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Old 01-04-2016, 03:22 PM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 17,920,408 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
one of those rare times i am in full agreement with you . the answers can be endless if they are hypothetical . we can only talk in terms of our own situations generally and what we do...
The questions are endless too.

I'm a lawyer. Trained to deal with/solve specific client problems. In the best possible way. Not every possible permutation of every possible client problem in the whole world (which would be kind of a hopeless endeavor).

I think if people ask specific questions - giving as much personal info as possible - they'll get the best answers. Not only on line - but everywhere. Robyn
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Old 01-04-2016, 03:24 PM
 
71,490 posts, read 71,652,652 times
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well here is the summary of the partnership information .

What does this partnership mean to you?

If you buy NYSPLTC insurance and use the benefits according to the conditions of the program, you can apply for MEC, which may assist in paying for your on-going care. Unlike regular Medicaid, MEC allows you to protect some or all of your assets, depending on whether you select a Dollar for Dollar Asset Protection plan or a Total Asset Protection plan. However, MEC does require that you contribute 25% of your income to the cost of your care according to Medicaid income rules.

How is the NYS Partnership a win-win situation?

NYSPLTC helps New Yorkers pay for their long-term care without having to “spend down” their assets, as they would have to do if they relied totally on Medicaid to pay for their long-term care. By allowing New Yorkers to keep what they've worked hard to acquire, and reducing Medicaid costs for the State, NYSPLTC provides a win-win scenario for everyone.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

note: while it says they require 25% of income to be contributed the way the law is written our elder law attorney said the law reads that they only request the 25% and it isn't mandatory .

heck i would be more then happy to contribute 25% of unlimited income vs a max of about 2990.00 a month on regular medicaid and they take everything over that . .

http://www.nyspltc.org/

Last edited by mathjak107; 01-04-2016 at 03:32 PM..
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Old 01-04-2016, 03:53 PM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 17,920,408 times
Reputation: 6716
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
i would bet most of those who own any kind of variable annuity or got some form of bonus dollars either as a guaranteed growth rate or a sign on bonus has the wrong idea as to how that plan functions .

just about every variable annuity i looked at that someone asked me to look at has worked differently then they thought and not in their favor .

usually the gotcha on the variable side is it can almost never do better then the minimum or guaranteed rates .

the guaranteed rates are almost always inclusive of expenses , the variable sub accounts with the investments are not . a balanced mix historically gave you about 7% .

if you figure the almost 3% total fees and a 5% pay out rate coming out of the annuity that is more then you are likely to get so you never hit a new high water mark in balance to get an increase above the min or guaranteed rate .

stick to simple immediate annuity's or deferred income annuity's . they are no different then buying a cd . if you like the pay out rate that is your deal . there is nothing else to know .
Variable annuities make my eyes glaze over (and about 1/3 of my law practice was insurance coverage litigation - very tedious stuff). So if MEGO....

Alternative options one can consider when it comes to simple fixed deferred annuities are something like a laddered portfolio of zero coupon bonds maturing in various years. IBonds and TIPs used to be good too. None of these things have swell returns these day - although they might well be good investments again in the future.

I think one thing immediate annuities (commercial or charitable) can do is handle our investments/income stream if/when we get old - and don't think we can handle our investments that well - or at all. My father bought his annuities at age 80 - when he knew he was slowing down (not that he was that good to start with). So far - I am not slowing down - but I am only 68. Will let you know how I think 10 years from now. FWIW - when my father sold his house for $1.5 million cash at age 87 - after he bought his annuities - he didn't know what to do with the money - and gave it to me to manage. And I'm still managing it.

I'm not sure what I would do when I think I can't handle our money or my father's in the future. I do have some checks in place given the (slight) possibility that I might wind up with some kind of dementia - and not know what I'm doing. Two late husband neighbors of ours got early onset dementia (at age 60 or so) - and - before their wives realized what was going on - they had gambled away more than half of their fairly sizable savings in very risky options trades. I used to have options trading authority in our accounts. I don't now. Robyn
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Old 01-04-2016, 04:46 PM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 17,920,408 times
Reputation: 6716
Quote:
Originally Posted by mortgageboss View Post
Planning for healthcare in retirement is vital regardless of having children or not. We made the decision to purchase long term care insurance in our 50's so it will be there later in life. We have a Son, but wouldn't not want to burden him with our care.

