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Old 01-17-2017, 08:56 AM
 
Location: Lakewood OH
21,699 posts, read 23,651,778 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohio_peasant View Post
An important point (sorry to quote out of context).

Much of philosophy, secular or religious, posits that crucial for happiness is dispensing with the keeping of a score. The "score" could be accumulation of money, peer-reviewed publications by an academic, promotions in the corporate world, reaching a certain 5K run-time or bench-pressing max, grade-point-average in high-school or college, and so forth. For the conventionally more successful people, most of life consists of chasing competitive success, of running up the score. In retirement, this precipitously ends. Now the "score" consists of remaining-years of good health, or other such matters that transcend frenetic competition. How to adjust to this lack-of-score, for persons who had built their lives around the scoreboard?

Certainly, there are people of considerable poise and equanimity, for whom competitive success was never crucial, or at most secondary to unquantified pursuit of personal excellence, without comparison to achievements of others. These perhaps are the wise ones. But what of those who weren't so wise? Must they now become wise in retirement?
Very interesting post; my favorite on this thread. I couldn't have put it so eloquently.

As far as those who aren't wise, if it makes them happy to continue keeping score, more power to them. Whatever makes them happy. For me, retirement is a place where I am no longer compelled to compete or keep score; not with myself, not with anyone. Where it gets annoying for me is when the score keepers turn it into a competition and try to drag in those who do not wish to participate.
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Old 01-21-2017, 01:37 PM
 
7,895 posts, read 5,028,121 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrkliny View Post
For me competition is about the challenge, not beating up someone else or running up the score. It is a way of showing us what is possible and giving us the motivation to advance. I gave none of that up when I retired. In fact, I looked at life as a series of new opportunities. After retirement, I have the time to accomplish the goals I set for myself.
The above can not be gainsaid. But my point was less about ferocious and unrelenting competition, than about the accolades being more important than the underlying achievement. An example would be the earning of good grades in high school and college. For me personally, getting straight-A's was more important than mastering the material. I wanted the plaudits and the high score. I'd rather cram for exams, acing them through intense short-term preparation, and promptly forgetting what I "learned", than to engage in rigorous but measuredly-paced studying throughout the semester. This was less about proving superiority to my fellow students, than about being praised by the teacher or professor. Later, in my career, it was more important to have a high number of peer-reviewed scholarly publications, than to do good research, let alone to derive the sort of insightful understanding of nature, that is supposed to be foundational to an impressive scholarly record.

In other words, yes, one can be driven by a predatory drive to bury the competition, to come out superior. Or, one could be driven by yearning to look good, to get the gold-star on the homework assignment, the fat 401K plan or whatnot. In this latter scheme, the point isn't really to excel in life, or to derive enjoyment, but to be praised, to look good... in front of oneself. Then all of this comes to precipitous halt. There are no more technical conferences to attend, where one receives lifetime achievement awards, and that sort of thing. There is plenty of time to read books and to engage in self-enlightenment, without pressure of deadlines or annual workplace performance reviews. But guess what? One realizes that the joy of work was all about getting those stellar annual reviews, and less about actually doing good research. The problem is then twofold: (1) figuring out how to derive satisfaction in retirement, and (2) coming to terms with the raw realization that one's entire working-life was something of a fraud.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Minervah View Post
As far as those who aren't wise, if it makes them happy to continue keeping score, more power to them.
Those who can continue to be happy, even if by specious and ridiculous means, have no reason for reform. The problem is for those who aren't wise, who are disabused of their illusions late in life, and have to educate themselves at 50 or 60 or 70, in things that they should have learned at 17 or 20 or 25.

Last edited by ohio_peasant; 01-21-2017 at 01:47 PM..
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Old 01-21-2017, 03:18 PM
 
Location: Columbia SC
8,948 posts, read 7,725,979 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captnemo View Post
Turning 66 in may 2017 but layed off at 65 Sept 2016 from my job. I am looking for part time job 2 days a week to keep a little busy but no luck so far. Problem is I am bored and have too much time off on hand right now, but I will never go back to work full time again. Life is too short to work full time to 70(my opinion)

So how do you keep busy when retired or semi retired. What activies do you do. Please any suggestions especially since my spouse is still working. When did you retire age wise Thanks
Take up a time consuming hobby like fishing, golf, tennis, pickleball, etc. Also tend to household chores (cleaning, cooking, laundry) so the working spouse does not have to. You keeping making the money honey, I will do the work.
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Old 01-21-2017, 08:04 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles area
14,018 posts, read 17,726,438 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohio_peasant View Post
The above can not be gainsaid. But my point was less about ferocious and unrelenting competition, than about the accolades being more important than the underlying achievement. An example would be the earning of good grades in high school and college. For me personally, getting straight-A's was more important than mastering the material. I wanted the plaudits and the high score. I'd rather cram for exams, acing them through intense short-term preparation, and promptly forgetting what I "learned", than to engage in rigorous but measuredly-paced studying throughout the semester. This was less about proving superiority to my fellow students, than about being praised by the teacher or professor. Later, in my career, it was more important to have a high number of peer-reviewed scholarly publications, than to do good research, let alone to derive the sort of insightful understanding of nature, that is supposed to be foundational to an impressive scholarly record.

