U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 10-19-2016, 02:52 PM
 
2,952 posts, read 1,640,257 times
Reputation: 5292

Advertisements

You have to research the policies.

We had a lawyer look at mine and explain it in case we were missing something. I bought mine through an RIA who is padi a yearly fee to handle our investments. He made no money off this policy. It would be illegal do to our agreement with him.

Mine is not cheap - $8700.00 per year. But its life insurance first with LTC rider added.
I will get something for my money. If I went in today for LTC it pays $6300.00 per month, 5% increase per year.

I am guaranteed at least the life insurance amount, $300,000. If LTC kicks in, they have to pay till I die, even if it ends up being more than face value of insurance.

if I'm in LTC for a short time, that amount paid out is subtracted from the face value of the insurance.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-19-2016, 03:05 PM
 
71,637 posts, read 71,777,271 times
Reputation: 49230
We looked at the hybrid policy but did not go with it.
In order to get enough to cover us 20 years from now i would have to plunk down so much at little return it was a poor deal. For a percent or so of the gains from keeping our money invested we have a full blown ltc policy with all the perks
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-19-2016, 03:08 PM
 
1,189 posts, read 664,663 times
Reputation: 4119
Quote:
Originally Posted by honobob View Post
As a single I wonder why married people think we don't need LTCi. My policy pays for in home care
to keep me out of a nursing home. My experience is that the spouse usually provides that care. Without a spouse I will rely heavily on my policy because without it I'll be in a facility.
Many singles I know have worked all their lives, own their own homes, have major Social Security payments due to their long working history, maybe a pension and a very healthy portfolio. I can understand if they feel they can comfortably cover their LTC costs without affecting anyone else.

Most of my single friends are choosing to sell their homes and move into a CCCR for long term care options, plus social benefits for themselves. They feel safer in a community rather than with rotating caregivers alone at home, especially as they get older and frailer. Everyone has their own opinions about that.

But I agree with you that if you choose to stay in your home or even if you don't, LTCi is a good thing to have if feasible and affordable. You were lucky/smart to get a great policy at a younger age.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-19-2016, 03:10 PM
 
71,637 posts, read 71,777,271 times
Reputation: 49230
In our area those cccr's are insanely priced. They are really for the wealthy here and i mean wealthy
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-19-2016, 03:12 PM
 
662 posts, read 478,963 times
Reputation: 1690
Here's an interesting study (bold added by me, in regards to the study being about single individuals, and longitudinal data...really the only useful kind in this regard): Here's a New Reason to Think Twice Before Buying Long-term Care Insurance | TIME

...And the study is already 2 years old. The LTHCi business is getting more and more dicey.

"...a new study by Boston College’s Center for Retirement Research, which found that long-term care insurance makes financial sense for far fewer people than originally thought—only about 20% of those eligible vs. earlier estimates of 30% to 40%. “Previous research has overstated the financial risks of going into nursing home care,” says study co-author Anthony Webb, senior research economist at the Center.

Make no mistake, long-term care is dangerously expensive. As a recent study by EBRI found, when you factor in long-term care costs, most lower-income households will run short of money in retirement, and even among middle-class and upper-income families, the odds of running short soar.

But the Center’s analysis, which focused on single individuals, found that the odds of requiring long, expensive stays in a nursing facility are lower than previously thought. By using longitudinal data, the Center found that individuals typically transition through different care stages—from living independently to needing some assistance to nursing home—and, often, back again. That brings down the odds of a long and costly stay in a facility, Webb says. (A typical nursing home costs $212 day or $77,000 a year, according to a recent survey.)

One factor not addressed by the study is that long-term care insurance is becoming a riskier purchase. After discovering that they had underestimated the likelihood that policyholders would file claims, many insurers have raised premiums or stopped selling this coverage altogether. Recently Genworth, one of the leading long-term care insurers, posted steep losses, and some analysts warned that its business outlook is dicey...."
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-19-2016, 03:22 PM
 
71,637 posts, read 71,777,271 times
Reputation: 49230
The group studied was a generation ago who lived shorter lives. Current boomers are not of age to be in any study yet. Lets see what these studies show in 20 years and including all the other forms of long term care from in home ,assisted living ,cccr's and snf. Want to bet it looks a lot different?

