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Old 02-02-2017, 01:56 PM
 
7,014 posts, read 3,899,663 times
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[quote=foundapeanut;47050537]
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwinbrookNine View Post

Actually the work place is more than 50% women. But there are women that still stay home, like 20%. For many reasons. They won't change it. Life isn't fair, get over it.

How is his payout being affected? He gets exactly the same as everyone else in his pay history.
Which is a direct conflict with "equal pay for equal work."
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Old 02-02-2017, 03:48 PM
 
14,044 posts, read 7,490,249 times
Reputation: 25698
Quote:
Originally Posted by Perryinva View Post
But SS is NOT a pension plan. It is an insurance policy with weird rules that help many that can't help themselves, and favors lower income over higher income.
Social Security is a government pension system that happens to have a disability insurance scheme rolled into it. The retirement part of Social Security is strictly a pension system. Like any government pension system, it is highly progressive and transfers money from the higher lifetime income earners to the lower ones.

Do the math. Compare the Social Security check of someone who logged 35+ years making an inflation-adjusted $118,500 to someone who logged 35 years making an inflation-adjusted $60K. The guy kicking in 2x the money into the system only gets a 15% higher check. The disparity between what you put in versus what you take out is even greater when you compare to someone making $10.00/hour.

Personally, I have no problem with it. I'm affluent. I recognize that lower income people really can't build much wealth and will age to the point where they can't work. At least it's a system where everyone has a stake. If you spent 35 years bagging groceries for minimum wage, you paid your 6.2% into the system. We have other parts of the safety net where people don't have a stake.
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Old 02-02-2017, 07:37 PM
 
Location: AZ
676 posts, read 398,771 times
Reputation: 2794
When I hear the word "privatize" I think scam, thievery, etc. Do I want the SS program in the hands of say Wells Fargo which scammed over 2 million customers by opening fraudulent accounts? Do I want Goldman Sachs or some fly by night hedge fund managing SS? Sorry, fuhgettaboutit. If the GOP wants to lose future elections, just mess with SS and Medicare. The Pentagon can be shut down completely and the money used for SS and MC and it will have more chance of being accepted than monkeying with SS. Yes, of course the nation is broke with a 20 trillion debt but altering SS and MC will never pass in congress. You want to see a march, just try that one. I have no solution mind you, only the feelings among those who expect SS and MC to be there as is. I have seen many "high earners" ***** about SS but who have busted a gut impoverishing ma and pa to get them on Medicaid. Yes, those rules got changed but there are still loopholes and strategies if you have the money to hire a pro to manage it. Who is kidding whom? When it comes to SS and Medicare even conservatives become socialists.
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Old 02-02-2017, 07:58 PM
 
Location: Central IL
15,250 posts, read 8,589,533 times
Reputation: 35712
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bygeorge View Post
When I hear the word "privatize" I think scam, thievery, etc. Do I want the SS program in the hands of say Wells Fargo which scammed over 2 million customers by opening fraudulent accounts? Do I want Goldman Sachs or some fly by night hedge fund managing SS? Sorry, fuhgettaboutit. If the GOP wants to lose future elections, just mess with SS and Medicare. The Pentagon can be shut down completely and the money used for SS and MC and it will have more chance of being accepted than monkeying with SS. Yes, of course the nation is broke with a 20 trillion debt but altering SS and MC will never pass in congress. You want to see a march, just try that one. I have no solution mind you, only the feelings among those who expect SS and MC to be there as is. I have seen many "high earners" ***** about SS but who have busted a gut impoverishing ma and pa to get them on Medicaid. Yes, those rules got changed but there are still loopholes and strategies if you have the money to hire a pro to manage it. Who is kidding whom? When it comes to SS and Medicare even conservatives become socialists.
I am so tired of the assumption that it is the government that wastes money and that privatization by corrupt businesses (remember, the only purpose of a business is to make money - and if profits exceed fines, you're golden) is an improvement. Businesses are not angels waiting to help the government - we can't really be that naive, right?
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Old 02-02-2017, 09:36 PM
 
3,982 posts, read 5,776,292 times
Reputation: 4039
If I continue to make more than the FICA cut off, I'll get $2,500 per month + COLA until I die. If I make it 15 years into retirement, I'll recoup around $525,000. If I and my employer put in a combined average of $10k annually over 40 years, that amounts to a simple return 31.3%. If I live longer, the return grows. If I live shorter, it diminishes. It's essentially just like a pension in that the benefit is defined. Could I do better in the stock market? Possibly. But, I have my tax sheltered 401(k) to play around with that. With the 2 combined, most people will do fine as long as their gambling in the market pays off.
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Old 02-02-2017, 11:49 PM
 
