U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Closed Thread Start New Thread
 
Old 03-07-2017, 01:22 PM
 
6,398 posts, read 3,353,438 times
Reputation: 6592

Advertisements

My cardiologist puts most weight on LDL particle size. (I have early strokes and heart attacks on both sides of family).
He doesn't care if the total cholesterol is "high". He looks for the large fluffy LDL particle size which doesn't stick to the arteries as compared to the small evil-sized LDL which does stick to arteries. Thankfully, after changing my diet, my particle size is now the big fluffy LDL and my major arteries are clear via ultra sound testing. My ratios are now great, and no inflammation markers and low triglycerides.

Cardiologist put me on a gluten-free and semi-paleo diet (grass fed, natural meats, or eggs and tons of veggies with very little grains) Worked for me.

Ask your doctor for a particle size lipid test.

 
Old 03-07-2017, 01:42 PM
 
Location: Central Mexico and Central Florida
7,100 posts, read 3,460,546 times
Reputation: 10163
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrkliny View Post
dothetwist, I can understand why some docs might want to retest, but if they do not notice the high HDL, I would look for a new doc. It costs the same to go to the absolutely best trained and knowledgeable docs. I look for docs who have gone to first rate medical schools and then who were accepted for residencies at first rate facilities. I often also go to practice groups. Notice the credentials for all the docs in the group. A first rate group attracts the best physicians who want to join and practice with other top physicians. BTW, depending on overall risk factors you still might want to talk with your doc about a low level of statins to knock down the marginal LDL.
I am lucky to have great healthcare with open access to any specialist without a referral. For the 10 years we lived in AZ, I was also lucky to have 2 RN neighbors who had a lot of opinions on best doctors/worst doctors. I was able to avail myself of BOTH AZ Medical Schools, to see heads of departments (ortho and ophthalmology).

I think the issue is the usually small amount of time doctors have to see patients....they tend to look at the big numbers (which is always the first number on the lab report). Incidentally, the lab reports themselves ***star**** and notate the aggregate number as HIGH.

My new doctor here in FL is the replacement for a doctor I saw a few times (routine stuff) who retired. I was pleasantly surprised that this fresh out of Med School doctor reviewed the numbers (all of them not just the aggregate) BEFORE I arrived for the appt....he even googled some statistics on my exceptionally high HDL number, because he thought it was both unusual and interesting. I think I'll keep him.
 
Old 03-07-2017, 04:13 PM
 
4,312 posts, read 1,283,274 times
Reputation: 3393
I have been exercising every day for most of my life. Of course the doctor didn't ask me about that. I eat mostly natural food and avoid refined and artificial junk.

I have very high LDL, but also very high HDL. I have very low VLDL (14) and low triglycerides (70).

I had blood tests about a year ago, and none of my cholesterol was high.

I don't have the inflammation markers for artery disease.

There is probably some reason my cholesterol raised, but of course this doctor was not going to find that out.

It is obvious when you look at all the numbers, not just the total, that I don't have artery disease. But this doctor was only interested in the total.

Most doctors don't want to think too hard or spend too much time. It's easier to give everyone statins whose total cholesterol is over 200.

Also -- there are reasons cholesterol tends to get higher with age. It helps protect against certain diseases, for example. Older people with low cholesterol are more likely to die sooner.
 
Old 03-07-2017, 04:24 PM
 
2,443 posts, read 2,070,942 times
Reputation: 5690
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
I have been exercising every day for most of my life. Of course the doctor didn't ask me about that. I eat mostly natural food and avoid refined and artificial junk.

I have very high LDL, but also very high HDL. I have very low VLDL (14) and low triglycerides (70).

I had blood tests about a year ago, and none of my cholesterol was high.

I don't have the inflammation markers for artery disease.

There is probably some reason my cholesterol raised, but of course this doctor was not going to find that out.

It is obvious when you look at all the numbers, not just the total, that I don't have artery disease. But this doctor was only interested in the total.

Most doctors don't want to think too hard or spend too much time. It's easier to give everyone statins whose total cholesterol is over 200.

Also -- there are reasons cholesterol tends to get higher with age. It helps protect against certain diseases, for example. Older people with low cholesterol are more likely to die sooner.
Do you have any statistics that back up bolded statement?
 
