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I always laugh when some people act so put out over how others "mooch" off the tax payers. Hasn't anyone figured it out yet? This is a free country. If you are so consumed with envy over the things others get for free, nobody is holding a gun against your head and stopping you from doing the same thing. Give your money away, quit your job, go live on the street and you, too, can have all those free things. Nobody is stopping you.
But instead of having the guts to do that, some people would rather do nothing but complain and complain and complain about others doing what they wish they could do. But think about it a moment, if it's such a wonderful way to live, then why aren't there people stampeding to the Social Services offices and clamoring to live the high life on free Section 8, free food, and free medical care? Maybe because deep inside, these people know that for all the freebies poor people are supposedly getting, it's really not worth the lifestyle.
Sometimes there are better things than getting stuff for free, but believe me, if it meant the difference between a roof over your head or the pavement, your kids eating or not, or emergency medical care or death, you'd take that helping hand no matter what anyone else said about you.
Yes she gets SS and since she worked she got a small pension. That pension put her over the income limit. My dad, the breadwinner, died young so the ss was not big either. Think about it.... even someone who wasn't educated, was a stay at home mom due to societal norms and her income was still too high to qualify for help.
Well, yeah, her income was too high. Doesn't that make sense? Limiting assistance to those who are truly low income. There has to be a maximum limit. Having worked once in America doesn't mean you are automatically going to get benefits. That job does't make your mother righteous and automatically deserving of benefits. She has a pension above the limit.
I've worked all my adult life. I will never qualify for any benefits unless something traumatic happens to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodentraiser
I always laugh when some people act so put out over how others "mooch" off the tax payers. Hasn't anyone figured it out yet? This is a free country. If you are so consumed with envy over the things others get for free, nobody is holding a gun against your head and stopping you from doing the same thing. Give your money away, quit your job, go live on the street and you, too, can have all those free things. Nobody is stopping you.
But instead of having the guts to do that, some people would rather do nothing but complain and complain and complain about others doing what they wish they could do. But think about it a moment, if it's such a wonderful way to live, then why aren't there people stampeding to the Social Services offices and clamoring to live the high life on free Section 8, free food, and free medical care? Maybe because deep inside, these people know that for all the freebies poor people are supposedly getting, it's really not worth the lifestyle.
Sometimes there are better things than getting stuff for free, but believe me, if it meant the difference between a roof over your head or the pavement, your kids eating or not, or emergency medical care or death, you'd take that helping hand no matter what anyone else said about you.
Exactly. I grew up poor. I won't go back for any reason. Poor people are not living high on the hog.
I always laugh when some people act so put out over how others "mooch" off the tax payers. Hasn't anyone figured it out yet? This is a free country. If you are so consumed with envy over the things others get for free, nobody is holding a gun against your head and stopping you from doing the same thing. Give your money away, quit your job, go live on the street and you, too, can have all those free things. Nobody is stopping you.
But instead of having the guts to do that, some people would rather do nothing but complain and complain and complain about others doing what they wish they could do. But think about it a moment, if it's such a wonderful way to live, then why aren't there people stampeding to the Social Services offices and clamoring to live the high life on free Section 8, free food, and free medical care? Maybe because deep inside, these people know that for all the freebies poor people are supposedly getting, it's really not worth the lifestyle.
Sometimes there are better things than getting stuff for free, but believe me, if it meant the difference between a roof over your head or the pavement, your kids eating or not, or emergency medical care or death, you'd take that helping hand no matter what anyone else said about you.
You laugh? Money that pay for those "free" things is paid for by other people working, people who are away from family, missing their childrens birthdays, away from family on holidays etc. And instead of using the money they worked for being used to provide for their families needs they are forced to provide for your needs, and you laugh?
Your entitled, classless attitude makes it worse. Good people appreciate the help they get instead of laughing at people who work to pay for your "free" stuff.
And you wonder why people look down on welfare which by the way was intended for people who are unable to work. Good people who are unable to work would love to be healthy enough again so they can work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodentraiser
I always laugh when some people act so put out over how others "mooch" off the tax payers. Hasn't anyone figured it out yet? This is a free country. If you are so consumed with envy over the things others get for free, nobody is holding a gun against your head and stopping you from doing the same thing. Give your money away, quit your job, go live on the street and you, too, can have all those free things. Nobody is stopping you.
But instead of having the guts to do that, some people would rather do nothing but complain and complain and complain about others doing what they wish they could do. But think about it a moment, if it's such a wonderful way to live, then why aren't there people stampeding to the Social Services offices and clamoring to live the high life on free Section 8, free food, and free medical care? Maybe because deep inside, these people know that for all the freebies poor people are supposedly getting, it's really not worth the lifestyle.
