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Old 03-29-2016, 08:44 AM
 
58 posts, read 41,696 times
Reputation: 162

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Quote:
Originally Posted by LookingatFL View Post
RTB, I don't have your scruples. His sister left our conversation with empty hands and full ears.

It hurts, but you have to do that. Pre-retirement it may be called "tough love", but once you are actually retired it becomes self preservation. Very few families have the means to be able to support more than just themselves in retirement and getting sucked into that situation is going to end up in tears sooner or later. Better for all if it is sooner.
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Old 03-29-2016, 08:50 AM
 
6,283 posts, read 4,740,348 times
Reputation: 12884
I got the call a few months ago.


My sister and her second husband both stopped working in their 50's. He had a small pension and did not want to work any longer. My sister had to stop working due to health reasons. She was too proud to file for disability. They had enough money to buy a small house in an inexpensive southern State and tried to get by on the pension. That would have worked except they both like to gamble...not big time, but enough to add up over time. They also took a long cross country trip and an Alaskan cruise. He died suddenly a few months ago and my sister had to face the facts...no money, $50k in credit card debts, $40K in home equity loans and only a small survivors pension. By luck there she found an insurance policy that paid off half the debt. Then the stress revealed previously hidden health issues. She is facing a retirement life in disarray and just had major surgery. Her kids are trying to help her but after a month or so they need to return to jobs and their lives. A poor work ethic, no savings and spending money without thought eventually seems to impact family and friends. So far I have not contributed much. Like others I gave advice years ago. It was ignored and now with a modest retirement income, I don't want to try to handle issues that go beyond my level.
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Old 03-29-2016, 08:51 AM
 
Location: Loudon, TN
5,788 posts, read 4,843,885 times
Reputation: 19484
My 3 siblings are all great guys who worked hard for years, staying with their employers and planning to retire at some set age. Me too. Two of us made it to our planned retirement ages and retired with no drama. The other two are now both out on temporary disability and are planning their forced retirements this year due to mounting health issues, some quite sudden but not unexpected, to me that is. As they say, man makes plans and god laughs.

Everyone should have a Plan B if they are waiting to retire and planning to work until 65 or some magical age. Both of the two brothers will now have to create a Plan B on the fly, because the SHTF and now they are in awkward financial positions. They will survive without my help, they wouldn't dream of asking for anything other than advice.

I think those without any retirement plan will basically do what my brothers are being forced to do. Just adjust their minds to living on the available income from spouse's employment, SS, cashed out home equity, and creative side work.
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Old 03-29-2016, 08:57 AM
 
Location: NC Piedmont
3,911 posts, read 2,881,013 times
Reputation: 6291
Quote:
Originally Posted by LookingatFL View Post
RTB, I don't have your scruples. His sister left our conversation with empty hands and full ears.
I am not saying I won't have the uncomfortable conversation in the future. I just let it drop now when they want to shrug it off and I feel like I should say more.

There exists a reasonable chance I won't be able to help. Things ebb and flow and some days are better than others, but I won't shocked if I end up retiring with only half of what I saved. Exactly half. If that were to happen, that thread on manufactured housing could become very relevant. I could make those numbers work if I have to because I am willing to change my plans and ideas of what retirement looks like if the money isn't there for what I planned. I hope this doesn't come to pass but the thing is, situations like this are hanging over all of us; some of us just don't have any that we are aware of yet. What if one of my kids has a serious health issue?

It is a tough issue; if they have trouble and nothing has changed that requires me to adjust I will look like I have enough to help when maybe I don't. Another reason for wishing people would do the planning is they would understand that.
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Old 03-29-2016, 10:17 AM
 
Location: Albuquerque NM
1,661 posts, read 1,527,824 times
Reputation: 3650
Then there is my brother the accountant who worked hard and saved for retirement but plays the market instead of investing. He got laid off a couple of years ago at age 61 and couldn't find another job because he is so heavy that he can hardly walk. His portfolio was already overweighted in oil but he then put it all in oil for the dividends. Now he's in a pickle. The investments that are left would have to be sold at a significant loss and he is basically living on social security and loans from relatives. We are trying to get him to sell his home (high taxes and not much equity in it) but he is dragging his feet waiting for his stocks to recover.
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Old 03-29-2016, 10:18 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,603 posts, read 17,589,896 times
Reputation: 27682
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrkliny View Post
I got the call a few months ago.


My sister and her second husband both stopped working in their 50's. He had a small pension and did not want to work any longer. My sister had to stop working due to health reasons. She was too proud to file for disability. They had enough money to buy a small house in an inexpensive southern State and tried to get by on the pension. That would have worked except they both like to gamble...not big time, but enough to add up over time. They also took a long cross country trip and an Alaskan cruise. He died suddenly a few months ago and my sister had to face the facts...no money, $50k in credit card debts, $40K in home equity loans and only a small survivors pension. By luck there she found an insurance policy that paid off half the debt. Then the stress revealed previously hidden health issues. She is facing a retirement life in disarray and just had major surgery. Her kids are trying to help her but after a month or so they need to return to jobs and their lives. A poor work ethic, no savings and spending money without thought eventually seems to impact family and friends. So far I have not contributed much. Like others I gave advice years ago. It was ignored and now with a modest retirement income, I don't want to try to handle issues that go beyond my level.
At that point, you file BK and move on. You spend what you have and live off that and either have others help or live on assistance for the rest.
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Old 03-29-2016, 10:54 AM
 
Location: Grove City, Ohio
10,135 posts, read 12,392,750 times
Reputation: 13985
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
At that point, you file BK and move on. You spend what you have and live off that and either have others help or live on assistance for the rest.
I'm nearing 68, still working and not a day goes by that I don't run the numbers.

