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Old 04-29-2016, 05:40 PM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 17,942,381 times
Reputation: 6716

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
Yep, same in Japan! I relocated there after South Korea.

My wife gave birth in Japan, and we had her stay in the private clinic, round-the-clock for five days, with the baby. The experience set me back almost NOTHING...I think I posted it somewhere in city-data years ago, but if I remember right, it was something like US$1,000 for the private clinic to be there for the birth, and give them round the care clock for 5 days. I can't recall the price exactly now, but it didn't phase me at all financially. Unlike just giving birth alone and having your wife/kid leave immediately afterwards would have, if I were in the U.S. without insurance, or even with insurance possibly.

ANother time, we had an ultrasound done for one of my kids, since it wasn't a private clinic, I paid using the Japanese insurance system, they charged me something like US$10. If I didn't have insurance, that ultrasound was around US$500-1000, something like that, I cant recall exactly now. But the U.S., would have charged 10x that easily.

In short, the U.S. is just shockingly expensive and corrupt. It is still a shock to me, many years later, whenever I compare U.S. prices to what I get in even expensive foreign countries, comparatively.
I've been in Japan twice. And have met a fair number of people there. And the health care system there is still a little strange by US standards. If I was diagnosed with certain cancers at age 70 in Japan - there's a good chance my doctors probably wouldn't even tell me - much less treat me - or give me treatment options (that happened to a friend of mine there when his mother had stomach cancer - fairly common in Japan - she just died without any treatment at all). Here in the US - I would be told - and could elect various levels of care (ranging from palliative to pull out all the stops). Assuming I had the ability to pay for the various options.

I'm not sure one system is better than the other from a societal point of view (guess it depends on a whole lot of considerations). I just prefer to live in and deal with the US system. Robyn
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Old 04-30-2016, 05:25 AM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 17,942,381 times
Reputation: 6716
Quote:
Originally Posted by otterhere View Post
We OVERTREAT in this country; it's absolutely ridiculous how everyone's running to the doctor's every five minutes for every little thing. We could save billions by just cutting out the nonsense and telling people to suck it up. Viruses resolve by themselves, antibiotics don't help, antivirals are unnecessary, and you're just spreading the germs around by running first to the doctor and then to the pharmacy and then thinking you're cured because you've popped a pill and running around some more. Go to bed; it'll take about a week. And don't even get me started on "preventative health" and chiropractors (who aren't real doctors practicing what isn't a real science). If you want a massage, go to a spa and pay for it yourself. The waste in this country's medical system is mind-boggling. Oh, and you don't need SSRIs because you're appropriately sad about something. Don't even get me started on that, either...
If you're talking about viruses and the common cold - I agree with you. If you're talking about Hep C (also caused by a virus) - that's a whole 'nother story.

Considering the second part of your message - you might enjoy reading this (classic) essay:

Chiropractic: An Essay by H.L. Mencken

Robyn
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Old 04-30-2016, 10:00 AM
 
Location: Wasilla, AK
7,267 posts, read 4,154,513 times
Reputation: 15701
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
If you're talking about viruses and the common cold - I agree with you. If you're talking about Hep C (also caused by a virus) - that's a whole 'nother story.

Considering the second part of your message - you might enjoy reading this (classic) essay:

Chiropractic: An Essay by H.L. Mencken

Robyn

I miss the days of H L Mencken. I had a health professor in college who called them chiroquackers. I personally have never been to one, but I keep hearing stories of them always trying to get you on a schedule for regular tune ups so that they can keep the money streaming in.
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Old 04-30-2016, 03:37 PM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 17,942,381 times
Reputation: 6716
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlaskaErik View Post
I miss the days of H L Mencken. I had a health professor in college who called them chiroquackers. I personally have never been to one, but I keep hearing stories of them always trying to get you on a schedule for regular tune ups so that they can keep the money streaming in.
I have nothing against a good message - but thinking it will cure my cancer is kind of stretching it more than a little IMO. It is really stupid that Medicare covers chiropractors these days. Robyn
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Old 05-01-2016, 04:04 AM
 
Location: R.I.
980 posts, read 607,104 times
Reputation: 4258
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
I have nothing against a good message - but thinking it will cure my cancer is kind of stretching it more than a little IMO. It is really stupid that Medicare covers chiropractors these days. Robyn
The VA is also paying for chiropractic care as well as acupuncture but the focus for this treatment is on pain management and not disease treatment. I have seen some positive pain management outcomes especially with patients suffering from neuropathic pain, and for a few patients chiropractic treatment has greatly reduced or eliminated their need for opiate pain control.

I had the opportunity to witness two chiropractic treatments on patients suffering from sciatic pain. There was no cracking the spine, what the chiropractor did was apply paddles to the muscle group near the sciatic nerve that was in spasm which spasm was causing pressure on the nerve resulting in pain. These paddles produced electrical stimulation and vibration which fatigued the muscles which eliminated the spasm that was causing the nerve pressure that was causing the pain. Neither patient was 100% pain free following their chiropractic treatment, but both had a significant reduction in pain and were able to stand up straight from their previous hunched position.

IMO, Medicare not paying for non invasive chiropractic care would be stupid if there is a chance this modality can provide pain relief especially because there are few alternatives besides opiates and muscle relaxants. Many seniors can't take either of these medications due to the side effects they cause alone or when combined with other medications many seniors take to control their other health issues.
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Old 05-01-2016, 06:19 AM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 17,942,381 times
Reputation: 6716
The problem is that Medicare doesn't seem to limit coverage to the specific area you described (don't know about other insurers):

https://www.medicare.gov/coverage/ch...-services.html

And it doesn't seem like most chiropractors share this limited view of the utility of their services either.

