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Old 04-16-2016, 05:10 AM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 17,935,948 times
Reputation: 6716

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bodyforlife99 View Post
Robyn, I think there's a lot of confusion going on in this thread due to my being misquoted by a specific poster. I never said anything about stealing a car. I also commented that he's had his annual eye exam. I also never said that my father-in-law has dementia (I said my father did)...
The first thing I would do is get another eye examination. From an opthalmologist. A loss of depth perception isn't normal. Some adult onset causes can be corrected/treated - others can't.

What Causes Loss of Depth Perception? - Kelly Vision Center

Find out what's causing the loss of depth perception before trying to resolve the driving issue on a permanent basis. Robyn
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Old 04-16-2016, 05:22 AM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 17,935,948 times
Reputation: 6716
Quote:
Originally Posted by biscuitmom View Post
It probably varies from one legal jurisdiction to another but our county attorney advised us that if we disabled my MIL's car, it was not a criminal issue.
He said it would be a civil issue but in that case our MIL would have to initiate charges. MIL's dementia was such that meeting the burden of legal incompetence would have been prohibitively burdensome here in TX, and in the long meanwhile she would have been a menace on the roads. But she was cognitively incapable of initiating a civil suit so we were good to go.
Here in Florida - county attorneys only deal with civil matters. State attorneys deal with criminal matters. And it is the state - not an individual - that initiates criminal charges. State attorneys wouldn't normally give advisory opinions. If you disable someone's car - you might be looking at charges of criminal mischief/vandalism.

Here in Florida - one can streamline the guardianship process by naming a pre-need guardian:

https://www.floridaestateplanninglaw...-guardian.html

And - although the guardianship process can seem daunting - it is often necessary in dementia cases. Because you're often dealing with more than driving issues. Robyn
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Old 04-16-2016, 09:35 AM
 
6,259 posts, read 4,737,090 times
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Robyn, I think both of your last posts are excellent. I will add just a couple of comments. I am sure the OP will not agree but perhaps others reading this will consider a different approach.


There seems to be an issue with depth perception. That is likely correctable and that fact that the driver had an eye exam does not mean they visited an ophthalmologist and had appropriate exams and follow up. For this and any other health issue, it is certainly reasonable to discuss this with the relative. Perhaps the relative will not listen. Plenty of posters have offered suggestions that anything is permissible. I disagree. If the behavior is illegal, then it is wrong. This would include hiding or disabling the car. Or just having an innocent conversation with the patient's doctors.


So what is appropriate follow up if the relative seems to be a menace and has other issues? Many elders will reach a point where they understand they need help but when that does not happen, it is time to schedule an appointment with an attorney who specializes in elder law.
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Old 04-16-2016, 03:41 PM
 
1,099 posts, read 664,772 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
The first thing I would do is get another eye examination. From an opthalmologist. A loss of depth perception isn't normal. Some adult onset causes can be corrected/treated - others can't.

What Causes Loss of Depth Perception? - Kelly Vision Center

Find out what's causing the loss of depth perception before trying to resolve the driving issue on a permanent basis. Robyn
We'll defer to his eye doctor and his medical doctor (since we're not experts). I suspect the eye doctor in particular would know when to refer out. I'm guessing no one here would have as much knowledge as them, shy of someone actually being a doctor. Thanks.

Last edited by bodyforlife99; 04-16-2016 at 03:51 PM..
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Old 04-16-2016, 04:17 PM
 
5,430 posts, read 3,452,633 times
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Even if someone has good eyesight and no discernible problems with vision (or they are correctable) it doesn't mean that person should necessarily still drive at an older age.....old age can bring with it all types of diminishment's and losses in a very large number of ways.
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Old 04-16-2016, 04:26 PM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 17,935,948 times
Reputation: 6716
Quote:
Originally Posted by bodyforlife99 View Post
We'll defer to his eye doctor and his medical doctor (since we're not experts). I suspect the eye doctor in particular would know when to refer out. I'm guessing no one here would have as much knowledge as them, shy of someone actually being a doctor. Thanks.
Perhaps your FIL didn't tell any of his doctors about his depth perception problem. Was any family member there at the appointments? Do you have the medical notes?

And - if he did tell them - what testing was done and what is the diagnosis and possible treatment? Again - I don't think anyone in your family has a clue.

Listen - with my father age 97 - my husband and I keep on top of his medical stuff and often accompany him to doctor appointments. Where we get all the info - and relay it to my brother the doctor on the west coast. If your FIL is in his 60's or 70's or even his early 80's (you didn't answer my question about how old he is) - I suspect no one is participating in his health care this way. Or in any way at all.

