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Old 03-25-2016, 06:27 PM
 
Location: Ohio
19,904 posts, read 14,232,069 times
Reputation: 16083

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal View Post
There is no statutory reason why Congress cannot or would not make changes that affect current benefit recipients.
The Supreme Court's "Public Policy Doctrine" would bar changes to current benefit recipients.
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Old 03-25-2016, 06:37 PM
 
Location: Wasilla, AK
7,241 posts, read 4,136,323 times
Reputation: 15643
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
Is the assessment something you could actually sell your house for? Our house has been assessed at about $400k - seemingly forever as a result of the SOH amendment - and we have paid about $5k/year in property taxes. Also seemingly forever. We could sell our house for more than $400k.

Also - I am not sure how prop 13 works reading your message. Our assessment can't go up more here in Florida than the CPI - or 3% - whichever is smaller. Our assessment couldn't go up 17% in a year - like yours seem to have gone up. Robyn
The assessed value is for tax purposes and has little bearing on FMV. If the assessed value goes down, the mil rate goes up. The politicians are going to get their money one way or another.
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Old 03-25-2016, 11:41 PM
 
26,589 posts, read 52,286,267 times
Reputation: 20413
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
Is the assessment something you could actually sell your house for? Our house has been assessed at about $400k - seemingly forever as a result of the SOH amendment - and we have paid about $5k/year in property taxes. Also seemingly forever. We could sell our house for more than $400k.

Also - I am not sure how prop 13 works reading your message. Our assessment can't go up more here in Florida than the CPI - or 3% - whichever is smaller. Our assessment couldn't go up 17% in a year - like yours seem to have gone up. Robyn
Only 3 ways for taxes to go up in California after the baseline is established.

Inflation adjustment which is limited at 2% annually

Voter Approved Assessments... this is the wild card!

New Construction as in additions/remodels...

The interesting thing about taxes is the part about Voter Approved Assessments... for most things this requires a 2/3 vote... to build a new school requires 55% voter approval

I live in the city so my tax rate is around 1.7% and voters are generous when it comes to new taxes even if the voter is a renter... because we also have rent control and just cause eviction statute.

The same home a few minutes away in the county would be about 1.2%... and if this were to be Castro Valley... you couldn't tell the difference or know you were not in a city... sidewalks, downtown, library, nice schools... etc.

If an when I move... it will by county for sure... less restrictions and less taxes!

My assessment was way over value and this is why I won my appeals and that took years to do... simply no reason for the county to expedite...

In today's market my home might sell for the assessed value... +/- 5%... remember I bought in 2003.

I'm also looking at some significant expenses... I have a true Shake Roof... these have been outlawed after the Oakland Fire storm... so even though my home is 1725 square feet plus the garage... the entire roof would need to be stripped, new underlayment and then an approved roof that meets HOA standards... about 25k right there...

Everytime I hear about cheap California Property Taxes I can't help but respond...
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Old 03-26-2016, 01:09 PM
 
29,775 posts, read 34,863,854 times
Reputation: 11705
Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal View Post
No one is getting rid of SS, not even the most ardent hater from the Republican side has that much nerve, and no POTUS would dare sign such a thing into law.


What can and probably will happen is a chipping away around the edges at the various add-ons that have been put in place over the years. As one has said often; SS as currently designed suits an Ozzie and Harriet American household that largely no longer exists. Being such there are distortions built into the system that benefit some at the expense of others. The recent changes to "file and suspend" were the first salvo over the bow, but there are likely to be others.


Simply put Americans are living longer and the question remains can a system be supported that pays out benefits to a person, spouse and or children for equal or even more decades than they paid into. This as the country has a labor force which is shrinking and has been so for decades. If predictions hold the worker to benefit ratio for SS will fall to 2:1 by 2040, that is from 2:8 in 2013. That number has been falling every year since 1940.... https://www.ssa.gov/history/ratios.html
Yes there are those who are elected and even more who could be elected who would sign and pass legislation to aboish and divert spending elsewhere most probably defense spending or more targeted and selective social welfare. The next war can't be off the books without a financial disaster which in itself would doom SS.
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Old 03-26-2016, 04:22 PM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 17,927,825 times
Reputation: 6716
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlaskaErik View Post
The assessed value is for tax purposes and has little bearing on FMV. If the assessed value goes down, the mil rate goes up. The politicians are going to get their money one way or another.
Here in Florida - our assessed value is supposed to be FMV. Although with all the recent ups and downs in the real estate market - our tax appraiser - who is an elected person - would probably have to work about 10,000 hours/week to keep up with all the swings in recent years.

When it comes to millage - my county is Republican tea party country. Whatever you think about tea party politics in general - no way a millage increase will be proposed or passed here (until the county becomes even more flooded with tax immigrants from the NE than what we are seeing now). Robyn
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Old 03-26-2016, 05:04 PM
 
26,589 posts, read 52,286,267 times
Reputation: 20413
In California Fair Market Value only comes about at time of transfer... often the sales price is used... but the statute states Fair Market Value.