Staying healthy is even more important, after all what good is all the time in the world to do things if you cant due to a poor physical condition. This is why I largely gave up alcohol (not all, but infrequently), fast foods, and other unhealthy stuff to put into my body. I have to make it last another 40 years or so.

In a few years, we will both be at the point where we can qualify for a reverse mortgage (62 y.o.), and that will be a major part of our retirement planning. Not paying a mortgage out of social security will open up some opportunities financially.

Planning for some sort of work in retirement is important as well. I have seen family members retire, then sit on the couch all day watching TV and in a few years, they developed Alzheimer's. You need to stay active to some degree mentally or else you mind will go to mush. Ours is to go back to work seasonally in the National Parks, work 4-5 months out of the year and travel the rest.
But healthcare is much more than long term care. It's health insurance when it comes to Medicare too. Which is what you're talking about at age 65 (as opposed to usually much higher ages when it comes to long term care).

Many people are under the false impression that Medicare is free or cheap. And that isn't true at all. My husband and I pay about $7600/year for our Medicare Part B/Medigap/Part D policies. We also pay extra for concierge primary care at the Mayo Clinic here (good primary care for Medicare patients is hard to come by in these parts).

Younger people should perhaps focus more on this than long term care they might need when they're 80+. Robyn
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Old 01-04-2016, 05:01 PM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 17,920,408 times
Reputation: 6716
Quote:
Originally Posted by borninsac View Post
Well I'm not one of those obsessing about long term care and I don't have a LTC policy but yes I do have an umbrella liability policy and I agree with you. I do have a good disability income policy that is very specific to my profession. I understand these policies are hard to come by these days.

I've bumped up deductibles on auto policies and home properties (both residence and rentals) to achieve lower premium costs because I'm willing to assume the risk. Ditto for health insurance policy. I have a high-deductible one because I'm willing to assume the risk in exchange for a lower premium which is still a lot of money at age 60.

And for the record, I don't buy extended warranties on major purchases. That's worthy of a separate topic discussion here.
That's a good area to bring up. Disability policies. Especially for younger people who are still working. I haven't dealt with disability policies in decades. But I suspect they're more important for people in their 50's or so than LTCI policies. Robyn
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Old 01-04-2016, 05:33 PM
 
Location: Central Massachusetts
4,800 posts, read 4,843,254 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
That's a good area to bring up. Disability policies. Especially for younger people who are still working. I haven't dealt with disability policies in decades. But I suspect they're more important for people in their 50's or so than LTCI policies. Robyn

In some ways they are but if we are talking late 50's and early 60's LTC takes precedence. One they are more likely to be unemployed or underemployed (working part time). Two it is in the late 50's that insurance becomes more expensive and jumps drastically in the mid to upper 60's if you can even get it.
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Old 01-04-2016, 07:46 PM
 
1,075 posts, read 1,117,167 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
But healthcare is much more than long term care. It's health insurance when it comes to Medicare too. Which is what you're talking about at age 65 (as opposed to usually much higher ages when it comes to long term care).

Many people are under the false impression that Medicare is free or cheap. And that isn't true at all. My husband and I pay about $7600/year for our Medicare Part B/Medigap/Part D policies. We also pay extra for concierge primary care at the Mayo Clinic here (good primary care for Medicare patients is hard to come by in these parts).

