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Old 12-19-2016, 08:15 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,614 posts, read 17,598,460 times
Reputation: 27693

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pvande55 View Post
It seems like a good idea since, unlike a 401k it doesn't cost the employer anything. But some hate anything Obama and won't participate. Of course some employees say they can't afford it, or won't live that long. But you'd be surprised how many hillbillies buy the latest toys for the children and eat fast food every meal.
This "hillbilly" thinks that comment is extremely snide.

Median household income in my town is in the mid $30k range. That's not a lot of income - even for a single person with no kids, you will only be saving a small amount on that income. Throw in a kid or some debt, and it's going to be tough sledding.

With that being the median figure in the town, half are below that. How much is someone making $25k going to be able to save? What if that household is making $25k with a kid, or they make just over whatever the cut off for various assistance programs is, but cannot afford everything (day care, medical insurance, food, power, auto bills, etc.)? Retirement savings are going to be on the back burner for those folks who can barely (or not, if they're getting assistance) subsist in the here and now. Before you know it, they're 50 and have nothing saved.

These people do not have the nicest, $969 new iPhone. They're buying cheap knock-off phones are for a hundred bucks or so at Walmart through StraightTalk or something like that. They're not driving BMWs, they're driving 10-20 year old basic automobiles. They're going through the fast food places because it's often cheaper to eat off the dollar menu than to purchase healthy food in this area, where groceries are extremely expensive and healthy food is often not available at the rural stores. Because of their lifestyle choices and poverty (lack of health insurance to get preventive medical treatment, poor diet, vices, lack of education about good health/nutritional choices, etc.), life expectancies are far shorter than in normal areas, and people are generally in poorer health during their lifetimes.
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Old 12-19-2016, 10:37 PM
 
Location: Log "cabin" west of Bangor
5,677 posts, read 6,779,463 times
Reputation: 10247
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfingduo View Post
The hardest part is many people just do not make enough to make ends meet as it is.
That's not necessarily so. Many people who don't make the ends meet, *could* do it if they made wiser choices as to how they spend their money. There are far too many variables, often dependent on individual choices, to be able to make a blanket statement like that.
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Old 12-20-2016, 04:57 AM
 
Location: Central Massachusetts
4,800 posts, read 4,852,811 times
Reputation: 6379
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zymer View Post
That's not necessarily so. Many people who don't make the ends meet, *could* do it if they made wiser choices as to how they spend their money. There are far too many variables, often dependent on individual choices, to be able to make a blanket statement like that.

I do not disagree at all with you. That is why I didn't quantify it and only used the word many. That is a broad statement. Yes I agree that many of those who struggle could make better choices but we don't legislate that do we? It is important to note here that these people could make better choices.

So it is at least good that we as a society have put at least one safety net in place. I wish we would do better in schools at giving life experience. I also think we do a huge disservice when we tell our children that in order to get ahead in life they need college. We push them through high school and dump them at the college doorstep expecting them to fly. Well it don't work that way.
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Old 12-20-2016, 05:09 AM
 
29,784 posts, read 34,885,423 times
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Ok we have had some good thinking and discussion about why folks aren't using this and other plans to save for retirement. The OP is brief and asked one very important long term question:

Quote:
Doesn't bode well for lower income retirees down the road If the current pattern holds. Then what?
What happens down the road, years from now? How will and should we as a society handle or what responsibilities do we as individuals have if any?

Thoughts?
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Old 12-20-2016, 05:48 AM
 
Location: Colorado Springs
4,849 posts, read 4,964,642 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TuborgP View Post
Ok we have had some good thinking and discussion about why folks aren't using this and other plans to save for retirement. The OP is brief and asked one very important long term question:

What happens down the road, years from now? How will and should we as a society handle or what responsibilities do we as individuals have if any?

Thoughts?
It's interesting to consider how the rest of the world deals with aging parents.

In most cases, they have multi-generation homes. They would never consider throwing granny to the curb. I have several neighbors who are doing this now. Granny makes a great baby sitter.

In my own family, because my father died at 49, my mother ended up with just SS which was not enough for her to comfortably retire.

So we 7 kids bought a small house where she could live rent free and we each pitched in every month to help with her expenses. When she died, handling her estate was simple: If you had given her the item it was yours if you wanted it. Otherwise, it went to Goodwill. Charity begins at home.
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Old 12-20-2016, 07:41 AM
 
14,264 posts, read 24,009,233 times
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^^

I can't think of too many grandparents who really WANT to live with their children largely because they do NOT WANT to become the unpaid babysitter (au pair or nanny).
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Old 12-20-2016, 12:57 PM
 
29,784 posts, read 34,885,423 times
Reputation: 11710
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlawrence01 View Post
^^

I can't think of too many grandparents who really WANT to live with their children largely because they do NOT WANT to become the unpaid babysitter (au pair or nanny).
Interestingly one of my sons lives in a very nice neighborhood with a lot of professionals from India and Pakistan. Many have parents living with them and taking care of the children
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Old 12-20-2016, 01:42 PM
 
Location: Central Massachusetts
4,800 posts, read 4,852,811 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vision67 View Post
It's interesting to consider how the rest of the world deals with aging parents.

In most cases, they have multi-generation homes. They would never consider throwing granny to the curb. I have several neighbors who are doing this now. Granny makes a great baby sitter.

In my own family, because my father died at 49, my mother ended up with just SS which was not enough for her to comfortably retire.

So we 7 kids bought a small house where she could live rent free and we each pitched in every month to help with her expenses. When she died, handling her estate was simple: If you had given her the item it was yours if you wanted it. Otherwise, it went to Goodwill. Charity begins at home.


Well that thought has crossed my mind often as well. I married into a Korean family. My wife having been born in South Korea. In most cultures the elder boy (girl if no boys) generally cares for aging parents. In our case my wife and I take care of her mother even though she has an older brother. In this case it made sense as they did move here and traveled there occasionally.

However though things are changing. Here is an article that explains the changes. Fewer Koreans feel responsible for aging parents I pulled this because I had read this and thought it might give an answer to that question. In most cases Koreans are very family centric.

In many countries especially European nations provide a more secure retirement by means of higher taxes. I am not saying that it is better. It is what it is.
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Old 12-20-2016, 02:42 PM
 
Location: Colorado Springs
4,849 posts, read 4,964,642 times
Reputation: 17343
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfingduo View Post
In many countries especially European nations provide a more secure retirement by means of higher taxes. I am not saying that it is better. It is what it is.
We could just raise fica taxes, now at about 15%, to whatever is required to provide adequate, higher pensions. That way, the old people could all afford to live on their own.

However, I don't think that will fly in our current political environment.
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Old 12-20-2016, 03:45 PM
 
Location: University City, Philadelphia
22,592 posts, read 12,346,799 times
Reputation: 15498
Quote:
Originally Posted by james777 View Post

The rotten politicians sending the jobs overseas created that problem.
I don't blame the politicians for this one ... I blame the greedy corporate bosses who are focused solely on maximizing their profits and shareholder dividends.
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