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Old 02-07-2016, 04:08 PM
 
Location: Myrtle Creek, Oregon
12,233 posts, read 12,495,497 times
Reputation: 19379

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pvande55 View Post
It is high time to open up the 401k to all private sector employees. No waiting periods. Contract employees eligible. Part timers eligible. And make investment advisors compete for the business.
Those are called IRAs. There is nothing keeping you from saving for retirement. If you plan on having other income in retirement, a Roth IRA is by far your best bet. It gives you the ability to manage your withdrawals, and avoids having your SS taxed.

I admit to being a little envious of those people getting matching contributions from their employer. I never saw that, and when they downsized me they gave me 30 days to get my money out of their system. I rolled it into an IRA.
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Old 02-07-2016, 04:10 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles area
14,018 posts, read 17,732,288 times
Reputation: 32304
Quote:
Originally Posted by matisse12 View Post
Perryinva,

I'm actually much much more of a Democrat than a socialist. I only mentioned socialist because you said I'm a Marxist. I've voted straight Democratic, never socialist.

And I've never been a 'have not'.

And I definitely have not been a 'have not with no ambition to do better in life'.

I have a bachelors degree, a masters degree, and almost a 2nd masters degree.

I made a living my entire adult life, worked 38+ years, and worked 23 years for two of the very largest & well-known law firms in the U.S, along with another 10 years working in academia at universities.

So your attempt to classify me went off the rails a bit.
So how do you explain your present state?
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Old 02-07-2016, 04:18 PM
 
5,426 posts, read 3,446,805 times
Reputation: 13699
My present state is fine, and as I stated I'm having a great time in retirement and enjoying retirement immensely.

This discussion became what it is when I, out of interest, compared a friend of mine receiving $1000 per month pension for just 10 years of being a public school teacher. (in upscale suburbs, by the way) and compared that to the $1278 per month I receive from Social Security after 38 years of working.

I never said the $1278 per month from Social Security is all that I have monetarily in retirement.

The discussion also became what it is when I stated some principles I believe in. A sharing of ideas about those principles.
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Old 02-07-2016, 04:39 PM
 
26,085 posts, read 28,490,143 times
Reputation: 24797
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrkliny View Post
Sadly it is healthcare costs and/or poor health that does in many families and results in debt they cannot handle. Of course, plenty of other families fell into the well during the 2009 recession.
But many of our health problems and health care costs are self imposed. That's just scientific fact.

93% of diabetes is completely preventable.
81% of heart disease is completely preventable.
36% of cancer is completely preventable.

These are our most common chronic conditions that are very expensive to treat. We could save a fortune if we were more prevention minded and had more discipline. Not to mention the suffering prevented:

Key to Affordable Health Care Revealed

The Buddhists have been saying for 2500 years that we cause our own suffering. They're right. But humans still don't want to hear that.
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Old 02-07-2016, 04:45 PM
 
26,085 posts, read 28,490,143 times
Reputation: 24797
Quote:
Originally Posted by Linda_d View Post
I really don't see this article as being representative of the millions of older Americans who are struggling financially at all. These are really examples of people who determined that they were going to travel around the country by RV when they retired even though they didn't have the income to allow them to do that. So, yeah, I think they made bad, self-indulgent choices ... many of them, and that they continue to make them. Sorry, but RVs are not cheap to own or operate or even park in a campground. Reality says that you can't survive indefinitely indulging your champagne tastes when you only have a beer budget.
Agreed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Linda_d View Post
The Retirement Forum on C-D is full of threads/posts from seniors living modestly on modest incomes of about what the people in the article have -- or less. Those posters are much more representative of the millions of Americans who are surviving retirement on modest means than are the people in the article. Many of them also got slapped upside the head by the Fickle Finger of Fate in their lives, sometimes more than once. Many only have SS and survive because they have managed to get into subsidized housing or have a paid off house, get food stamps, and/or qualify for other assistance. These are people I have sympathy for. These are people who I admire for making the best they can out of what little they have. These are people for whom I would be willing to be taxed more in order to provide them with more services because I have more than enough for me all ready.
This is where you and I have had disagreements on these boards. I think a fair number of people in group #2 belong in group #1. Yes, I get it. There really are some legitimately hard up people. But having traveled to other parts of the world, it just confirmed to me that Americans exhibit less self discipline and more self indulgence. We have a big problem in the U.S. with this association between spending money and having fun, especially when it comes to socializing. Call it confirmation bias if you will, but other more liberal people than I have said the same thing based on their travels as well.
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Old 02-07-2016, 04:56 PM
 
26,085 posts, read 28,490,143 times
Reputation: 24797
Quote:
Originally Posted by pvande55 View Post
There are things that could be done if the political will existed. For example the 401k is about the best retirement plan in the country - but most workers do not have access to it. Politicians could pass a law requiring all employers to offer it, and provide a refundable tax credit to cover alleged paperwork.
I agree with this. I am much more in favor of universal 401ks than I am about universal healthcare (which I hate). I hate to say it, but you have to force people to save. Otherwise, only 1/3 of the people will save a decent amount. My inner libertarian hates saying this, but it is better and cheaper than people being desperate and dependent on government handouts in old age.
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Old 02-07-2016, 05:08 PM
 
26,085 posts, read 28,490,143 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clikrf8 View Post
It is sad that someone like her who has worked her entire life but made bad choices in men and didn't go for an education beyond high school, has to rely on family and probably low income senior housing.
It's a sad situation. But being careful about one's choices in mates is one of those things that we do not emphasize much in our society. Too much emphasis on being in love, not enough on practical stuff. Same deal with no education beyond high school.

In other cultures, it's not considered a tragedy to get help from family. The fact that we consider it such indicates weak family and community ties and too much dependence on a corrupt government (and this should be plainly obvious regardless of one's politics).
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Old 02-07-2016, 05:11 PM
 
26,085 posts, read 28,490,143 times
Reputation: 24797
Quote:
Originally Posted by meo92953 View Post
Some people are just wanderers. How &/or why is it necessary to tie down a wanderer?
Which is fine. What isn't fine is the underlying tone of these articles that try to paint the U.S. as an unjust society because of 79 year olds having to work, while minimizing the role of these folks' personal choices.
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Old 02-07-2016, 05:25 PM
 
26,085 posts, read 28,490,143 times
Reputation: 24797
Quote:
Originally Posted by Escort Rider View Post
If you're on the road, those are the best kind of choices to make!
In other words, it's good to make wreckless choices, but not good to make reckless ones.
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Old 02-07-2016, 05:31 PM
 
26,085 posts, read 28,490,143 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonysam View Post
No, they are not. Look at what was done in other countries. They have been disasters.

The facts bear this out.

You have to be a high paid employee or have a working spouse to have anything in these junk savings plans. Hundreds of thousands of dollars would have to be in there for anybody to have a secure retirement at all. Few people are able to keep their jobs for 30 years or past fifty these days. Ill health or job loss, and those "great plans" are gone. Not true with a pension though companies and even some public employers have tried to circumvent federal rules.
I'm in my mid 40s. I've never made more than 52K per year, and my balance is currently $252,000. I live in a high cost area. I've got some money in IRAs as well.

....This is where the endless list of "buts" come in:

--But you don't have kids, a new car, live in a small apartment, don't have an i-phone or cable TV (all choices)
--But your lifestyle would make me unhappy (I find people are bad at predicting what makes them happy).
--But you're just lying (or bragging)

The "buts" go on and on....and on...and on.......

--"But you can't get a 401k balance like that living the typical American lifestyle"----Precisely...and I don't ever want to.
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