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Old 03-30-2008, 04:10 PM
 
26,591 posts, read 52,303,280 times
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In this morning's SF Chronicle there is a multi page story about the deficits Bay Area Cities are running due, in part, to the high cost of Payroll and Benefits...

It appears the Highest Paid Bay Area Public Employee is a San Francisco Registered Nurse at just over 350K last year...

I guess I should have listened better to my Father who had always encouraged his children to work in government.

There were other highly paid individuals listed by name and department... I think SF had over 1000 employees at 100K or more and other cities were not far behind... most notably Oakland...

It is common knowledge the Public Safety Employees in the Bay Area have some of the most lucrative retirement benefits... I should have listened to Dad

Last edited by Ultrarunner; 03-30-2008 at 04:20 PM..
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Old 03-31-2008, 01:46 AM
 
13,320 posts, read 25,565,364 times
Reputation: 20505
All my assets are allocated to various charities, including the major one, who will come and pick up any dogs I might have and either find them homes or keep them for life in a very pleasant setting, the Best Friends Animal Society sancturary. That said,
I don't think people should bend themselves inside out in order to leave substantial assets to children or grandchildren. If it works out that way, fine, but if it means working longer than you might want to, or depriving yourself of some retirement dreams, then, no. You don't owe your kids that.
I've seen a number of people get inheritances from ordinary working-class parents- not enough money to stop working, but enough for a down payment, or something. I've seen a lot of people (most unattractively) sort of living on hold into their 40s because they are counting on getting X from someone's death. I've seen the same people blow that money on whatever. I do think maybe a trust of some kind, where the money is dedicated to college or down payment or some other worthy cause is good, but just handing people money, especially when they're expecting it, doesn't go well, from what I've seen.
I never had the option of getting anything from anyone, so maybe I don't understand it. If they pay for ya until age 18, I think that's quite enough.
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Old 03-31-2008, 01:51 AM
 
13,320 posts, read 25,565,364 times
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P.S. Regarding RN salaries, even for the Bay Area, $100K for a new grad sounds awfully high.
I do remember, around Boston, the salary wars started around 1987- just when I was planning to become a tech writer. I sure know how to jump off a moving train!
I now make a pretty good living, but have some 27 years of experience (yow) and work third shift. Given that, I'm not making that much. The key here is to work on the psych unit of a downtown general hospital (preferably union... 'gasp' I said "union") and be on the pay scale of the med/surg/ICU people.
As you go outside the major metro areas, the pay tends to drop off fast. Also, at least around here, there were a lot of hospital and service closings in the 1990s, and people were actually laid off, as services cut and cut to run with a skeleton staff. I returned to my current job (having come and gone four times) because I figured that it was old and fat and not likely to close (although it came close, and is now half its size) and I finally noticed the old-fashioned pension plan in addition to the 403b. Despite its lower salaries, it is by far the safest psych place I've worked, so I'm here for the duration. And, I notice, have time to post on company time.
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Old 03-31-2008, 08:11 AM
 
1,861 posts, read 3,024,773 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYLifes2shrt View Post
This does sound like excuses and whining. Unfortunatly life situations can happen to anyone, but for most of us we will be fine. Get a second job if you have too. Change your career. There is a solution.

$400, depends on your age now, other investments (401k) and when you want to retire. I know that I have to pay off my home and I can't incur any debt. I pay cash for my cars used. I have no credit card debt. This was not the case in my earlier years when I was stupid. I learned from my own lessons.

Good luck, I know this is hard.
You're hung up on "excuses and whining", instead of discussing the problems that people have. How can you possibly say that "most of us" will be OK, with the economy the way it is now? That's just putting your head in the sand. Where have you been? Do you ever read the newspaper or watch the news? If you live on wages alone (which most of us do), our real wages have plummeted over the last 35 years, and most costs have gone up. If you used to spend 25% of your income on housing, now you might be paying 60% of your income. Get it? I'm trying to explain it in a simple way for you.

I'm glad you're well off - more power to you - but quit judging others.
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Old 03-31-2008, 08:19 AM
 
1,861 posts, read 3,024,773 times
Reputation: 559
Quote:
Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
I have no intentions of retiring. If I'm not working, there's no reason for me to continue living.
I like that! I feel that I'll always work, at least part-time, partly out of necessity, and partly because I wouldn't know what to do with myself. I'm just hoping my health doesn't go south!
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Old 03-31-2008, 08:54 AM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
30,684 posts, read 49,455,573 times
Reputation: 19134
cousinsal -

I do understand that our nation's economics are currently changing, and that most people do not feel secure in these times.