Sometimes there are better things than getting stuff for free, but believe me, if it meant the difference between a roof over your head or the pavement, your kids eating or not, or emergency medical care or death, you'd take that helping hand no matter what anyone else said about you.
The next time you sit down to dinner paid for by welfare, ask yourself what is the child of the working parent doing without so you can eat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlygal
Exactly. I grew up poor. I won't go back for any reason. Poor people are not living high on the hog.
Nor are they intended to. Yet they always want to live the middle class lifestyle and don't have a clue that people in the middle class are using debt to support their lifestyle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlygal
Well, yeah, her income was too high. Doesn't that make sense? Limiting assistance to those who are truly low income. There has to be a maximum limit. Having worked once in America doesn't mean you are automatically going to get benefits. That job does't make your mother righteous and automatically deserving of benefits. She has a pension above the limit.
Obviously what your not getting is I'm telling you that the middle class is led to believe that there is a safety net available to us should we become unable to work or fall on hard times. That is not true. I've just given an example showing that the safety net is not for the middle class. The income limits to qualify for that safety net are so low that you'd have to be lower, lower class or a dead beat to qualify. Yes, we pay for it but don't count on it if you become unable to work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nightengale212
I am so very sorry for you and your mom, and reading this has brought tears to my eyes remembering my own mom. Toward the end of her life we too tried to keep her home after her last hospitalization, but she developed a nasty pressure wound on her coccyx which began while she was in the hospital that infected her bone which required a wound vac and IV antibiotics to treat. She never fought the decision to be placed, and when I went to see her after work one night and was in a rush as I had a dentist appointment to go to, she said to me "can't you stay a little longer". I stayed as long as I could and rushed like crazy to get to my dentist appointment which I wished I missed because those were the last lucid words my mother ever said to me as sepsis had evolved by the next day rendering her comatose and she passed away two days later.
You and your family have done the best they could for your mom, and although she is now in a nursing home you still can spend quality time with her there. You have the opportunity now to instead of being her primary care giver you can go back to being her son or daughter and spend your time together conversing, listening, and just being together which none of you probably had much time for these special things because all your time with your mom was likely taken up by extending care to her.
Thank you Nightengale, I think the best thing to remember with your mom knows you didn't forget about her and you always came to see her. Even if you had stayed longer she would have wanted you to stay even longer. She obviously enjoyed your company when you visited so don't beat yourself up.
You are right, while mom was home instead of really spending time with her I was always busy doing things for her, and I was exhausted. Now it's much different, I spend time with her, we go out to dinner, she has a scooter and I'll take her to the mall and she's like a kid while I run to keep up lol. She's known as a jokester with the nurses. The other day I went to visit and she was teaching one of the nursing assistance how to knit. Looking on the bright side, she's made friends with others like her so it's good for her socially. I was just very surprised how the system works. The middle class is in deep trouble if they think there is help for them when they can no longer work. Mom did ok after retirement but it was when she became sick and needed help medically that blew it out of the water.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodentraiser
I always laugh when some people act so put out over how others "mooch" off the tax payers. Hasn't anyone figured it out yet? This is a free country. If you are so consumed with envy over the things others get for free, nobody is holding a gun against your head and stopping you from doing the same thing. Give your money away, quit your job, go live on the street and you, too, can have all those free things. Nobody is stopping you.
But instead of having the guts to do that, some people would rather do nothing but complain and complain and complain about others doing what they wish they could do. But think about it a moment, if it's such a wonderful way to live, then why aren't there people stampeding to the Social Services offices and clamoring to live the high life on free Section 8, free food, and free medical care? Maybe because deep inside, these people know that for all the freebies poor people are supposedly getting, it's really not worth the lifestyle.
Sometimes there are better things than getting stuff for free, but believe me, if it meant the difference between a roof over your head or the pavement, your kids eating or not, or emergency medical care or death, you'd take that helping hand no matter what anyone else said about you.
Do you really think this is right?
Once middle class people who paid their way in life get no help when they are no longer able to work. They and their family suffer while the poor, many who never paid into the system get a lot of help. Look at the Nursing Home Transition program...
Middle Class: $0.01 over very low income limit get:
- nada,
- nothing,
- you're on your own,
- their working children will have to assist financially.
