there are estimates that between 30 to 35% of them are Autistic[ or some other developmental disability.[ if you throw in our veterans, we are talking a combined % of WAY over 50% of this nations homelessness.


When I got married the first time, it was during a period of time that most women did not work outside the home. Most women were not "gold-diggers' but they did want a man who worked hard to support his family, even if it was as a ditch digger.


I AM a feminist, though what I am about to say will sound non-feminist. There are so many receiving assistance who are mentally ill. I am constantly hearing people berated for receiving assistance because of extreme anxiety, depression and similar mental disorders that are often trivialized. Yes, it is true that a higher % of Americans are claiming that they are not capable of working because of extremes in these illnesses than in the past. One reason for this though, is that these disorders are often greatly intensified by the stress of complete overwhelmnent. Most guys back then went to work, made enough money even at low level jobs to provide for their family, came home, and relaxed. Women tend to have most of the same responsibilities that they had in the past, except now [ and many men as well] they are expected to also bring in good money [ not some cute little side job] look better, have a house that looks better, overschedule their children [ lest they are accused of negligence] "balance their lives" with enrichment programs, etc. These overflowing responsibilities and societal expectations, are literally "driving people crazy." [ and yes, I am aware that the word crazy is not a psychiatric term]


Throw in other hurdles that were not in existence a few decades ago [ loss of union power, outsourcing, minimum wage not keeping up with inflation,etc] and It makes sense that many good, hardworking people are needing help. So, really, why not just help them?
Great post. Thanks for the reminder that most of the homeless may not have it in their power to fully take care of themselves.
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Old 12-01-2015, 04:21 PM
 
Location: Central NY
4,669 posts, read 3,245,044 times
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Vicky3Vicky: You strike me as one very intelligent woman.

You have more insight than a lot of posters will ever have. I enjoy your posts. Keep them coming, please!!

Too many on this forum have to prove their intelligence and it's making me sick. Moderator cut: Comment edited.

Last edited by Poncho_NM; 12-02-2015 at 01:42 PM.. Reason: Removed foul mouth and off topic reply...
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Old 12-01-2015, 05:19 PM
 
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No blasting NYgal. I agree wholeheartedly. Excellent post by Vicky3Vicky on so many levels. People not touched by mental illness in their family have much to learn. It is often times an illness more debilitating than any other form of physical illness, and one that has been, and still is to a lesser extent, truly neglected in society. I had a close relation diagnosed with mental problems. The medication subscribed to him to stabilize him was cost prohibitive, and after on it for only three months exceeded the limits the insurance company would pay. Without resources, these people are left to sheer neglect. Many even wind up in our prison system. Treatment of the mentally ill is a travesty in this country. I also strongly condemn pharmaceutical companies in the pricing of these drugs, along with other drugs for debilitating illnesses.

The ACA, with all of it's ills has helped this problem to a large extent by forcing insurance policies to include mental illness and treatment for those inflicted. This has of course come at a cost for the rest of us, but for those who have not been touched by this illness, I fear they do not understand the magnitude of the problem.

It is infuriating sometimes to hear all the accusatory statements coming from some people on these boards about having to pay for others. Yes, we all know there are a certain percentage of people who abuse the system and consequently paint a less than flattering picture of government assistance for those in need.
But I do believe that the number of deserving people outweighs the fakers or lazy. So the tendency for some to want to throw everyone in the same basket is very short sided (or very selfish)

I think the focus for discussion needs to be how our government can improve on distinguishing between the two, without hurting those truly in need. We could never hit the mark entirely, but we may be able to improve on it.

As for being able to manage "then" on a minimum wage income vs "now". I also agree. When I was young and first started working (making $40 a week - shows how old I am), I was able to keep a roof over my head, had a car and a health insurance policy I could afford. Today, this would not be possible. This is especially true for single one income people.
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Old 12-01-2015, 05:59 PM
 
Location: Cochise County, AZ
1,318 posts, read 834,822 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by modhatter View Post
It is infuriating sometimes to hear all the accusatory statements coming from some people on these boards about having to pay for others. Yes, we all know there are a certain percentage of people who abuse the system and consequently paint a less than flattering picture of government assistance for those in need.
But I do believe that the number of deserving people outweighs the fakers or lazy. So the tendency for some to want to throw everyone in the same basket is very short sided (or very selfish)

I think the focus for discussion needs to be how our government can improve on distinguishing between the two, without hurting those truly in need. We could never hit the mark entirely, but we may be able to improve on it.