It is not my intention of judging anyone else, nor to put anyone down.

I simply do not know if "most of us" will be OK.



Quote:
... our real wages have plummeted over the last 35 years, and most costs have gone up.
It is not among my understanding that anyone's wages have gone down; per hour wages have steadily increased.

It is my understanding that for anyone who has refused to build income streams, their 'purchasing power' has decreased.
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Old 03-31-2008, 09:15 AM
 
1,861 posts, read 3,024,773 times
Reputation: 559
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
cousinsal -

I do understand that our nation's economics are currently changing, and that most people do not feel secure in these times.

It is not my intention of judging anyone else, nor to put anyone down.

I simply do not know if "most of us" will be OK.





It is not among my understanding that anyone's wages have gone down; per hour wages have steadily increased.

It is my understanding that for anyone who has refused to build income streams, their 'purchasing power' has decreased.
What's an "income stream"? You mean something beyond wages? Most people are struggling just to make a good wage. Remember - the median household income in the U.S. is about $45,000.

Yes, per hour wages have increased, of course, but not in relation to the costs of housing, utilities, health care, food, etc. In other words, you are paying a higher PERCENTAGE of your income on everything, as opposed to what you were paying in 1970. Therefore, your buying power has decreased so that you have no "extra" income. Like I said before, 25% for rent in 1970, 60% today, as an example. Boy - if my rent or mortgage cost 25% of my income today, I'd be flyin' high! And, I remember it clearly - after college, my rent was 25% of my income and I was making minimum wage - and it was a NICE place with one roommate. The kids today can't do that. They tend to stay at home longer, when we couldn't wait to get out on our own.

I don't know who you hang around with, but most people I know are experiencing the same thing - less money, higher bills, less to save for retirement. It's pretty clear for most people I know, but maybe you associate with a higher-wage crowd, or with people who DO have enough money beyond their bills to save.
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Old 03-31-2008, 09:18 AM
 
Location: DC Area, for now
3,517 posts, read 12,052,621 times
Reputation: 2141
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
Quote:
... our real wages have plummeted over the last 35 years, and most costs have gone up.
It is not among my understanding that anyone's wages have gone down; per hour wages have steadily increased.

It is my understanding that for anyone who has refused to build income streams, their 'purchasing power' has decreased.
The "real wages" is deducting the inflation amount from the actual dollar amount to compare relative purchasing power from one time to another. With the spiraling fuel costs, it would appear that we are embarking on another big inflationary cycle. With the artificial suppression of the calculated CPI, it doesn't reflect the actual inflation rate. Who isn't impacted by rising health care costs, food and fuel prices?

Not sure what you mean by refusing to build income streams.
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Old 03-31-2008, 10:01 AM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
30,684 posts, read 49,455,573 times
Reputation: 19134
Quote:
Originally Posted by cousin sal View Post
What's an "income stream"? You mean something beyond wages? Most people are struggling just to make a good wage. Remember - the median household income in the U.S. is about $45,000.
Yes.

We too support a family. We have raised children, today we still have our youngest child living at home finishing highschool.

We realized years ago that our wage increases were not keeping up with inflation.

We knew that one day we would want to retire.

We knew that we would need multiple sources of income streams.

So we began our strategy.

My Dw studied household economics, attended college and got her accounting degree.

We both volunteered to become budgeting counselors and we learned a lot about household budgeting.

We both took IRS courses on tax filing and tax planning. We learned to itemize our taxes, and we lowered our tax obligation to zero. Saving that portion of our income, which had previously gone to taxes; to now remain in our pockets, to allow greater investing.

My career took us to many places, we have bounced around the nation and overseas a great deal. My Dw has never worked as an accountant, rather she has seen a far greater role for herself as mother and household financial administrator.

We have raised five children, at my peak income me salary was $65k. On that set of economics we bought and collected apartment buildings, as our primary investment vehicle.



In our nation today; while "Most people are struggling just to make a good wage", there are also thousands of households who are Net Worth accumulators. These households are working blue collars jobs, or working as self-employed small businesses. They are supporting children, and they are gaining Net Worth each year. Each year in America thousands of middle-class households build Net Worths of greater than $1million, many of these same households have annual salaries in the $40k - $65k range.