In other words, yes, one can be driven by a predatory drive to bury the competition, to come out superior. Or, one could be driven by yearning to look good, to get the gold-star on the homework assignment, the fat 401K plan or whatnot. In this latter scheme, the point isn't really to excel in life, or to derive enjoyment, but to be praised, to look good... in front of oneself. Then all of this comes to precipitous halt. There are no more technical conferences to attend, where one receives lifetime achievement awards, and that sort of thing. There is plenty of time to read books and to engage in self-enlightenment, without pressure of deadlines or annual workplace performance reviews. But guess what? One realizes that the joy of work was all about getting those stellar annual reviews, and less about actually doing good research. The problem is then twofold: (1) figuring out how to derive satisfaction in retirement, and (2) coming to terms with the raw realization that one's entire working-life was something of a fraud.



Those who can continue to be happy, even if by specious and ridiculous means, have no reason for reform. The problem is for those who aren't wise, who are disabused of their illusions late in life, and have to educate themselves at 50 or 60 or 70, in things that they should have learned at 17 or 20 or 25.
A thoughtful and intelligent analysis. But isn't "fraud" an exaggeration in most cases? Was the research totally useless and totally meaningless? I think not, in most cases. It must have had some utility for the workplace, otherwise why the praise delivered for it? Are the bosses completely devoid of reasoning power?

Regardless of the nature of the praise delivered to us at work (either deserved and meaningful on the one hand or just a kind of game on the other hand, as you claim), it feels good to be recognized. Therefore your point about how to replace that recognition in retirement is certainly valid.
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Old 01-21-2017, 08:24 PM
 
295 posts, read 237,231 times
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I retired when I reached age 60 from the Air Force, sold our house in the 'burbs, and moved to our beach house in NC (which had been used as a rental while I was working).

After enjoying that for a while, I started walking the beach for exercise and eventually walked about 2/3 of the coastline of NC and about 2/3 of the Appalachian Trail (in segments).

After getting that out of my system, we traveled extensively on military hops to Europe (England, Wales, Germany, France and Italy) and elsewhere in the states, which we still do from time to time.

We sold the beach house eventually and moved to a less expensive home in central NC on a lake. At age 73 I am doing just about nothing other than mowing the lawn and baby sitting for our grand-kids. I can honestly say I have very seldom been bored.

walessp

walessp
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Old 01-24-2017, 07:35 PM
 
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I have less time than ever (but I am going to go back to work, as the management of teams to build innovative contributions to society is my passion). When doing nothing, I do:

 Race car construction
 Woodworking
 Metalworking
 Electronics – hardware development
 Astronomy (including astrophotography)
 Kites
 House-building (completion and major upgrades, and anything that looks fun)
 Electrical wiring, plumbing
 Sailboat building (small)
 Loudspeakers (design and build) (Khorns rule!)
 Audio/video (design and build)
 Stonework
 Gardening
 Computers/PC’s/computer languages. Computer networks
 Programming
World travel
Read, Read, Read (about how to do stuff, and how things work)
 Amateur Radio
 Target shooting/reloading
 Equestrian activities (saddle bred, quarter, thoroughbred, draft)
 Rocketry
 Welding
 Firework displays
 Dog rescue volunteer
 Photography

And then in my spare time (yeah, right), I do some more on the list
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Old 01-25-2017, 02:42 PM
 
7,895 posts, read 5,028,121 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Escort Rider View Post
ABut isn't "fraud" an exaggeration in most cases? Was the research totally useless and totally meaningless? I think not, in most cases. It must have had some utility for the workplace, otherwise why the praise delivered for it? Are the bosses completely devoid of reasoning power?
"Fraud" is indeed a bit melodramatic. What I mean broadly is the misalignment of effort and outcome, of remuneration and actual utility, of how much something is prized vs. its fundamental worth. The research, in my case, was useful in generating PhD thesis topics and various publications - some of which are read comparatively widely, by the standards of our field. But a cynic, and no necessarily a sardonically vile one, could aver, that the research done by the students and published in journals and cited by other researchers, and so forth, is piddling and intellectually light. It passes muster for professional peer review, but this is a self-serving, insular community, with vested interest in its own propitiation. Retirement, then, comes not as self-congratulatory period of rest, after a lifetime of genuine and concerted contribution. Rather, retirement is an admission of inadequacy in one's career, and a retreat to a quiet bucolic life, finally freed of pretenses and prevarications, done at a phase of life when many people still have kids in high-school, and one's hair is barely gray, let alone white.

In sum, how we entertain and motivate ourselves, depends only partially on our creativity and intellectual vigor and so forth. It also depends on how peaceful and fulfilled we feel about passing from working-life to the next stage. Is our passage well-considered and well-justified? In other words, is it really retirement, or more of a nervous breakdown?
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Old 01-26-2017, 10:48 AM
 
1,769 posts, read 2,440,841 times
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I'm so busy I don't have time to do everything. I own 2 acres and a large home, cottage and pool. I do all my own work except for tree service. I mean ALL my own work: exterior and interior painting, carpentry, etc. Not having a spouse or boyfriend is good since no one gets in my way or takes up my time. I love the freedom of being able to do what chore, fun thing, or nothing, when I want, how I want or if I don't want. I don't volunteer or hang around people much because they haven't much in common with my interests and inclinations. Thankfully, I'm not lonely or bored.
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