So - first thing I would do is get a medical opinion (based on proper input about the current problem). Robyn

Last edited by Ibginnie; 04-18-2016 at 08:12 AM.. Reason: rude/personal
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Old 04-18-2016, 08:34 AM
 
1,099 posts, read 664,772 times
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"Perhaps"..."You suspect". Therein lies the problem and then of course we have your assertions based on nothing. Your misquoting based on things that weren't said. And the fact that had you actually read the thread, you would already have some answers (i.e. father-in-law's age) and not be insinuating I said things that I did not.

I told you in my last post that I have very little patience for people that discuss things in this manner, and in your case, don't even have the decency to retract your incorrect assertions.

If you or the other gentleman have an argument about HIPPA laws, you can take it up with the authority I quoted. There is nothing illegal about talking to a family doctor about the bad driving of a father and asking him to check into it (that's for the other poster, not you). It's not relevant who has power of attorney for medical and financial matters (my wife) because it has nothing to do with it.

At this point, I really don't care what you or the other poster thinks because it's clear that neither of you put any value at all to human life. You're both so hung up on nuances that it's clear you would defend the death of another human being even after the fact by quoting a HIPPA law or your medical diagnosis (even though it appears you're not an eye doctor).

I actually applaud posters like biscuitmom who FIGURED IT OUT in her jurisdiction. Good for her! She clearly values the life of her mother-in-law and other innocent bystanders more than people like you and the other poster that will focus on every means available to keep an unsafe driver on the road. BRAVO TO HER AND THE REST OF THE POSTERS HERE THAT ALSO GET IT. As far as I'm concerned, a human life is priceless and I love that there are so many posters here that apparently agree with that.

We're done here!
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Old 04-18-2016, 10:23 AM
 
527 posts, read 1,091,084 times
Reputation: 679
If there's any doubt as to his driving capabilities.
Maybe you could install a camera and not tell him, like in the front grill.
Maybe front and back

Download the footage and monitor how he is driving.

If dangerous, show him, his doctor
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Old 06-18-2016, 09:04 AM
 
1,099 posts, read 664,772 times
Reputation: 734
Quote:
Originally Posted by borninsac View Post
My wife has tried unsuccessfully to get her father to call it quits in the driving department but to no avail. In California, you can anonymously report a driver to the Department of Motor Vehicles as being unsafe. That is what she did. The DMV called him in, gave him some tests and renewed his driver's license for another 3-4 years. He had a big smile on his face. Not that long longer, he had some more incidents and the big one is waiting to happen. If that day comes, hopefully my wife will have peace of mind that she tried her best.

I wish you the best. Your task is not an easy one.
Well, borninsac, my wife went for your advice figuring it was the fairest thing to do in case she was overreacting to the situation. My Father-in-Law took the test and it ended quickly. His license has been revoked by the DMV. We now have a schedule of where he wants to go and when. Between the 3 sisters, the 3 son-in-laws, and taxis, Dad is getting to go everywhere he needs to go and we are all sleeping better at night knowing he isn't going to kill himself or kill someone else. I appreciate your advice and others on here for helping us get through a pretty frightening event. It's one of the reasons I like this forum (with the exception of few, many are very helpful). Thank You!

Last edited by bodyforlife99; 06-18-2016 at 09:36 AM..
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Old 06-18-2016, 02:53 PM
mlb
 
Location: North Monterey County
3,181 posts, read 2,857,897 times
Reputation: 4878
Quote:
Originally Posted by bodyforlife99 View Post
Well, borninsac, my wife went for your advice figuring it was the fairest thing to do in case she was overreacting to the situation. My Father-in-Law took the test and it ended quickly. His license has been revoked by the DMV. We now have a schedule of where he wants to go and when. Between the 3 sisters, the 3 son-in-laws, and taxis, Dad is getting to go everywhere he needs to go and we are all sleeping better at night knowing he isn't going to kill himself or kill someone else. I appreciate your advice and others on here for helping us get through a pretty frightening event. It's one of the reasons I like this forum (with the exception of few, many are very helpful). Thank You!
We did the very same thing for my MIL in Los Angeles. We reported them anonymously, indicating that my FIL was driving without a license because my MIL - who does drive but poorly - wanted to be shuttled around by dad. Dad was experiencing syncopal episodes. We knew that could happen behind the wheel so we acted quickly.

Since we live 700 miles away from them - they freaked when her license was denied. We had a come-to-Jesus moment with them and told them it was time for assisted living - for someone else to do the driving.

We're glad we did. FIL passed away 7 months later (heart attack) and MIL is still alive at 95 - now three years later. She gets around by the bus at the ALC and friends in town.

You did the right thing and saved lives.
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