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Old 11-19-2016, 10:29 PM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
31,110 posts, read 13,629,683 times
Reputation: 22160

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
State legislatures have passed laws driving the cost of "health insurance" higher. These laws are known as mandated health insurance benefit laws, they force insurers and employers to cover specific providers or procedures not usually included in basic healthcare plans.
Of course care for mental illness should be covered, what the heck are you even thinking? And if you don't think treatment for autism should be covered, then how do you propose that people pay for it? You don't want to cover mental health problems, what about a 16 year old anorexic, or a new mother suffering from post-partum depression, do we just tell them to suck it up?

The real issue is that the ACA is a mess because we are paying insurance companies to administer the system and make a huge profit on it, and we are allowing doctors and hospitals to pretty much charge what they want, that is why ACA plans in rural parts of the nation have skyrocketed, if you have one hospital and four doctors there is no way that an insurance company can negotiate with them, they just charge what they want and the insurance adds their costs and profits to the costs and pass it on to you.

We need a system like medicare where the government controls fees that doctors and hospitals can charge. We do not need to go back to health policies that have a $50,000 annual maximum or a $200,000 lifetime cap and that is what many of them had before the ACA. And if we decide to put people with pre-existing conditions into 'pools' the cost for them will be prohibitive just as it was before the ACA. We need medicare for all, price controls and reasonable premiums. Offer everyone the basics and let people who can afford it add on extras like chiropractic or concierge physician groups. We don't need to give more to insurance companies which is exactly what Ryan's plan has in mind. We also need to allow insurers and medicare negotiate drug prices just like the VA does.

And there is no comparison between health insurance and car insurance, they are apples and oranges. Car insurance pays for accidental damage, if health insurance only covered accidents there would be people dying from lack of care for chronic conditions like asthma, high blood pressure and diabetes.

 
Old 11-19-2016, 11:18 PM
 
Location: VT; previously MD & NJ
2,211 posts, read 1,352,704 times
Reputation: 6354
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
State legislatures have passed laws driving the cost of "health insurance" higher. These laws are known as mandated health insurance benefit laws, they force insurers and employers to cover specific providers or procedures not usually included in basic healthcare plans.
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Which costs more: general liability auto insurance or full-coverage auto insurance?

If auto insurance would be regulated like health insurance, then you wouldn't have a choice of general liability. Instead, you'd be forced to buy full-coverage, whether you wanted it or not. Worse than that, you'd be forced to buy auto insurance with numerous riders, like flood insurance, rental coverage, towing assistance, depreciation waivers, accident forgiveness, etc etc etc, to the point that you were priced out.

On the other hand, if health insurance were deregulated and functioned like auto insurance, you could buy only what you needed, and it would be more affordable.

For example, mental health care drives up the price of premiums an extra 10%-13%. Adding benefits for substance abuse drives up the price another 6%.


Adding dental and vision drives up the price of health insurance premiums, too. Every time a State (or the federal government) mandates that something be included, like doctor's office visits or pharmaceuticals, the price of insurance premiums increases.
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44 States now mandate that autism be covered. That costs money and the costs are passed onto consumers.
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It's in your best interest to deregulate the insurance companies by eliminating mandated benefits.
You can't structure health insurance so that you buy only the coverage you need. Because you can't predict what illness or ailment you may need coverage for. You don't know if you will need heart disease coverage, or mental health coverage or substance abuse coverage or autism coverage or broken leg coverage.

This is nothing like auto insurance.

And if you deregulate health insurers, then we would go back to limits on coverage (when you get really sick your insurance runs out), or they decide not to cover pre-existing conditions, or they decide not to cover some procedure or drug that may work and be your last chance at life but is expensive. No, I don't think we want to go back.
 
Old 11-20-2016, 06:32 AM
 
Location: Arizona
5,963 posts, read 5,315,071 times
Reputation: 18021
Quote:
Originally Posted by ansible90 View Post
You can't structure health insurance so that you buy only the coverage you need. Because you can't predict what illness or ailment you may need coverage for. You don't know if you will need heart disease coverage, or mental health coverage or substance abuse coverage or autism coverage or broken leg coverage.

This is nothing like auto insurance.

And if you deregulate health insurers, then we would go back to limits on coverage (when you get really sick your insurance runs out), or they decide not to cover pre-existing conditions, or they decide not to cover some procedure or drug that may work and be your last chance at life but is expensive. No, I don't think we want to go back.
Most people only need catastrophic. Anything major will be covered. When people use the auto insurance argument they usually mean that insurance only covers the big stuff not maintenance or if something small they just pay it so their premiums don't rise.

Since this is a retirement forum I don't think many of us need autism coverage.
 
