U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 03-15-2008, 05:28 PM
 
Location: USA
4,980 posts, read 8,438,668 times
Reputation: 2506

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkfarnam View Post
I agree. The fact is,,,, if you haven't been in the shoes of other people and know how theyv'e gotten into what ever position there in, it's not fair to judge and even worse to assume that if one person got himself in a bad position everyone else that has to struggle in life caused their own problems too.

And...may I add to your post...there are people who did NOT work hard or did NOT struggle and lucked out, maybe they knew someone who got them a cream cheese job, had good timing, married someone with money, had parents who gave them money...

While there are many people who have worked very hard for what they have, there are many who have made out by the misfortune of others, inherited their fortunes, or someone just liked them and promoted them over someone competent.

Yeah, the world is far from fair. and for someone to say that "hard work gets you ahead", I would qualify that and say "yes, sometimes, it does."
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-15-2008, 07:15 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
30,684 posts, read 49,455,573 times
Reputation: 19134
Quote:
Originally Posted by nebulous1 View Post
You can't go by wages...it is cost of living and increases. Everything cost less long ago, and you can keep going back.
But the rate of the cost of living increases has gone up. Last year, it was 7%.
Again, a one size fits all answer.
True.

To say that it is harder to save today is also a broad brush to paint with, another one size answer.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2008, 02:09 AM
 
26,591 posts, read 52,303,280 times
Reputation: 20433
I really think people expect more today and for the most part are unwilling to accept less... it is almost as if it they are entitled...

When I look how my Grandparents lived on a small Dairy Farm with 22 milk cows and working 7 days a week 365 days a year... no one today would do it. Even in the 70's they never had a TV, baked their own bread, put up preserves and kept a cellar full of produce they grew... They didn't need a garbage can, because they had NO garbage! Table scraps went to the farm animals and I can't remember them ever buying anything but staples and the basics... like flour, sugar salt and coffee. My Grandfather make all of the funiture or it was made by his father and handed down.

They only took one vacation and that was given to them by their children for their 40th anniversary... I could easily go on, but you get the point.

Many of my friends grew up with a single family car, one TV and 3 kids and 2 parents in a 2 bedroom home with one bathroom.

No doubt about it... it costs a lot to maintain the "American Lifestyle" today. My neighbor told me he spends almost $4000 a year just with AT&T for cable TV and Cell Phones for the family.

No one I knew, including my family, had a pension or Health Insurance growing up.

The idea of Retirement with money to travel and maintain a second vacation home is something I believe only came about in the last 30 years or so unless you were "Rich"

The parking lot where I work looks like a new car showroom... all late model vehicles and a car over 3 years old is considered "Old"

Many use the reason that they work and they "Deserve" to have a nice car... Well the older generation often kept a car till the wheels fell off and Dad did his own tune-ups and oil changes and would always look for a deal on a used tire or two.

My point is, it is easy to spend money... it takes hardly any effort at all. The trick is getting by with less.

Don't get me started on all the Holiday Decorations and made in China toys that get tossed every year the month after Christmas... never before have people had so much...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2008, 07:42 AM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
30,684 posts, read 49,455,573 times
Reputation: 19134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
I really think people expect more today and for the most part are unwilling to accept less... it is almost as if it they are entitled...
Good points, all.

I abbreviate only to save space, but everything you said is true.



Quote:
... My point is, it is easy to spend money... it takes hardly any effort at all. The trick is getting by with less.

Don't get me started on all the Holiday Decorations and made in China toys that get tossed every year the month after Christmas... never before have people had so much...
Again I say good points.

According to 'The Millionaire Nextdoor', today the households that ARE gaining wealth are doing it by living far below their income levels. Avoiding the stock market, and investing instead in themselves.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2008, 11:06 AM
 
Location: Oklahoma(formerly SoCalif) Originally Mich,
13,387 posts, read 16,739,735 times
Reputation: 4611
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
I really think people expect more today and for the most part are unwilling to accept less... it is almost as if it they are entitled...

When I look how my Grandparents lived on a small Dairy Farm with 22 milk cows and working 7 days a week 365 days a year... no one today would do it. Even in the 70's they never had a TV, baked their own bread, put up preserves and kept a cellar full of produce they grew... They didn't need a garbage can, because they had NO garbage! Table scraps went to the farm animals and I can't remember them ever buying anything but staples and the basics... like flour, sugar salt and coffee. My Grandfather make all of the funiture or it was made by his father and handed down.