1,662 posts, read 827,812 times
Reputation: 2773
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
ss is designed to be income insurance , not your sole income to live on . all our other insurance we pay in to for a lifetime we get nothing back on unless bad things happen to us .. ss is means tested so those who pay little get proportionately more out . it has never been any different .

there is nothing wrong with what ss pays out , what is wrong is your impression of what ss is supposed to be .

ss functions as income insurance since you are expected to fund your own retirement , it functions as disability and it functions as survivor benefits . what it is not supposed to do is bank roll your retirement .
I beg to differ. The whole process needs to be overhauled. What about those poor souls who worked all their lives, paid into SS, die without any heirs/dependents All that money just suddenly "disappears"?
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Old 02-03-2017, 12:56 AM
 
825 posts, read 568,154 times
Reputation: 2603
Quote:
Originally Posted by Remington Steel View Post
I beg to differ. The whole process needs to be overhauled. What about those poor souls who worked all their lives, paid into SS, die without any heirs/dependents All that money just suddenly "disappears"?
After you're dead, you don't need that insurance anymore. Similarly, you don't get your auto insurance premiums back when you sell the car. When the person is dead or the car is sold, insurance is irrelevant.
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Old 02-03-2017, 03:05 AM
 
Location: R.I.
987 posts, read 611,483 times
Reputation: 4286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Remington Steel View Post
I beg to differ. The whole process needs to be overhauled. What about those poor souls who worked all their lives, paid into SS, die without any heirs/dependents All that money just suddenly "disappears"?
Why would you think this should be any different than any other insurance ? My husband and I pay annual premiums that total $14,000 for insurances on two cars, home owner's, temporary disability insurance for me, health insurance, dental, and vision. We are fully aware that all that money may be going to pay a claim for rebuilding someone's home that burned down, another who got into a bad car accident and sustained multiple injuries, another who had a life threatening illness requiring extensive medical treatment, etc. And if those same tragedies should happen to us we would benefit from the same coverage that our premiums are now providing for another. If you never file a claim for any insurance coverage you carry your survivor's certainly don't get a rebate check for years of premiums paid upon your death so why should that be any different from social security. Do you realize that person who died and never collected or had survivors to claim on their accounts, their lost SS funds is all part of what will be paying yours, mine, and all who live long to collect social security checks ?

I would rather end my life having paid a boat load of insurance premiums and years into social security for which I may not collect or make claim on, than to suffer the tragedies of those who had to make a significant insurance claim to either save or rebuild their lives or put food on the table and the roof over the head of some impoverished senior.
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Old 02-03-2017, 03:45 AM
 
9,238 posts, read 9,310,539 times
Reputation: 28966
Quote:
Originally Posted by Remington Steel View Post
I beg to differ. The whole process needs to be overhauled. What about those poor souls who worked all their lives, paid into SS, die without any heirs/dependents All that money just suddenly "disappears"?
Its not unfair at all. It was the risk they took.

Some people don't seem to get it. Social security isn't a pension plan with a guaranteed return. Its a pool of money that is administered according to the will of Congress. Certain specified categories of recipients of that pool of money are created by statute. When those conditions are satisfied, payments are made out of the fund.

Dead people don't need money. If you pay into social security all your life and than die at age 64 before you could retire, than you didn't need any retirement benefits did you? The idea that some of what you paid in should go to "heirs" is something that was never intended. If we changed the program to provide for such benefits, we'd have to raise taxes or somehow find additional funding to pay for it.

The program is actually predicated on the fact that some people will not live long enough to collect benefits. The money they don't collect goes to pay people who do survive long enough to retire. Social security has done enormous good in our country. It is not--and will never be--all things to all people.

Last edited by markg91359; 02-03-2017 at 03:57 AM..
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Old 02-03-2017, 04:04 AM
 
72,048 posts, read 72,068,214 times
Reputation: 49605
Quote:
Originally Posted by Remington Steel View Post
I beg to differ. The whole process needs to be overhauled. What about those poor souls who worked all their lives, paid into SS, die without any heirs/dependents All that money just suddenly "disappears"?
correct , that is how insurance and annuity's work . the system works by having those who die pay for those who live . the system is not designed around what if i die , it is built around what if i live or my spouse lives .
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