As for being able to manage "then" on a minimum wage income vs "now". I also agree. When I was young and first started working (making $40 a week - shows how old I am), I was able to keep a roof over my head, had a car and a health insurance policy I could afford. Today, this would not be possible. This is especially true for single one income people.
It truly becomes a matter of an individual's perception. This thread's title is "Retiring Poor Is NOT as Bad as You Think!". One poster on this thread believes that a $+100K home in the affluent area of Carmel, Indiana is retiring poor. A minimum wage income would never qualify for that kind of a mortgage, and would probably barely squeak through on a $50k mortgage. So it definitely comes down to perception.
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Old 12-01-2015, 06:05 PM
 
Location: Central NY
4,669 posts, read 3,245,044 times
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[quote=modhatter;42131485]

Excellent post. You have said a lot here. Isn't it sickening to think of how when we were making $40/week, we could afford those things you mentioned and now $40 wouldn't be enough to feed a family of five for a week.
So little attention is given to the mentally ill. And so many of them can be rehabbed. A while ago, all of the facilities in Syracuse, NY (maybe it was state-wide or even nation-wide??) were closed and the people who lived there had to move out and most went to living on the streets. And of course, we all know the shame that goes with treating our vets..... the long waits, the ones who died because they didn't receive treatment in time. How have we, as a country, sunk so low? Where are our priorities? Shouldn't it be people first?
PLEASE! I am not trying to make this a political discussion. Those arguments will take away from this message. People need to take more responsibility for getting what needs to be done, done.
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Old 12-01-2015, 08:20 PM
 
8,849 posts, read 5,132,953 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYgal2NC View Post

Excellent post. You have said a lot here. Isn't it sickening to think of how when we were making $40/week, we could afford those things you mentioned and now $40 wouldn't be enough to feed a family of five for a week.
So little attention is given to the mentally ill. And so many of them can be rehabbed. A while ago, all of the facilities in Syracuse, NY (maybe it was state-wide or even nation-wide??) were closed and the people who lived there had to move out and most went to living on the streets. And of course, we all know the shame that goes with treating our vets..... the long waits, the ones who died because they didn't receive treatment in time. How have we, as a country, sunk so low? Where are our priorities? Shouldn't it be people first?
PLEASE! I am not trying to make this a political discussion. Those arguments will take away from this message. People need to take more responsibility for getting what needs to be done, done.
Ronald Reagan did that (closed many mental health facilities) when he was POTUS. Yes, there are many homeless who are mentally ill and unable to help themselves. If a mentally ill person does not have someone looking out for their best interests, they are ill-equipped to navigate life. They do not know how to obtain the help and services they need. They are an easy target for any predator.
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Old 12-01-2015, 08:53 PM
 
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Perhaps you saw this one in the news. In the great state of Nevada here, certain hospitals were caught (more than once) purchasing one way tickets for mentally ill patients to be put on buses to be dropped off without any funds, medication or care in California. Talk about inhumanity. The mentally ill in these cases are just not equipped to speak for themselves and pose little risk to the offender and therefore are often disposable. It was the state of California that blew the whistle on them.

It is a very difficult problem. No doubt about it. Because as stated, many could be treated with proper medication and lead normal lives in some cases. Others need to live in a controlled environment where medication is dispensed to them on a regular basis.

If the figures in this article are correct, you would think that setting up more work oriented group homes to care for the mentally ill would make sense. How Many People with Serious Mental Illness Are Homeless? - Treatment Advocacy Center

Many people in controlled environments with medication provided can actually partake in certain types of employment to help defray costs. Group homes sometimes have day centers where the residents go to that are given work opportunities by corporations or state agencies. (similar to making license plates in prisons) Some are actually well enough to hold a part time job in the outside job market.

Call me naive, but to me where there is a will there is a way. This has gotten off subject I know, unless you consider living on the street as being poor and "Not as bad as you think."
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Old 12-01-2015, 10:03 PM
 
Location: Central NY
4,669 posts, read 3,245,044 times
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modhatter: Your post is excellent. It is despicable what those in Nevada are doing to the mentally ill. Is that even legal? Can't some kind of charge be brought against them?
It's a truly selfish world we live in.

Seems I remember a phrase..... I am my brother's keeper....... whatever happened to that?
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