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Old 11-01-2016, 08:09 AM
 
12,853 posts, read 14,158,692 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyewackette View Post
...
Greece, for instance. I could easily live very very well in Greece (if I could avoid the political upheaval and the Neo-Nazis, which is the other side of the coin for many places that are "cheap" to live).
Most of this would have zero effect on you, unless you chose to go out and check-out a riot and get hit with a flying rock, or something not too brainy like that. No Greek is going to be interested in knocking your block off, and do you really care about the local political upheaval?....what political upheaval in Greece in the last thirty or forty years would have threatened an American living in Greece? As for the fascist movement, you have just as much in the U.S., and no body seems terribly nutso about it.

Quote:
But Greece requires you to have hundreds of thousands of dollars to put in a Greek bank before they'll let you go live there. And given their economic state, that's not really a smart thing to do even if you had the money. And frankly, if I had that kind of cash, I wouldn't need to go live in Greece. Plus - there's no mention of how liquid those funds are once a Greek bank has gotten hold of it. Are they holding your funds hostage? If you leave, will they keep any portion of that? Will it take months or even years to retrieve your funds? What if you SPEND that money - will they kick you out if your balance drops down to $99,999.99?
What the Greeks are concerned about is whether you think you are going to work there or retire. The former alternative has several options.

Retirement has recently required only an income of 2,000 euros per month. If you buy a house, you can import the funds from your U.S. bank, but you must show that you can pay the taxes on it as well.

Where is the link to the claim that one needs "hundreds of thousands of dollars to be put in a Greek bank before you can go live there"? This does not jibe with info I had in the recent past.

I feel there are reasons not to go live in Greece, but none of the above are among them.
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Old 11-01-2016, 08:22 AM
 
12,853 posts, read 14,158,692 times
Reputation: 35163
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfingduo View Post
I know this has been asked and reasked and asked once again. Everyone has a great time talking about their state or the country that they live in. A lot of others dream of a place that they can live in that will allow them more freedom with regards to how much money they have as discretionary spending. I saw this article and had to put it out there for everyone to go through. Please feel free to jump in.

World's cheapest 50 countries to live in - 2016
As usual the focus is solely on living cheaper. And to my mind and for my US dollars, I think - as I have said dozens of times before on C-D - really should not be your overriding consideration for moving ANYWHERE.

Why? Because what this probably means is that you have never thought about the fact that even in the loveliest of cheaper countries you will not be living in the U.S., and you should be willing and happy to make a number of adjustments to make your life more interesting and more pleasant there. Unless, of course, you want to sit in some foreign enclave in that country and b itch about how awful "they" are outside your gilded ghetto walls.

If it is just a consideration of money, stay in the U.S. because you are going to be totally miserable with this that and the other thing that you must have, but don't need every single moment of the day. Trust me, I've gone the route of emigrating from the U.S. and I have seen others who have done it: DO NOT EVEN THINK OF DOING IT JUST FOR THE MONEY YOU THINK YOU WILL SAVE.

According to the chart https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-livin...jsp?title=2016 I live in a place more than thirty slots down from the U.S. on the chart. I have far more physical things than I had in the U.S., and far more that I could find at my income level in an area where I would have wanted to live when I left the U.S....including the very important healthcare....and on to the nicer if more frivolous side, meaning most of the time with a residence with a near view of the sea. I have loved it. But I do not live in a Golden Ghetto of English-speakers, though I could afford it...and, in fact, avoid the people that live there. I learned an adequate amount of the language to be able to deal with the basics of life and to travel around with no problems, I learned the history of the country so as to not be a perpetual total outsider, I live in a neighborhood of local people and feel fine about it. And do not feel the slightest bit distressed by the lack of products that I ate or used when I lived in the U.S., etc., etc.