There is a provision for a temporary reduction in value to reflect market conditions.

One key to retirement is predictable expenses... Prop 13 in California does add to keeping Property Taxes somewhat predictable.
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Old 03-26-2016, 07:05 PM
 
823 posts, read 564,166 times
Reputation: 2593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
In California Fair Market Value only comes about at time of transfer... often the sales price is used... but the statute states Fair Market Value.

There is a provision for a temporary reduction in value to reflect market conditions.

One key to retirement is predictable expenses... Prop 13 in California does add to keeping Property Taxes somewhat predictable.
In CA, a very old, very low tax basis can be passed down from parent to child or grandparent to grandchild. When I lived in CA, this law led to many cases of homeowners on the same street paying wildly diverging amounts of property tax for comparable properties. Years ago, I paid $12k in annual property taxes when my neighbors paid only $400 a year because they'd inherited their tax basis from the previous generations.

It goes without saying that those paying these derisory amounts of property tax had in many cases inherited considerable wealth as well as the homes they lived in. My children went to school with people in our neighborhood who lived off trust funds and paid only a few hundred dollars in taxes a year for properties that were worth millions.

Prop 13 is good protection for those who are living and a surviving spouse, but I see no reason that protection should carry over beyond the grave for generation after generation of descendants. Inheritance of real estate by younger generations should trigger a reassessment at FMV, otherwise those fortunate heirs are dodging their obligation to support the roads, public schools, fire safety, law enforcement, and other services that are shared by the community.
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Old 03-26-2016, 09:20 PM
 
2,294 posts, read 1,560,184 times
Reputation: 2737
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
10k now in East Oakland... 1958 Rancher with Formica and linoleum and 1725 square feet... and I live in a State where people Prop 13 made property tax too cheap.
How I miss Ca. East Oakland. OMG, couldn't pay me to live there. Worked downtown where people were getting killed all the time. Not as much as in East Oakland but....still a lot.
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Old 03-26-2016, 10:39 PM
 
26,589 posts, read 52,286,267 times
Reputation: 20413
Quote:
Originally Posted by josie13 View Post
In CA, a very old, very low tax basis can be passed down from parent to child or grandparent to grandchild. When I lived in CA, this law led to many cases of homeowners on the same street paying wildly diverging amounts of property tax for comparable properties. Years ago, I paid $12k in annual property taxes when my neighbors paid only $400 a year because they'd inherited their tax basis from the previous generations.

It goes without saying that those paying these derisory amounts of property tax had in many cases inherited considerable wealth as well as the homes they lived in. My children went to school with people in our neighborhood who lived off trust funds and paid only a few hundred dollars in taxes a year for properties that were worth millions.

Prop 13 is good protection for those who are living and a surviving spouse, but I see no reason that protection should carry over beyond the grave for generation after generation of descendants. Inheritance of real estate by younger generations should trigger a reassessment at FMV, otherwise those fortunate heirs are dodging their obligation to support the roads, public schools, fire safety, law enforcement, and other services that are shared by the community.
What you state is true... it is voter approved Prop 58 and Prop 193 that allows property to be handed down excluding reassessment subject to limitations.

Here is the info direct from the State of California

Exclusions from Reappraisal - Frequently Asked Questions - Board of Equalization

It came about in part because small family businesses and family farms were forced to close of sell out because the property taxes made farming or keeping the corner store no possible.

It was California voters that made both Prop 58 and Prop 193 law.

The entire purpose of government is to serve the people... as in public servant.
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Old 03-26-2016, 10:47 PM
 
26,589 posts, read 52,286,267 times
Reputation: 20413
Quote:
Originally Posted by Burkmere View Post
How I miss Ca. East Oakland. OMG, couldn't pay me to live there. Worked downtown where people were getting killed all the time. Not as much as in East Oakland but....still a lot.
Yes... I live in the one of the most dangerous cities in the entire United States... often called ground zero... always in the top 5 for as long as I can remember.

I've hosted a lot of exchange students and colleagues from Austria/Bavaria...

Some have taken martial arts classes before coming to stay with me in Oakland... some are very afraid if not concerned.

When they get here... they want to know to know where are the bad parts??? I tell them my zip code is the bad part... they simply can't believe it.

As far as getting around... they love hangin out down by the lake and uptown...

It been 25 years of visitors and to a single one... they simply don't understand the hype... or the worst in American is far better than other places they have been...

Just to balance the scales... I wish their San Francisco experiences were as uneventful as Oakland...

Two smash and grabs from parked cars, a pickpocket at Fisherman's Wharf and several genuinely afraid at aggressive panhandling... again SF and not in Oakland.
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