Old 11-20-2016, 07:10 AM
 
2,446 posts, read 2,076,017 times
Reputation: 5706
Quote:
Originally Posted by thinkalot View Post
Most people only need catastrophic. Anything major will be covered. When people use the auto insurance argument they usually mean that insurance only covers the big stuff not maintenance or if something small they just pay it so their premiums don't rise.

Since this is a retirement forum I don't think many of us need autism coverage
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I get autoism coverage with Geico.
 
Old 11-20-2016, 09:56 AM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
31,110 posts, read 13,629,683 times
Reputation: 22160
Quote:
Originally Posted by thinkalot View Post
Most people only need catastrophic. Anything major will be covered. When people use the auto insurance argument they usually mean that insurance only covers the big stuff not maintenance or if something small they just pay it so their premiums don't rise. Since this is a retirement forum I don't think many of us need autism coverage.
Ok, fair enough but how much do you think your rates would drop if they excluded people of a certain age from treatment of autism? But regarding your claim that all most people need only catastrophic coverage, how would that work when The average price of a new uninsured patient appointment was quoted as $160, the cost of an ambulance ride is $400-$1200 and the average cost of an MRI is $2611 Median family income in 2016 is $56,516 For a family of four earning the median income several routine doctor visits in a month can represent a catastrophe to their finances.

We need to go to a single payer plan with regulated fees and competition for pharmaceuticals. What we have now is a give away to insurance companies and for profit hospitals. What Ryan offers is a plan that gives even more power to the privateers who got us in this mess.
 
Old 11-20-2016, 10:03 AM
 
Location: VT; previously MD & NJ
2,211 posts, read 1,352,704 times
Reputation: 6354
Quote:
Originally Posted by thinkalot View Post
Most people only need catastrophic. Anything major will be covered. When people use the auto insurance argument they usually mean that insurance only covers the big stuff not maintenance or if something small they just pay it so their premiums don't rise.

Since this is a retirement forum I don't think many of us need autism coverage.
People do not outgrow autism.

You can't pick and choose what conditions you need to cover because you can't predict what will happen.

If you are talking about catastrophic coverage vs more comprehensive coverage, we already have options for that... it's called a High Deductible Plan vs Low Deductible Plan.
 
Old 11-20-2016, 10:41 AM
 
Location: SW MO
23,605 posts, read 31,506,246 times
Reputation: 29081
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollytree View Post
Trump's proposed 13.5% across-the-board cut in federal spending would result in a cut to Social Security that would reduce the average monthly benefit by $182, from $1,360 in 2017 to $1,177.

If you are a retiree who voted for him- did you not know what his policies were?
...and the sky is falling. The sky is falling!
 
Old 11-20-2016, 12:34 PM
 
Location: NC Piedmont
3,911 posts, read 2,882,516 times
Reputation: 6291
Quote:
Originally Posted by thinkalot View Post
Most people only need catastrophic. Anything major will be covered. When people use the auto insurance argument they usually mean that insurance only covers the big stuff not maintenance or if something small they just pay it so their premiums don't rise.

Since this is a retirement forum I don't think many of us need autism coverage.
People with lower incomes get stuck in a bind where they can't afford wellness care or treatment for things that are not catastrophic yet but may lead to things that are. Insurance is shared risk; looking out for each other in a structured way.
 
Old 11-20-2016, 01:59 PM
 
Location: Paranoid State
13,047 posts, read 10,454,884 times
Reputation: 15684
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
The real issue is that the ACA is a mess because we are paying insurance companies to administer the system and make a huge profit on it
Under Obamacare, profits on health insurance companies are regulated and capped.
 
Old 11-20-2016, 02:11 PM
 
Location: Paranoid State
13,047 posts, read 10,454,884 times
Reputation: 15684
Here's another unintended consequence of Obamacare.

I live most of the year in one state, but spend the winter in another. Under Obamacare, I must purchase insurance in my state-of-residence for tax purposes.

New for 2017, no insurer who sells insurance in my home state sells a multi-state policy. The implication: During the winter months when I am in a different state, my insurance doesn't cover me. Well, it covers emergency room visits at a particular rate, but nothing else. That's right: nothing else. If I get sick, my choices are: (a) do nothing, (b) travel 400+ miles to my home state to see a doctor in-network, (c) go to the ER, or (d) see a doctor where I am uninsured and must pay the full non-negotiated price.

I didn't believe this could be true -- but I've checked & double checked & triple checked.

It doesn't matter how much money I'm willing to pay for an insurance policy -- no multi-state or nationwide policies are available in my home state.

I've even looked into buying 2 separate insurance policies: one in my home state, and another in my winter-months state - but that violates the law/regulation that insurance *must* be purchased only in your home state.
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