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Old 12-26-2015, 06:27 PM
 
Location: in the miseries
3,302 posts, read 3,580,382 times
Reputation: 3810

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Quote:
Originally Posted by rjm1cc View Post
I would skip this and pay my own bills. No interest in helping you pay yours.
Having said that I would be very carefull. My guess is you will be placing all your assets in a non revocable trust and will have no ownership rights to the assets. A trustee will have to be named and the trustee will manage the assets per the terms of the trust. I do not know if you can be the trustee. I would think not. How much will the trustee charge? Be sure to have a method of changing trustees if you do not think they are doing a good job. Income in the trust will be subject to state and federal taxes separate from your return.

If you think you will go through with this I would get a second opinion from another attorney.
I agree with you.

I know too many people who are 'protecting' their assets from paying for nursing home cart.

Why should we pay for you so your children can inherit?
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Old 12-26-2015, 06:34 PM
 
71,589 posts, read 71,751,865 times
Reputation: 49194
why should we all pay the bill ? very valid question with a very simple answer ..

for the same reason we as tax payers can take various deductions and use efficient tax strategy's to pay a lot less as our fair share of taxes then someone who does not utilize what is available to them and has the same pretax income . .

it is for the same reason that someone can be worth millions of dollars , be retired living off cash and get an aca plan that is subsidized because of low taxable income levels , its the law .

all these methods of utilizing medicaid are not dodging anything . they are all legal , sanctioned tools given to the public to help with nursing home costs since we have a poor system in place .

all these tools are a states way of working within the framework of a poor long term care system . states don't want impoverished citizens .

some folks are smarter and seek professional help to utilize these tools while others don't bother or don't want to spend the money to have a plan put in place by an elder law attorney .

you can't blame folks who know more and are smarter anymore then you can blame someone who cuts their tax bill . the tools and methods are out there . it is up to you to use them .

the more you learn about this the more your views change because you realize the gov't is allowing the tools to stay in place so they can be utilized .

i had to take a mere 3 years insurance coverage for an amount of my choice and just look what ny gives us .

no asset shifting and everything is protected with no limit , medicaid picking up all bills after the insurance , no income restrictions on income for the spouse at home , assisted living coverage and 6 years in home care .

that is one nice comprehensive deal and the state is fine with it being paid for by tax money , this is the deal they came up with . .
.

Last edited by mathjak107; 12-26-2015 at 07:02 PM..
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Old 12-26-2015, 06:59 PM
 
6,812 posts, read 3,867,159 times
Reputation: 15525
Quote:
Originally Posted by luvmyhoss View Post
I agree with you.

I know too many people who are 'protecting' their assets from paying for nursing home cart.

Why should we pay for you so your children can inherit?

Totally agree.
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Old 12-26-2015, 07:03 PM
 
71,589 posts, read 71,751,865 times
Reputation: 49194
and on behalf of all the tax payers we want to thank you for paying far more then what your fair share would be or could be .

to bad you get no brownie points for it , just poorer .
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Old 12-26-2015, 07:25 PM
 
Location: Ohio
1,217 posts, read 2,351,479 times
Reputation: 2214
Most people with assets don't want to live in the kind of nursing home that Medicaid pays for, that's what my lawyer said.
OP: if your banker said that a revocable trust will protect your assets from nursing home costs they are lying or stupid. Either way you should walk away from paying them money. An irrevocable trust might but you give up ALL control over ALL your money the minute you sign that trust document.

My great aunt signed over all her assets to her only child 20 years before she needed to be in a nursing home. Her daughter paid for the first couple of years and then the nursing home allowed her to stay on as a Medicaid patient. That's usually what happens after people exhaust their assets. Medicaid can ask for reimbursement after a Medicaid recipient dies and their home is sold after the surviving spouse dies too, depends on their state laws.

What do you think will happen when the boomers start needing nursing homes in about 15 years? Medicaid paying for all of them? No way. And I don't think many parents would sign over their assets to their children while they are still mentally able to function. Would you?
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Old 12-26-2015, 07:44 PM
 
6,812 posts, read 3,867,159 times
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There are going to be SO MANY Boomers with no assets and therefore dependent on Medicaid, that I am very skeptical that they will receive quality care. Medicaid already pays so little that many facilities and physicians won't accept these clients.
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Old 12-26-2015, 08:16 PM
 
4,127 posts, read 3,785,985 times
Reputation: 11333
You have to have divested yourself of all your assets for Medicaid to pay for your nursing home. There is a 5 year lookback. So if you don't want it to go to your end of life care, and you don't mind winding up in a double room in a place that reeks of urine, and has mediocre food, go ahead and gift your assets to your children. Hope that they will let you have it back if you want it. Might want to read King Lear first.
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Old 12-26-2015, 08:43 PM
 
9,682 posts, read 15,867,988 times
Reputation: 16038
Quote:
Originally Posted by biscuitmom View Post
This ^^^^. Plus there's never ANY asset test for Medicare.
OP, you're probably thinking of Medicaid and an SNF (skilled nursing facility, or what is commonly called a nursing home). Just be sure you know what you have your terminology and expectations correct before you pay that $$ to a lawyer.


Many people confuse Medicare and Medicaid, but if the lawyer gets them confused, stop right there!


You might be better to read up on the subject first, so you can at least tell if some so-called "expert" even knows wTH he is talking about. By the time you read up on the subject, you might not even need an "expert"


I'm going to start a business---its called Ask the Expert. Ask me anything, I will read a few articles, then charge you to tell you the BS version, and since you don't know any difference, anyways, or why ask me, you won't know you got giped, and I get your money
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Old 12-26-2015, 08:54 PM
 
Location: Close to an earthquake
890 posts, read 677,224 times
Reputation: 2390
The OP described himself/herself as age 63 and healthy. I know long-term care insurance taken out at that starting age is more expensive but I believe any serious exploration of options should study that math before giving away the farm.

And any serious discussion about this in the context of OP's original post would require we understand the amount of ballpark wealth in question. In my experience when this has come up for discussion, the people asking the questions are those of modest means. I've never known of anyone with a 7-figure plus worth signing up to give away their farm. Doesn't mean it doesn't happen but only that I've not witnessed it.
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Old 12-26-2015, 09:10 PM
 
4,649 posts, read 6,483,631 times
Reputation: 5394
Here you go. Start here.
https://www.medicare.gov/coverage/long-term-care.html
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