I am scared to death of retirement. Well, not scared of retirement but I am scared of not having enough money.

For comfortable enough I figure we need right at $4,137/month and we live in a relatively cheap cost of living state with extremely low property taxes.

Here is our budget as of today. Am I missing anything?

Prescriptions $120.00
Part B Medicare $243.60
Plan G $270.00
Plan D $56.00
Dental $60.00

(Surprising how medical alone adds up)

Property Taxes $100.00
Homeowners Insurance $50.00 (I guessed at this)
Home Maintenance $200.00
Auto Insurance $75.00
Gasoline $150.00
Auto Maintenance $50.00
Utilities $300.00 (Includes elect, water, sewer & garbage pickup)
Cell Phones $134.70
Internet Cable $123.27
Food $649.50
Clothing $100.00
Entertainment/Spending Money $649.50
Emergencies $300.00
Life Insurance $280.00
Home Health Care Insurance $116
Church $110.00
Total $4,137.57

It's surprising how much it really does take when you add everything you need and want.

Yeah, there is a lot of want in our budget but before I allow us to live in poverty I'd just keep working first.

If I quit working when I turn 68 our retirement income would be $4,857 (social security/pensions) without withdrawing anything from our pitiful savings. Yeah, we got some but nowhere near what people say we should have and we are going to leave what we do have to the survivor since we shouldn't need it.

But I am extremely fortunate I have the ability to earn $1,300/month working maybe 10 minutes from home each day so as long as I can work, which should be a good number of years yet but I do not count on that in the budget.

So many, especially husbands, don't think about what might happen to their wives if they pass away first which most of us guys will.
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Old 03-29-2016, 10:57 AM
 
13,931 posts, read 7,422,661 times
Reputation: 25432
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheShadow View Post
Everyone should have a Plan B if they are waiting to retire and planning to work until 65 or some magical age. Both of the two brothers will now have to create a Plan B on the fly, because the SHTF and now they are in awkward financial positions. They will survive without my help, they wouldn't dream of asking for anything other than advice.
I have been divorced twice at ages 39 and 49. My net worth today, inflation-adjusted, is a bit less than it was at age 38 when I was in extremely good financial shape. I then got caught up in the Great Recession and spent my 50th year unemployed. Since then, I've had no alternative but to be 100% focused on rebuilding my finances for a third time so I can retire at my "magical age". Very high savings rate. Very dialed back consumption though hardly a frugal lifestyle. My "Plan A" assumes I'll chug along until age 65 1/2 with no break in income and then stop working maintaining my current lifestyle. My worst case "Plan B" where I'm forced to stop working now as I'm about to turn 58 is pretty ugly. I'd have a roof over my head and food on the table but it would be a very modest life.

If I'd had that life event at age 51, I would have been screwed. At 58, it would kind of suck but I'd get by. Every year as I continue to execute my "Plan A", my worst case "Plan B" looks less awful. I wish I'd made better life choices where I didn't get divorced twice but I can't change that. I'm just glad I started this at age 51 instead of kicking it under the carpet.
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Old 03-29-2016, 11:29 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,603 posts, read 17,589,896 times
Reputation: 27682
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicet4 View Post
I'm nearing 68, still working and not a day goes by that I don't run the numbers.

I am scared to death of retirement. Well, not scared of retirement but I am scared of not having enough money.

For comfortable enough I figure we need right at $4,137/month and we live in a relatively cheap cost of living state with extremely low property taxes.

Here is our budget as of today. Am I missing anything?

Prescriptions $120.00
Part B Medicare $243.60
Plan G $270.00
Plan D $56.00
Dental $60.00

(Surprising how medical alone adds up)

Property Taxes $100.00
Homeowners Insurance $50.00 (I guessed at this)
Home Maintenance $200.00
Auto Insurance $75.00
Gasoline $150.00
Auto Maintenance $50.00
Utilities $300.00 (Includes elect, water, sewer & garbage pickup)
Cell Phones $134.70
Internet Cable $123.27
Food $649.50
Clothing $100.00
Entertainment/Spending Money $649.50
Emergencies $300.00
Life Insurance $280.00
Home Health Care Insurance $116
Church $110.00
Total $4,137.57

It's surprising how much it really does take when you add everything you need and want.

Yeah, there is a lot of want in our budget but before I allow us to live in poverty I'd just keep working first.

If I quit working when I turn 68 our retirement income would be $4,857 (social security/pensions) without withdrawing anything from our pitiful savings. Yeah, we got some but nowhere near what people say we should have and we are going to leave what we do have to the survivor since we shouldn't need it.

But I am extremely fortunate I have the ability to earn $1,300/month working maybe 10 minutes from home each day so as long as I can work, which should be a good number of years yet but I do not count on that in the budget.

So many, especially husbands, don't think about what might happen to their wives if they pass away first which most of us guys will.
That budget is a good bit more than I net in a month, and I live in a low cost area and make a little over $60k. $500/month for emergencies and home maintenance? $650 for food and entertainment? Some of that is just going to have to be dialed down.

I agree it's scary, but people seem to hobble along. My grandparents are what I'd consider comfortably retired and don't have a budget anywhere near that, and aren't in dire straits either.
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Old 03-29-2016, 11:37 AM
 
26,129 posts, read 28,521,132 times
Reputation: 24839
America is a country full of people who want to magically believe everything works out just because they wish it to be so. Then when things don't work out well, people say "Life happens" or they go looking for someone to blame.
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