They only took one vacation and that was given to them by their children for their 40th anniversary... I could easily go on, but you get the point.

Many of my friends grew up with a single family car, one TV and 3 kids and 2 parents in a 2 bedroom home with one bathroom.

No doubt about it... it costs a lot to maintain the "American Lifestyle" today. My neighbor told me he spends almost $4000 a year just with AT&T for cable TV and Cell Phones for the family.

No one I knew, including my family, had a pension or Health Insurance growing up.

The idea of Retirement with money to travel and maintain a second vacation home is something I believe only came about in the last 30 years or so unless you were "Rich"

The parking lot where I work looks like a new car showroom... all late model vehicles and a car over 3 years old is considered "Old"

Many use the reason that they work and they "Deserve" to have a nice car... Well the older generation often kept a car till the wheels fell off and Dad did his own tune-ups and oil changes and would always look for a deal on a used tire or two.

My point is, it is easy to spend money... it takes hardly any effort at all. The trick is getting by with less.

Don't get me started on all the Holiday Decorations and made in China toys that get tossed every year the month after Christmas... never before have people had so much...
All true and alot of what I've experienced too.,,,,,,,,,and then we have some people who's lifestyle isn't right unless they "Keep up with the Jones,s"
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2008, 11:48 AM
 
4 posts, read 8,730 times
Reputation: 12
As we are passing judgement on our piers who may not fair as well as ourselves, let's not forget that the median income in this country is still somewhere around 40k a year. A lot of people are not going to be able to retire simply because it takes all they make for housing, transportation, food, medical care, etc. If an individual's nest egg is depleted by a layoff, divorce, illness, etc. and that compounding effect is lost, then how can they have enough to retire? I believe the main reason why most people will have a tougher time retiring is an overall decline in the American standard of living since the '70's. It is indisputable that our GINI index has been rising (greater gap between the rich and the rest) to a level that resembles Mexico, whereas European indexes have fallen since WWII. Maybe we should look and see what they are doing to provide retirement security, as well as healthcare, etc. for their populations.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2008, 12:16 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
30,684 posts, read 49,455,573 times
Reputation: 19134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kitty W. View Post
... Maybe we should look and see what they are doing to provide retirement security, as well as healthcare, etc. for their populations.
What are you willing to give up, in order to provide cradle to grave security and healthcare?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2008, 03:41 PM
 
13,320 posts, read 25,565,364 times
Reputation: 20505
Major league taxes. Now, of course, most other countries don't begin to have the military budget that the U.S. has. In fact, Europe might well have been able to develop the way it did after the ruins of WW2 because the U.S. military was covering it from Russia (and no longer is needed for that).
I gather that the aging of the populations in Europe is presenting a difficult problem with funding. Also, because of generous job benefits, there is a huge gridlock in hiring- businesses don't want to take on someone who they cannot lay off, or have to cover for life or something.
A friend of mine was laid off in Hamburg from a 20-year job. He had a lawyer assigned to him to negotiate his layoff, got two years of unemployment, health coverage, and five years of funding into his pension (due to his age- 55).
Now, I don't think the cutthroat U.S. "system" is ideal, but maybe somewhere in between could work better. Probably an academic point, now that the deficit is extending into several generations for Bush's war and shredding of the military.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2008, 05:53 PM
 
Location: Atlanta
738 posts, read 644,173 times
Reputation: 279
It's not the government's job people to take care of you - it's your job. If you didn't prepare properly for retirement, then you simply have a less luxurius retirement. If you'd rather spend your money on a new car than on proper healthcare insurance, then you'll be able to enjoy riding around in your nice car. We all make choices. If you choose not to adequately prepare yourself for life's challenges then you shouldn't use your vote to elect people who will take the money from those who did prepare to subsidize your ignorance.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2008, 06:55 PM
 
Location: The Woods
16,958 posts, read 22,271,168 times
Reputation: 9066
People are in financial trouble for the same reason they were in the 1920's and 30's, they've become materialistic and have fallen into the credit trap, buying what they can't actually afford. People need to learn to live within their means and accept it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top