But I very, very firmly feel that if when you close your eyes and imagine yourself in cheaper country X, you see yourself in every other way as if you were still in the U.S. STOP! Even in an expat golden ghetto it isn't really going to be that way. You've got be willing to go ass over tea kettle getting all the legal rigamarole done after you arrive (local driving license, local bank account, local direct debit card, local tax number, local residency card) and still come up feeling great about the PIA of it all, and next imagine your dream house and all its cupboards totally empty of every single thing you have and are familiar with, and then imagine the craziness of getting settled and stocking up and enjoying the newness and craziness of it....much of it in a language you may not yet understand very well or at all. It is a circus, both annoying and funny, and enjoyable if you are not all the time thinking Walmart, etc.

Last edited by kevxu; 11-01-2016 at 08:53 AM..
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Old 11-01-2016, 07:31 PM
 
Location: Northern Wisconsin
8,890 posts, read 7,767,007 times
Reputation: 15395
I figured someplace in Africa might be very cheap, but I was surprised to recently find that prices for land in Niarobi Kenya are actually pretty steep. Plus you need a bunch of immunizations to go there and still get things like Malaria. Not good for old people who don't have any immunity to stuff they deal with all the time.
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Old 11-01-2016, 07:51 PM
Q44
 
Location: Hudson Valley, NY
895 posts, read 770,209 times
Reputation: 1761
There wasn't a single country on the list that I would want to visit let alone live or retire in.
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Old 11-01-2016, 08:11 PM
 
Location: University City, Philadelphia
22,592 posts, read 12,378,207 times
Reputation: 15501
I know ex-pats who retired to other places and are pleased with their move. Some of the places the ex-pats I know moved to include the Dominican Republic, Panama, Mexico, Thailand, Israel, and Nepal.

I'm not sure if this is entirely true anymore but one lady I met retired to San Miguel de Allende in Mexico. She was a retired employee of the Chicago Tribune (obviously from Chicago) and was living on a tiny pension plus her SS check (together they still amounted to a very modest income.) One important reason she moved was the climate. The most important reason she decided to move to Mexico was she felt she had a much better lifestyle over there. "If I decided to stay in Chicago I could probably afford only a small studio apartment and I would be constantly counting my pennies" she said. In Mexico she had a lovely two bedroom 'casita' and a maid who cleaned and did laundry three times a week. The thing that sold her on San Miguel de Allende was the huge Gringo community - they had there own community center, social clubs, lending library, and support system. The whole town accommodates the significant number of Gringos and the majority of Mexicans in that town speak English. She loved meeting her new friends - other retirees - at a local restaurant and lounge and enjoying cocktails at sunset.

The bottom line for some ex-pats is instead of barely making ends meet and living a very modest lower-middle class lifestyle, they choose to live abroad where they are relatively affluent and privileged upper middle-class lifestyle.
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Old 11-02-2016, 05:21 AM
 
12,853 posts, read 14,158,692 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by augiedogie View Post
I figured someplace in Africa might be very cheap, but I was surprised to recently find that prices for land in Niarobi Kenya are actually pretty steep. Plus you need a bunch of immunizations to go there and still get things like Malaria. Not good for old people who don't have any immunity to stuff they deal with all the time.
And Luanda, Angola, for example, is through the roof on cost of living, I have read.
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Old 11-02-2016, 10:40 AM
 
332 posts, read 319,419 times
Reputation: 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfingduo View Post
I know this has been asked and reasked and asked once again. Everyone has a great time talking about their state or the country that they live in. A lot of others dream of a place that they can live in that will allow them more freedom with regards to how much money they have as discretionary spending. I saw this article and had to put it out there for everyone to go through. Please feel free to jump in.


World's cheapest 50 countries to live in - 2016

A list of 50 places where I would never want to live even if you paid me. The only decent one is Fiji but that would get boring really fast.
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Old 11-02-2016, 12:12 PM
 
Location: Miraflores
788 posts, read 898,882 times
Reputation: 1546
The picture they have used for Peru was taken in front of my condo!
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Old 11-02-2016, 10:10 PM
 
Location: Central Massachusetts
4,800 posts, read 4,870,838 times
Reputation: 6380
Quote:
Originally Posted by alpineprince View Post
The picture they have used for Peru was taken in front of my condo!

