U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 02-14-2016, 02:10 PM
 
Location: Jamestown, NY
7,841 posts, read 7,325,793 times
Reputation: 13779

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by lenora View Post
I (at least partially) determined why she was ineligible for SNAP (food stamp) benefits. Unlike a house, the RV is considered a countable asset. If the RV is valued greater than $3000, she is ineligible for benefits. In addition, most SNAP applicants can claim housing deductions from their income, i.e. rent or mortgage, homeowner's insurance, property taxes, utility expenses greater than a certain amount, etc. She would lose most, if not all, of these deductions from her income as well.

It seems that if you have a modest income, you need to plan ahead to qualify for benefits, just as those with higher incomes plan ahead to qualify for Medicaid. All of this planning makes my head spin.
She also has the late model car that she tows behind the RV which is another asset.

I'm generally very sympathetic to people who are in tough economic straits, especially when the reasons are primarily out of their control or perhaps the result of their upbringing/cultural background. This elderly lady, however, put herself in her current predicament, and she has repeatedly made poor decisions that contribute to where she is today. I just cannot feel sympathy for her, probably because every financial move described in the article was just the absolute opposite of what I would have done.
  • She owned a paid-for mobile home in park in California. When the landlord raised the lot rent, she couldn't sell it so she walked away from it in order to roam the country in her RV. It's not that she couldn't afford to live there; she just didn't want to.
  • She bought the RV before she had even put her MH on the market. Maybe her original plan was to use the money from the sale of the MH to pay for the RV but my guess is that that wasn't really what she planned to do. She could have used the inheritance from her friend to pay off the RV or she could have put half of it in the bank and bought a small used car to tow. She continues to pay $278/month for the dying RV.
  • She has $50k in credit card debt. I simply cannot imagine having that kind of non-mortgage debt, and I am certainly not the most frugal person in the world, especially when it comes to new cars, electronics, books, and gardening supplies.
  • This lady does not seem to have a sense of "saving for a rainy day" nor of delaying gratification for her own benefit. I delayed retiring for four years so that my guaranteed retirement income will be about what I make working minus retirement savings, and I don't have to worry about downgrading my life-style. I would never spend $100 on an art tour that I had ear-marked for the dentist nor would I spend $21 on a restaurant meal when it was about all the money I currently had.
  • I have toyed with the idea of buying an RV and traveling around the country for years, but after crunching the numbers, it just didn't add up for me. The price of the vehicle, the insurance, the gas, the maintenance and repair, the camp ground fees ... it all adds up big $$ even before you pull out of the driveway the first time. Moreover, owning an RV more or less obligates you to go somewhere with it ... the overhead doesn't go away just because you need a knee replacement and aren't going anywhere this year.
This elderly lady apparently likes the rootless gypsy lfie-style that she lives, even though it comes with a heavy price tag, which is what she is paying. To her credit, she's not really complaining. The author of the article is trying to do that for her, I think, and so are several posters on this thread, including at least two or three who regularly bash poor people for their "poor chances". Somehow, this lady gets a pass from them, probably because they see her through the same distorted lens as the article's author.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 02-14-2016, 08:34 PM
 
Location: Baltimore, MD
3,745 posts, read 4,215,210 times
Reputation: 6866
Quote:
Originally Posted by Linda_d View Post
She also has the late model car that she tows behind the RV which is another asset.
My state and many others exclude the value of one vehicle in determining eligibility for SNAP benefits. Nor do recipients have to use benefits in the state in which they were awarded. A little less income and she'd probably qualify for SNAP in one of the many states she visits while working.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-16-2016, 12:46 AM
 
Location: Metropolis IL
1,595 posts, read 1,890,500 times
Reputation: 2333
Quote:
Originally Posted by Escort Rider View Post
When a person dies, the debts are not automatically "erased", but are paid off from the assets of the estate. If the estate has no assets or very few assets, well in that case yes, the debts are effectively "erased" and the creditors are left holding the bag.

To consciously plan for such a scenario is desipicable in my opinion because it is in effect stealing from the creditors; the people who pay for that theft are the other people who have credit cards and the merchants who pay the 3% (or close to that amount) for every credit card purchase. The losses from dead beats are figured into the cost of doing business and everybody else pays that cost, in a similar manner as we all pay for successful shop-lifters.
The obvious problem is how do you prove a corpse intentionally ran up a credit card prior to death? And if you can prove it, who are you going to punish?

You're basically worrying about something that you or society has no control over. Even if such a scenario could be easily regulated and controlled, do you really think your interest rates and cost of living would go down because of it?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-16-2016, 04:23 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles area
14,018 posts, read 17,729,443 times
Reputation: 32304
Quote:
Originally Posted by BLS2753 View Post
The obvious problem is how do you prove a corpse intentionally ran up a credit card prior to death? And if you can prove it, who are you going to punish?