Younger people should perhaps focus more on this than long term care they might need when they're 80+. Robyn
My sister lives in AZ and she told me Mayo Clinic doesn't take Medicare, is that true?
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Old 01-04-2016, 09:00 PM
 
Location: Central Connecticut
412 posts, read 261,438 times
Reputation: 924
Quote:
Originally Posted by organic_donna View Post
My sister lives in AZ and she told me Mayo Clinic doesn't take Medicare, is that true?
They take Medicare, but don't accept the Medicare-assigned rates and may charge up to 15% more than Medicare will pay. The patient would be responsible to May for the overage.
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Old 01-05-2016, 03:24 AM
 
71,490 posts, read 71,652,652 times
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here is a very interesting video review by one of my favorite annuity analysts " the annuity gaitor , he looks at one of the most popular annuity's out there the ALLIANZ 222 which provides double the income payments if you need nursing home care .

it includes bonus bucks and many popular perks .

it is very interesting to see it dissected and examined under the hood .

it is an excellent video for learning where the gotcha's are as well as seeing just how many of these plans work since they are all very similar and why what you think you get isn't actually so .




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DW7jA2CP5wI

Last edited by mathjak107; 01-05-2016 at 03:55 AM..
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Old 01-05-2016, 04:59 AM
 
71,490 posts, read 71,652,652 times
Reputation: 49069
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
Variable annuities make my eyes glaze over (and about 1/3 of my law practice was insurance coverage litigation - very tedious stuff). So if MEGO....

Alternative options one can consider when it comes to simple fixed deferred annuities are something like a laddered portfolio of zero coupon bonds maturing in various years. IBonds and TIPs used to be good too. None of these things have swell returns these day - although they might well be good investments again in the future.

I think one thing immediate annuities (commercial or charitable) can do is handle our investments/income stream if/when we get old - and don't think we can handle our investments that well - or at all. My father bought his annuities at age 80 - when he knew he was slowing down (not that he was that good to start with). So far - I am not slowing down - but I am only 68. Will let you know how I think 10 years from now. FWIW - when my father sold his house for $1.5 million cash at age 87 - after he bought his annuities - he didn't know what to do with the money - and gave it to me to manage. And I'm still managing it.

I'm not sure what I would do when I think I can't handle our money or my father's in the future. I do have some checks in place given the (slight) possibility that I might wind up with some kind of dementia - and not know what I'm doing. Two late husband neighbors of ours got early onset dementia (at age 60 or so) - and - before their wives realized what was going on - they had gambled away more than half of their fairly sizable savings in very risky options trades. I used to have options trading authority in our accounts. I don't now. Robyn

i get a kick out of it here when folks here talk about their 6 and 8% guaranteed returns on their variable annuity's .

if they only understood the difference between an 8% guaranteed roll up and an actual 8% return on investment they would realize how little they understand about the product they bought .

an 8% roll up on an income account is not an 8% return on the growth portion which is your real money .

in fact that 8% roll up when they pay it out eventually comes right off the balance of your actual account balance in the growth account .

they can actually just about work out any roll up amount percentage they want to give you then balance it out by taking just that more of your own money out of the growth account when they pay it out

by increasing the rider fees for the guaranteed income roll up by basing them on your income account balance and not the growth account balance as they pay you out they are always one step ahead of you in effect taking back a good portion of what they pay out almost automatically ..

insurers can offer all kinds of crazy roll up guarantees because in effect :

they are just giving you back your own money for 15 or 16 years .

they have the value of time making money on the money you gave them for those 15 or 16 years

they collect a rider fee for those guaranteed minimum roll ups and create a reserve fund .

many folks die and never annuitize yet they paid the fee

many surrender the policy and paid the fee

many just take their money back in systematic withdrawals over time without ever annuitizing and they paid the fee .

they charge you fees based on the rolled up income value . so if you had an account value of 100k and paid 1% fees , with the guaranteed roll up you may have 200k in your income account . but your actual account value is only 150k in your growth account .

then comes 2008 . your income account is 200k but your growth account fell to 100k .

you are still paying 1% on that 200k income account value which has that fee now doubled from your actual value if you cashed out or died .

folks these products are so complex i guarantee you any great returns you think you are getting , you are not and don't understand your product structure and just what is your real money account balance vs an income account balance

.

Last edited by mathjak107; 01-05-2016 at 05:17 AM..
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