LOL awesome. That is great.


kevxu the list is just that a list. Absolutely places on that list I would not touch with a 100 foot pole. There are places that would be awesome to visit and even live for a time. Some of us here enjoy other places and others just don't want to move out to see new things.

There is good reasons to find places that are more affordable. I can tell you that my dad and his wife living in Maine on a combined income of less than 1.8k per month is awfully tough to see. They would not leave where they are for the world. But I on the other hand see the list here as a potential short term stay list. Chile sounds fun. Ecuador is on my list. DaNang and Hanoi are also there. Will I remain an expat all the remaining years of my life. I am sure not. Will I be gone from here for a while? You betcha.

I did post this list because it has changed over the years. You are absolutely right that focusing solely on cheap living is a bad idea. There has to be other attractions to make the move better. Still being able to live on less is an attractive draw. A point I would make for anyone thinking about doing an expat thing is to not sever ties here and leave yourself an out if something doesn't work out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kevxu View Post
As usual the focus is solely on living cheaper. And to my mind and for my US dollars, I think - as I have said dozens of times before on C-D - really should not be your overriding consideration for moving ANYWHERE.

Why? Because what this probably means is that you have never thought about the fact that even in the loveliest of cheaper countries you will not be living in the U.S., and you should be willing and happy to make a number of adjustments to make your life more interesting and more pleasant there. Unless, of course, you want to sit in some foreign enclave in that country and b itch about how awful "they" are outside your gilded ghetto walls.

If it is just a consideration of money, stay in the U.S. because you are going to be totally miserable with this that and the other thing that you must have, but don't need every single moment of the day. Trust me, I've gone the route of emigrating from the U.S. and I have seen others who have done it: DO NOT EVEN THINK OF DOING IT JUST FOR THE MONEY YOU THINK YOU WILL SAVE.

According to the chart https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-livin...jsp?title=2016 I live in a place more than thirty slots down from the U.S. on the chart. I have far more physical things than I had in the U.S., and far more that I could find at my income level in an area where I would have wanted to live when I left the U.S....including the very important healthcare....and on to the nicer if more frivolous side, meaning most of the time with a residence with a near view of the sea. I have loved it. But I do not live in a Golden Ghetto of English-speakers, though I could afford it...and, in fact, avoid the people that live there. I learned an adequate amount of the language to be able to deal with the basics of life and to travel around with no problems, I learned the history of the country so as to not be a perpetual total outsider, I live in a neighborhood of local people and feel fine about it. And do not feel the slightest bit distressed by the lack of products that I ate or used when I lived in the U.S., etc., etc.

But I very, very firmly feel that if when you close your eyes and imagine yourself in cheaper country X, you see yourself in every other way as if you were still in the U.S. STOP! Even in an expat golden ghetto it isn't really going to be that way. You've got be willing to go ass over tea kettle getting all the legal rigamarole done after you arrive (local driving license, local bank account, local direct debit card, local tax number, local residency card) and still come up feeling great about the PIA of it all, and next imagine your dream house and all its cupboards totally empty of every single thing you have and are familiar with, and then imagine the craziness of getting settled and stocking up and enjoying the newness and craziness of it....much of it in a language you may not yet understand very well or at all. It is a circus, both annoying and funny, and enjoyable if you are not all the time thinking Walmart, etc.
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Old 11-02-2016, 10:11 PM
 
Location: Central Massachusetts
4,800 posts, read 4,870,838 times
Reputation: 6380
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluehorseshoe View Post
A list of 50 places where I would never want to live even if you paid me. The only decent one is Fiji but that would get boring really fast.
I thought there a few other ones. I have never been to Fiji and will go sometime if I can but you are absolutely right there are so places on that list that are no-go zones for sure.
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