You're basically worrying about something that you or society has no control over. Even if such a scenario could be easily regulated and controlled, do you really think your interest rates and cost of living would go down because of it?
My post wasn't about proving anything or regulating or controlling anything. Instead, it was about morality and attitude. I don't like the attitude that it's O.K. to victimize others, and that remains true even if there are very few who consciously run up large credit card debts with the thought of dying before paying them off. My own sense of personal integrity requires that I refrain from immoral actions even when there will be no consequences while I am still living.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-16-2016, 07:32 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,571 posts, read 17,544,804 times
Reputation: 27627
Quote:
Originally Posted by BLS2753 View Post
The obvious problem is how do you prove a corpse intentionally ran up a credit card prior to death? And if you can prove it, who are you going to punish?

You're basically worrying about something that you or society has no control over. Even if such a scenario could be easily regulated and controlled, do you really think your interest rates and cost of living would go down because of it?
It would likely be paid for out of the estate or simply written off.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-16-2016, 12:10 PM
 
Location: Central NY
4,658 posts, read 3,239,300 times
Reputation: 11917
Don't the credit card companies carry insurance for those losses?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-16-2016, 03:01 PM
 
5,425 posts, read 3,445,259 times
Reputation: 13698
I know a person who has $120,000 in a revolving home equity credit account. I have surmised from his actions that he most likely does not intend to pay it off before he dies. He says that when he dies his 'estate' will pay it back.....by which I guess he means his half of a house he owns with a life long friend with whom he shares the house.

He recently sold another house he has owned since his 20's for $110,000 and paid about $40,000 back to the $120,000 revolving home equity credit account.....but then he immediately asked for the $40,000 to again be added to the home equity credit account and it was.....and he has resumed his extensive traveling and trips.

I've mentioned it a couple times to him over the years, and he always says his 'estate' will pay it back upon his death. I feel that it is probably lacking in integrity and good values.

I think I've read that credit card companies are often not paid back the extensive debts that people die with. (the above scenario is not a credit card situation) One has to ask 'what if 100's of 1000's or millions of people created enormous debt and then died without paying it back'. So it would seem that certain individuals are abusing a system....which is in the area of moral values.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-16-2016, 03:20 PM
 
Location: SW Florida
9,744 posts, read 7,027,781 times
Reputation: 14219
Quote:
Originally Posted by matisse12 View Post
I know a person who has $120,000 in a revolving home equity credit account. I have surmised from his actions that he most likely does not intend to pay it off before he dies. He says that when he dies his 'estate' will pay it back.....by which I guess he means his half of a house he owns with a life long friend with whom he shares the house.

He recently sold another house he has owned since his 20's for $110,000 and paid about $40,000 back to the $120,000 revolving home equity credit account.....but then he immediately asked for the $40,000 to again be added to the home equity credit account and it was.....and he has resumed his extensive traveling and trips.

I've mentioned it a couple times to him over the years, and he always says his 'estate' will pay it back upon his death. I feel that it is probably lacking in integrity and good values.

I think I've read that credit card companies are often not paid back the extensive debts that people die with. (the above scenario is not a credit card situation) One has to ask 'what if 100's of 1000's or millions of people created enormous debt and then died without paying it back'. So it would seem that certain individuals are abusing a system....which is in the area of moral values.
Agreed, and IMO taking out a loan or debt with no intention of paying it back is immoral in any case. But in the case of the guy with the $120,000 equity credit on his house, if he died still owing money on that loan, wouldn't the bank or lending institution start foreclosure procedings on that house? I can see where a credit card company unable to collect on a debt where there is no collateral might write it off, but in the case of the home equity line the house is the collateral.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-16-2016, 03:24 PM
 
5,425 posts, read 3,445,259 times
Reputation: 13698
I'm not sure about foreclosure, but probably. It is not a home equity loan....he differentiates....it is a home equity line of credit....which apparently differs from a home equity loan.

It is complicated by having his long time friend owning half of the house, and living in the house for the past 40 years.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-16-2016, 03:33 PM
 
Location: Idaho
1,451 posts, read 1,153,447 times
Reputation: 5472
Quote:
Originally Posted by matisse12 View Post
it is a home equity line of credit....which apparently differs from a home equity loan.
In either case, the house is the collateral.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home_e...line_of_credit

Quote:
A home equity line of credit (often called HELOC and pronounced Hee-lock) is a loan in which the lender agrees to lend a maximum amount within an agreed period (called a term), where the collateral is the borrower's equity in his/her house (akin to a second mortgage)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top