I am not saying this to judge you.

It is not my intent to say that anyone is 'better' or worse than anyone else.

It is my intent however to say that these things are possible. In this economy, with these wages.

I do understand that rain falls. It falls on saint and on sinner alike. Everyone gets wet from time to time.

Only an individual can say how that individual will handle himself. If you lose your investments, will you go again? Or will you stop?

Will you focus on how miserable life is, and on how it is impossible to gain wealth? Or will you go out and strive to gain wealth?



Quote:
... Yes, per hour wages have increased, of course, but not in relation to the costs of housing, utilities, health care, food, etc. In other words, you are paying a higher PERCENTAGE of your income on everything, as opposed to what you were paying in 1970. Therefore, your buying power has decreased so that you have no "extra" income. Like I said before, 25% for rent in 1970, 60% today, as an example. Boy - if my rent or mortgage cost 25% of my income today, I'd be flyin' high! And, I remember it clearly - after college, my rent was 25% of my income and I was making minimum wage - and it was a NICE place with one roommate. The kids today can't do that. They tend to stay at home longer, when we couldn't wait to get out on our own.

I don't know who you hang around with, but most people I know are experiencing the same thing - less money, higher bills, less to save for retirement. It's pretty clear for most people I know, but maybe you associate with a higher-wage crowd, or with people who DO have enough money beyond their bills to save.
Sigh

I do not "associate with a higher-wage crowd".

I associate with a higher-attitude crowd.

I have earned $45k/year, and when I was earning that level of income, I was supporting a family, and I bought our first apartment building.

I admit that during the later third of my career, my wage did go up, I peaked at around $65k for a few years right before my retirement.

So if that is your higher-wage crowd, than so be it.

Today in our retirement, most of our associates have no pensions, are still working, and these household incomes hover around half of the national median household income.
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Old 03-31-2008, 10:05 AM
 
1,861 posts, read 3,024,773 times
Reputation: 559
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
Yes.

We too support a family. We have raised children, today we still have our youngest child living at home finishing highschool.

We realized years ago that our wage increases were not keeping up with inflation.

We knew that one day we would want to retire.

We knew that we would need multiple sources of income streams.

So we began our strategy.

My Dw studied household economics, attended college and got her accounting degree.

We both volunteered to become budgeting counselors and we learned a lot about household budgeting.

We both took IRS courses on tax filing and tax planning. We learned to itemize our taxes, and we lowered our tax obligation to zero. Saving that portion of our income, which had previously gone to taxes; to now remain in our pockets, to allow greater investing.

My career took us to many places, we have bounced around the nation and overseas a great deal. My Dw has never worked as an accountant, rather she has seen a far greater role for herself as mother and household financial administrator.

We have raised five children, at my peak income me salary was $65k. On that set of economics we bought and collected apartment buildings, as our primary investment vehicle.



In our nation today; while "Most people are struggling just to make a good wage", there are also thousands of households who are Net Worth accumulators. These households are working blue collars jobs, or working as self-employed small businesses. They are supporting children, and they are gaining Net Worth each year. Each year in America thousands of middle-class households build Net Worths of greater than $1million, many of these same households have annual salaries in the $40k - $65k range.



I am not saying this to judge you.

It is not my intent to say that anyone is 'better' or worse than anyone else.

It is my intent however to say that these things are possible. In this economy, with these wages.

I do understand that rain falls. It falls on saint and on sinner alike. Everyone gets wet from time to time.

Only an individual can say how that individual will handle himself. If you lose your investments, will you go again? Or will you stop?

Will you focus on how miserable life is, and on how it is impossible to gain wealth? Or will you go out and strive to gain wealth?





Sigh

I do not "associate with a higher-wage crowd".

I associate with a higher-attitude crowd.

I have earned $45k/year, and when I was earning that level of income, I was supporting a family, and I bought our first apartment building.

I admit that during the later third of my career, my wage did go up, I peaked at around $65k for a few years right before my retirement.

So if that is your higher-wage crowd, than so be it.

Today in our retirement, most of our associates have no pensions, are still working, and these household incomes hover around half of the national median household income.
So, you ARE saying that most of your associates are in a pickle, too. So, what's all this "anyone can do it" thing??
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