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ACA was never about affordable healthcare, it was about access to healthcare. Total spending on healthcare in 2015 in the US was $3 trillion. That comes out to $10k per person, just about what insurance costs. There is no magic way for insurance to make healthcare cost less until that $3 trillion total is reduced.
There is essentially no difference between ACA and non-ACA insurance except with ACA you can get subsidies from the government. They cost the same with about the same benefits. The reason both cost more is because previously people who had pre-existing conditions or poor health were excluded and now they are not.
Really what ACA did was shift the burden of paying that $3 trillion bill from taxes to premiums. We are going to pay it one way or another. Choose your poison.
key word , being -affordable . it is only affordable to those getting tax payer money .. the plans are not any more affordable when you are paying the whole thing on your own .
All insurance is about risk management and most of us who pay health insurance, as exorbitant as it is, do so because we're not willing to assume the risk.
Our health insurance monthly premiums climb to $1,464 in January. Add max contributions to our HSA accounts of $8,700 for the year. That's $26,268 for 2017 and doesn't count some very high annual deductibles that I believe are around $5,000 for each of us.
We did the Christian health-sharing ministry thing a couple years ago for a while. That's one of the "loopholes" around having health insurance for those who are willing to assume risk. I believe our monthly contributions were about $200 each and we had a $10,000 annual deductible before our medical expenses could be eligible for sharing.
Due to a pre-existing condition of my wife and unsure of how far the health-sharing ministry would extend this pre-existing condition to other health issues that might arise, we chose not to assume this unknown risk and returned to the high-cost health insurance we now have.
I shared with a client, who is about my age, about this health-sharing ministry and he and his wife joined. The same year his wife had major surgery costing about $150,000. I recently asked him how was his experience getting those costs shared by the ministry and he said he was pleased but there were some nail-biting moments and time before most of what he incurred got reimbursed. Have another client who is joining another Christian health-sharing ministry in 2017. Similar age and tired of the big number health insurance costs.
It's a "cost of doing business" at this point in our lives and we pay the monthly premiums for the most part without excessively complaining about it. But it does make good "show and tell" conversation.
Despite all this, my numbers tell me that we can retire now but I'm still hanging on in the "rat race" dealing with the real emotional barriers that keep many of us from pulling the plug while we talk about our retirement days to come.
Just calculate what it would cost for you to live at a level you'd find acceptable today, in a place you'd want to live, and DOUBLE that amount. The X2 rule is important if you want to retire in your 50's. More important today than 20 years ago. Assume nothing; and remember, only "play money" stays in the market, or left anywhere where you do not/will not have 100% control of it.
Dear lord! Monthly premiums of $1464 on a non ACA high deductible HSA plan??? WHAT is wrong with your plan?! My company is self insured and both of us are covered on a $2700 "high deductible " HSA plan and our premium is $135/mo PLUS the company contributes $1000 to the HSA in addition to the $6500 I contribute. If I retire before 65 we have to take the company plan of $380/mo and no HSA, but the deductible is lower.
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perryinva
Dear lord! Monthly premiums of $1464 on a non ACA high deductible HSA plan??? WHAT is wrong with your plan?! ....
our A(?)CA WAS $1700/month (high deductible / Out-of-pocket)
If we chose to be A(?)CA next yr, it would have been over $2100/ month (PLUS $10k + in potential OOP)
so...
Healthcare sharing network for us (and medivacations to Thailand).
A Healthcare sharing network covered my niece for 4 months Brain and spine surgery / ICU, but nothing is guaranteed.
One of us is very likely to 'check-out' soon, we are WELL beyond our family history and living on 'borrowed-time'.
If you are pre-age 65, international living is a good (and maybe the ONLY) option for HC. (resident policies available in several countries)
Travel insurance is CHEAP, (<$100 / month) but is really only for 'accident' / illness... not gonna cover cancer, transplants, cardio...and you can NEVER come home! or the policy will terminate!
No 'medical' from my previous 'benevolent' company, 35+ yrs service / no pension, no HC. The short term CEO "witch" took it to Monte Carlo and doubled down, guess she lost. (as she did her US Presidential primary quest, and CA gov quest... She will be GREAT in politics!)
Last edited by StealthRabbit; 11-18-2016 at 12:06 PM..
key word , being -affordable . it is only affordable to those getting tax payer money .. the plans are not any more affordable when you are paying the whole thing on your own .
Right. Making it affordable for those who had previously not been able to afford it. "Affordable" is relative to income.
most of those who couldn't afford it just went and got treated anyway and just never paid the bills .
in fact the biggest issue is those who are young and healthy are not even taking insurance . they are paying the fine and taking either catastrophic unqualified plans or rolling the dice with no insurance .
i am 64 and to date i have never spent even a fraction of what i paid in in any given year ever . except for a visit to the emergency room for a shattered collarbone in a mountain biking accident i never set foot in a hospital ,
that is leaving mostly those unhealthy or older taking the aca plans and it is killing the insurers since the healthy are supposed to be paying for the sickly but the healthy are not buying in .
why bother , the fine is a great deal compared to the premiums ,deductibles and out of pockets
Last edited by mathjak107; 11-18-2016 at 02:03 PM..
Originally Posted by Vision67 And that's the whole point.
You can retire at 57 and think that your health is fine. Why worry?
And then at 62, all hell breaks lose. If you don't have good insurance, you're screwed.
Wait until 65 to retire.
Quote:
Originally Posted by N.Cal
And you can walk out of the house tomorrow and get hit by a bus.
True. But if you are 65 getting hit by that bus (assuming you survive) is a lot less expensive than for a 63 year old.
Even an insured 63 year old would pay and pay and pay.
The medical events are cheaper once you are 65, and especially if you keep yourself well insured.
Of course, depending on your insurance. You're assuming ACA or something similar. Just like pensions, there are still companies that offer excellent medical benefits to retirees untill 65.
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