Like i said forget statistics. All that counts is which side of the statistic you are on. I already saw with my dad how easy it is to be on the wrong side and the ramifications and impoverishment if you are the chosen one
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-19-2016, 03:35 PM
 
Location: Massachusetts
207 posts, read 132,057 times
Reputation: 533
I just got home and saw all the posts on this topic. I'd like to offer a few observations:

Observation #1 - Perhaps I should have defined expensive. I got LTCi quotes from a reputable broker for three large insurance companies for a joint policy for my wife and me. We were 60 and 58, respectively, when we got the quotes. The quotes were all about $8,500 per year. The coverage included: i) a $9,000 monthly benefit; ii) 3 years of coverage; iii) a maximum lifetime benefit of $325,000; iv) 3% inflation protection; and v) a 90 day exclusion period. I don't have access to any kind of group policy and my state does not have partnership policies, so I am at the mercy of the commercial market. I invite those of you thinking about LTCi to get quotes of your own. Many of the low premium numbers you're hearing from other posters may not be available to you or are for lower benefit amounts.

Observation #2 - Given it was going to cost $8,500/ yr for 3 years of coverage, we would still be very exposed if we needed care for 5 to 15 years. We still had an exposure problem.

Observation #3 - Probability matters to me. I don't understand how you can't factor that into your decision. I also don't understand the "you don't want to be on the wrong side of the statistic" argument and ignore the likelihood of the event in question. If you play that argument out to its logical extreme, you wouldn't do anything that involves risk. Life is inherently risky. For example, you would never get on an airplane, because you wouldn't want to be on the wrong side of plane crash statistics. If probability doesn't matter to you, then I apologize to anyone I've offended with my observations.

Observation #4 - Repeating a weak argument doesn't make it a strong argument. It makes it a repetitive argument.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-19-2016, 03:38 PM
 
662 posts, read 478,963 times
Reputation: 1690
re: mj's post: I think it's safe to say that longitudinal data is a difficult thing to get at in the retirement age bracket. I certainly wouldn't throw out the baby with the bathwater.

But the last paragraph is important:

"One factor not addressed by the study is that long-term care insurance is becoming a riskier purchase. After discovering that they had underestimated the likelihood that policyholders would file claims, many insurers have raised premiums or stopped selling this coverage altogether. Recently Genworth, one of the leading long-term care insurers, posted steep losses, and some analysts warned that its business outlook is dicey...."

For me it's a poor risk. For you, perhaps not.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-19-2016, 03:41 PM
 
662 posts, read 478,963 times
Reputation: 1690
These bear repeating...bold added by me:

Quote:
Originally Posted by HopHillers View Post

Observation #3 - Probability matters to me. I don't understand how you can't factor that into your decision. I also don't understand the "you don't want to be on the wrong side of the statistic" argument and ignore the likelihood of the event in question. If you play that argument out to its logical extreme, you wouldn't do anything that involves risk. Life is inherently risky. For example, you would never get on an airplane, because you wouldn't want to be on the wrong side of plane crash statistics. If probability doesn't matter to you, then I apologize to anyone I've offended with my observations.

Observation #4 - Repeating a weak argument doesn't make it a strong argument. It makes it a repetitive argument.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-19-2016, 03:50 PM
 
Location: Eastern UP of Michigan
1,202 posts, read 682,964 times
Reputation: 1271
Quote:
Originally Posted by reneeh63 View Post
If he had LTCi, had been able to afford a "good" plan, and that plan actually paid out.

I REALLY want to hear from people who have had good experiences collecting on themselves or a spouse and to learn what options they selected and the company.


Jims mom paid about 14K in premiums her life---policy was 1988ish and covered 100/day for 5 years.
She received a retro payment of about 30k when she was approved and received about the same as monthly payments.


She would have still have about 3 years go and was in marvelous physical condition. No meds at all except for her progressive dementia and related problems. Then she fell. The SNF felt she was the type that could have been one of the patients that would require mulitiple years of 100% care.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top