A good chiropractor can do a lot to help you when you have mechanical-type back pain and other musculoskeletal problems. But until the chiropractic profession cleans up its act, and its colleges uniformly graduate properly limited chiropractors who specialize in neuromusculoskeletal problems, you'll have to exercise caution and informed judgment when seeking chiropractic care.

Chiropractic: Does the Bad Outweigh the Good?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chirop..._and_criticism

Note that we've had some issues in Florida involving some relationships between chiropractors and lawyers when it comes to people who've been in accidents:

Florida Bar sets its sights on 1-800-Ask-Gary, 411-Pain and other lawyer-referral services | News | Orlando Weekly

State Farm sues Ask Gary empire, wants money back | Tampa Bay Times

All of this tends to give both industries "a bad smell". Robyn
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Old 05-01-2016, 09:04 AM
 
14,264 posts, read 24,009,233 times
Reputation: 20092
While I would say that I have some real questions about chiropractors, my two experiences with a chiropractor have been beneficial and cost effective.

In the first, she adjusted my back which causing me so much pain that I could not work. The visit cost $50 out of pocket and I have never needed to go back.

The second time, she told me I had bursitis and that I needed to go see the medical doctor. There was no charge for the visit.
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Old 05-01-2016, 10:09 AM
 
Location: Miraflores
786 posts, read 895,747 times
Reputation: 1531
It is Sunday morning here and my one year old had a slight fever the past two nights (but fine during the day) Do not feel like schlepping to the Doctor, So my wife called the insurance company and asked for a Pediatrician to come to the house. If we took him to the ER (it would be free) but to come to the house on Sunday it will cost me $15 bucks. You gotta love this country!
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Old 05-01-2016, 10:58 AM
 
30,139 posts, read 47,370,265 times
Reputation: 16071
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
The problem is that Medicare doesn't seem to limit coverage to the specific area you described (don't know about other insurers):

https://www.medicare.gov/coverage/ch...-services.html

And it doesn't seem like most chiropractors share this limited view of the utility of their services either.

A good chiropractor can do a lot to help you when you have mechanical-type back pain and other musculoskeletal problems. But until the chiropractic profession cleans up its act, and its colleges uniformly graduate properly limited chiropractors who specialize in neuromusculoskeletal problems, you'll have to exercise caution and informed judgment when seeking chiropractic care.

Chiropractic: Does the Bad Outweigh the Good?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chirop..._and_criticism

Note that we've had some issues in Florida involving some relationships between chiropractors and lawyers when it comes to people who've been in accidents:

Florida Bar sets its sights on 1-800-Ask-Gary, 411-Pain and other lawyer-referral services | News | Orlando Weekly

State Farm sues Ask Gary empire, wants money back | Tampa Bay Times

All of this tends to give both industries "a bad smell". Robyn
We have friends who live next door to married couple who are both chiropractors...
They have on various occasions been in conversations with our friends and practically come out and said they 1--cheated their way through school, and 2-basically went into this field because they knew they could make a ginormous amount of money w/o having to be very smart...
So they are probably two of the worst examples of chiropractors although I think the public's perception is that many chiropractors are likely similar in skill and outlook...

My daughter has had problems with back pain and leg pain since she was a teen....she was athletic girl and still in her mid 30s runs and plays softball...still has issues with back and leg pain. When she was pregnant, teaching and standing gave her lot of side effects/pain...her insurance covered chiropractic treatments...
she would go for massage about every other week...it was the only thing that really gave her longer relief and she wasn't going to take meds because of the transfer effect...The doctor could help stretch out her muscle spasms better than she could do at home with exercise and heat...

I have know parents who took their children to chiropractors at an early age for things like allergies--
Personally that borders on malpractice on the doctors' parts...and bad parenting too...
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Old 05-01-2016, 12:35 PM
 
Location: R.I.
980 posts, read 607,104 times
Reputation: 4258
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
The problem is that Medicare doesn't seem to limit coverage to the specific area you described (don't know about other insurers):

https://www.medicare.gov/coverage/ch...-services.html

And it doesn't seem like most chiropractors share this limited view of the utility of their services either.

A good chiropractor can do a lot to help you when you have mechanical-type back pain and other musculoskeletal problems. But until the chiropractic profession cleans up its act, and its colleges uniformly graduate properly limited chiropractors who specialize in neuromusculoskeletal problems, you'll have to exercise caution and informed judgment when seeking chiropractic care.

Chiropractic: Does the Bad Outweigh the Good?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chirop..._and_criticism

Note that we've had some issues in Florida involving some relationships between chiropractors and lawyers when it comes to people who've been in accidents:

Florida Bar sets its sights on 1-800-Ask-Gary, 411-Pain and other lawyer-referral services | News | Orlando Weekly

State Farm sues Ask Gary empire, wants money back | Tampa Bay Times

All of this tends to give both industries "a bad smell". Robyn
Go to any State's Dept. of Health web site any you will find more that you can imagine physicians of every specialty with revoked or suspended licenses because the care they rendered was questionable, deemed unsafe, or caused actual harm due to negligent practices. I think it is safe to say all should exercise caution and informed judgment when seeking any kind of medical care and not just chiropractic. I have lost count of the physicians of all specialties and a few nurses I might add that I have worked with through the years that I would not allow any of them to lay a hand on a family member or friend.
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