Poor: Government will assist financially, they will pay for:
- rent,
- home care nursing assistance,
- light cleaning,
- EBT (free groceries,
- delivered frozen meals,
- someone to cook those meals,
- home modifications,
- free medical equipment,
- free transportation,
- free medical (no co-pays),
- free medications (no co-pays),
- subsidized utilities,
- free phone
Do you realize how much someone who works would have to save to pay for all the benefits you get at no cost? Many times people from the middle class need their children to help financially, taking money from their savings which in turn puts their children at risk of not saving enough money for their elder years. And you laugh?
I was just very surprised how the system works. The middle class is in deep trouble if they think there is help for them when they can no longer work. Mom did ok after retirement but it was when she became sick and needed help medically that blew it out of the water.
You're surprised that there are income limits? Why? Wouldn't you expect there to be limits?
People have years to consider their retirement finances. They will know where they stand in relation to any income limits on receiving certain types of assistance.
I've worked all my adult life. I will never qualify for any assistance. I know this. So, I focus on never needing assistance in the first place. My life is way better than being poor.
I'm curious. How many people in this thread have been really poor? Like living in a car poor. I have.
You laugh? Money that pay for those "free" things is paid for by other people working, people who are away from family, missing their childrens birthdays, away from family on holidays etc. And instead of using the money they worked for being used to provide for their families needs they are forced to provide for your needs, and you laugh?
Your entitled, classless attitude makes it worse. Good people appreciate the help they get instead of laughing at people who work to pay for your "free" stuff.
And you wonder why people look down on welfare which by the way was intended for people who are unable to work. Good people who are unable to work would love to be healthy enough again so they can work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by petch751
The next time you sit down to dinner paid for by welfare, ask yourself what is the child of the working parent doing without so you can eat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by petch751
Do you really think this is right?
Once middle class people who paid their way in life get no help when they are no longer able to work. They and their family suffer while the poor, many who never paid into the system get a lot of help. Look at the Nursing Home Transition program...
Middle Class: $0.01 over very low income limit get:
- nada,
- nothing,
- you're on your own,
- their working children will have to assist financially.
Poor: Government will assist financially, they will pay for:
- rent,
- home care nursing assistance,
- light cleaning,
- EBT (free groceries,
- delivered frozen meals,
- someone to cook those meals,
- home modifications,
- free medical equipment,
- free transportation,
- free medical (no co-pays),
- free medications (no co-pays),
- subsidized utilities,
- free phone
Do you realize how much someone who works would have to save to pay for all the benefits you get at no cost? Many times people from the middle class need their children to help financially, taking money from their savings which in turn puts their children at risk of not saving enough money for their elder years. And you laugh?
Yes, and I'm laughing at you. Because you obviously have no concept at all about what a person who gets all those "free things" has to go through to get them. And you have no idea where many of those things come from. Free phones, for instance. Most phone companies have a buy back deal and then they donate those phones AND the minutes, to the program. So take that one off your list - the tax payer doesn't pay a penny for that.
EBT cards help keep grocery stores in business and those stores provide a service to the community as well as provide jobs. Do you have any idea how many grocery store would take a hit if EBT were discontinued?
You also obviously don't realize that the majority of people on welfare DO work - and they pay taxes as well. Your anger at these people is totally misplaced. Why aren't you upset at the corporations (whose CEOs make millions every year) who pay these people peanuts and then use YOUR tax dollars to make up the difference between what they pay and a living wage?
And even people who don't work pay taxes every time they shop and buy something that isn't food. Taxes that still go to support the roads you drive on and the FREE public schools you send your kids to. Yes, that's right. MY taxes while I was working supported YOUR kids in school, school YOU should have paid for. So you're sucking at the government tit as well.
Then there's the free rent you are unhappy about. Again, you seem to know nothing about how long it takes someone to get into that free housing. Many large cities have closed their Section 8. Other cities hold lotteries (how lucky have you been in winning the lottery lately?). In our city, IF you are lucky enough to get a Section 8 voucher, you have 6 months to find a landlord to take it. If you can't find a landlord to take your voucher, you have to relinquish it to the next person on the list. I think in 2016, only 50% of the people with vouchers managed to find a place to live with it.
I guess if you read any of this you'll miss the part about the low cost studio that had a 90 person wait list.
And let's be honest here. If you were to have a medical emergency tomorrow that would cost hundreds of thousands of dollars and your only choice would be to accept government help in paying for it or dying, you'd take the help. As a matter of fact, if you were faced with living on the street or taking that free apartment, you'd take the apartment. If your kids were hungry, you'd take the food stamps. If you became disabled tomorrow, you'd take the home care nursing assistant who would do some light cleaning and cook some of your meals.
That's why I'm really laughing. Because for all your highbrow ways and all your complaining, if push came to shove and you absolutely needed to, you'd apply for all those services in a heartbeat. And I can only imagine how angry you'd be if someone then said to you what you just said to me.
Let me ask you - if YOU needed any of these services, would it be right for YOU to take them?
Some of us in the middle class were kind of looking forward to a retirement that provided more than riding a bus, living in a 1 BR apartment, eating at a food bank and surviving on $159/month for food plus an additional $600 for everything else.
The middle class pays for everything because it's easy for the federal government to tax wages via W-2s and 1099s. Harder to get money from corporations or Hollywood types who use off-shore companies and tax avoidance schemes to reduce taxes.
You're surprised that there are income limits? Why? Wouldn't you expect there to be limits?
People have years to consider their retirement finances. They will know where they stand in relation to any income limits on receiving certain types of assistance.
I've worked all my adult life. I will never qualify for any assistance. I know this. So, I focus on never needing assistance in the first place. My life is way better than being poor.
I'm curious. How many people in this thread have been really poor? Like living in a car poor. I have.
omg, why do you try such a lame defense. IF YOU READ, you would have read that I SAID the income limits are so low that you'd practically have to be a dead beat all your life to qualify.
I've been poor but I never took a dime from government. I didn't whine, I did what I had to do to make money and climbed up the income ladder.
The difference is not being poor, it's what YOU do to get out of poverty. If you wait for someone else to get you out, you'll remain poor.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodentraiser
EBT cards help keep grocery stores in business and those stores provide a service to the community as well as provide jobs. Do you have any idea how many grocery store would take a hit if EBT were discontinued?
LOL, yea maybe in the area you live in but not mine.
In yours, people serving people like this furious woman filmed destroying a convenience store when her welfare card is rejected. the woman slowly walking through the store while knocking packets from shelves, sending items flying all over the floor.
No matter how hard you try to defend it, unless your physically or mentally disabled than you should be ashamed of yourself for living off the hard work of other people. People with this entitled mentality don't have the common decency to see it for what it is, and they give every excuse why it's ok ... like you are doing.
I guess if you read any of this you'll miss the part about the low cost studio that had a 90 person wait list.
'If you don't have a plan, you become part of somebody else's plan.'
-- Terence McKenna —
When you don't do what it takes to provide for yourself then you suffer the consequences of having to wait for 90 person wait lists.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodentraiser
You also obviously don't realize that the majority of people on welfare DO work - and they pay taxes as well. Your anger at these people is totally misplaced. Why aren't you upset at the corporations (whose CEOs make millions every year) who pay these people peanuts and then use YOUR tax dollars to make up the difference between what they pay and a living wage?
Even when I was in HS I knew that if I wanted to provide for my family, instead of partying I needed to plan and do what it took to prepare for the future. Did you think you could provide for a family on a low wage? Did you even think about it?
You're paid what the market bears, period. Now keep supporting those politicians who want to keep the borders open so there is less competition for employees and corporation scan keep wages down.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodentraiser
And let's be honest here. If you were to have a medical emergency tomorrow that would cost hundreds of thousands of dollars and your only choice would be to accept government help in paying for it or dying, you'd take the help.
aahhh and that's the point. The income limits are so low, someone who was once middle class who becomes poor can not get help .. even though they are forced to pay for it while they were middle class.
Obviously, your a taker, if you live in the life of poverty you can't think past todays survival and can't understand outside your world.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodentraiser
Let me ask you - if YOU needed any of these services, would it be right for YOU to take them?
Again, I'm middle class and even if I fell on hard times the income limits are so low government would slam the door in the faces of people like me... just like they did with my mother.
Again, I'm middle class and even if I fell on hard times the income limits are so low government would slam the door in the faces of people like me... just like they did with my mother.
Yes. The limits have to be low. That's the point. It's for truly no/low income people. Not for the middle class.
Since this happened to your mother, you see this through the lens of emotion. Like I said, I'll never qualify for anything. It doesn't bother me at all.
but I never took a dime from government. I didn't whine, I did what I had to do to make money and climbed up the income ladder.
yes and as Charlygal wrote, lots of us have done the same. But many of us have not become bitter and angry about it. Just yesterday I gave thanks for my life and my family.
I think you petch are way overinvolved emotionaly with other people, and what you think they should do.
When I look at programs that go to helping the less fortunate, I think of all the good they do, I think of the poor children that are fed. I don't think that much about the ones who cheat the system. Lord knows there are so many wealthy in this country who cheat the system.
No, the differences I have with you petch have to do with this seniment attributed to Mother Teresa which I will paraphrase as "if you help those less fortunate, there are some who will take advantage - help others anyway.
Dave
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