Old 03-07-2017, 04:33 PM
Status: "Re-edit status" (set 17 days ago)
 
Location: Was Midvalley Oregon; Now Eastside Seattle area
4,169 posts, read 1,895,955 times
Reputation: 3200
A1C 5.6
TG 1500, fasting
BP 145/88 after 1 hr after a new coffee brew.
Got scolded again by doctor
Got another BP after doctor, I told assistant that is pointless, it will be higher. New reading was 180/90. Dr and I have been together too long. Dr (female) almost like my spouse

Waiting for another female Dr. My prostate radiologist. We have together only for 3 months. This relationship is still developing
 
Old 03-07-2017, 04:56 PM
 
Location: SW Florida
9,751 posts, read 7,033,290 times
Reputation: 14260
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
I had a checkup and blood tests and got the results today. The doctor said my cholesterol is extremely high, 318. I said well there is nothing I can do about it because I won't take drugs, especially not statins. Anyway my blood pressure is normal.

She said it doesn't matter if blood pressure is normal, the carotid arteries could still be blocked, and that can cause a stroke.

So was I scared into getting a prescription?

No, I told her total cholesterol doesn't matter, you have to look at the ratio of HDL and LDL. Yes, I was telling an M.D how to do her job!

I told her the research on cholesterol-lowering drugs is not conclusive, and I said she should read it.

It was obvious she was getting very angry (can't really blame her), but trying to stay calm.

As soon as I got home I looked up the normal ranges for HDL and LDL. Yes my total cholesterol is high, but my HDL / LDL range is very low (1.6). So according to everything I read, I have extremely low risk of a heart attack or stroke.

And my triglycerides and VLDL are very low.

Yes I have high total cholesterol, but that means nothing, especially when you get older. In some research, high cholesterol was shown to predict better health in older people!

I have a healthy lifestyle and I exercise every day. The doctor I saw today, on the other hand, is fat.

I am posting this to see if any of you had similar experiences, and if you managed to resist getting put on harmful drugs. They really try to scare you.
I take a low dose of Simvastatin ( 20 mg/day), have for years and am lucky not to have had any side effects from it. And I'm not about to take any more of it. But what I also take, which has worked wonders on keeping my lipid( cholesterol, HDL, LDL) well within the ranges that make the docs happy, is a daily krill oil caplet- ( a 350 mg tab for me) in addition to the simvastatin. I take this instead of fish oil capsules. My husband also has a thing going against statins, and although he's been prescribed those, takes very little of what he's prescribed. So over the years his cholesterol/lipid numbers climbed, and his doc did his his lecture about those numbers to deaf ears, LOL, because DH wasn't going to take them, at least not the prescribed amount. So I suggested to him that he take krill oil caps too, and he started doing so. His lipid numbers improved significantly, and have stayed that way even though he's cut back even more on the statins.

So perhaps taking those krill oil capsules might help your total cholesterol, and keep your other lipids where they should be. Krill oil capsules can be pricey, ( more so than fish oil caps), but I usually buy them I find a BOGO offer, although they can also be purchased online from reputable herbal companies ( Puritan Pride comes to mind.)

All that said, though, IMO you're probably right when you say your doc is probably overreacting to your high cholesterol level- back in the day it was fine to have a total cholesterol level of 230 mg/dl, although they liked it better the closer back to 200 mg/dl it was. It gets me too to think that the medical establishment and Big Pharma work together to decide that lower is better, the better to get more people on medication- they've done the same thing with glucose and hemoglobin A1C, seems to me.
 
Old 03-07-2017, 05:33 PM
 
4,312 posts, read 1,283,274 times
Reputation: 3393
"the medical establishment and Big Pharma work together to decide that lower is better, the better to get more people on medication"

Yes, I think so. Most of the research is funded by the drug companies. It's easy to confuse people with statistics and make a drug look good even if it isn't.

Most MDs have no training or experience in interpreting scientific research. Since I have a PhD in experimental psychology, I probably know more about interpreting research than most MDs.

The whole idea that high cholesterol causes heart disease was based on unscientific thinking. It was observed that people who died from heart attacks often had a lot of cholesterol in their arteries. They assumed cholesterol caused the heart disease, but in fact the cholesterol in arteries is more likely a result of heart disease.

These ideas are slowly being recognized, but the average MD still doesn't get it. They are not qualified to understand the research, so they just follow guidelines.
 
Old 03-07-2017, 05:41 PM
 
4,312 posts, read 1,283,274 times
Reputation: 3393
I did some more reading about cholesterol levels.

My total cholesterol (318) is extremely high, but that's mostly because my HDL (115) is extremely high.

Since most people do not have extremely high HDL, doctors probably don't know what it means or what if anything it predicts.

I also found out there are two kinds of LDL, A and B, but the test does not differentiate. One is supposedly good, the other bad. If you have low triglycerides, then chances are you have more of the good kind of LDL.

So when a doctor looks at the total number and tries to scare you into taking statins, they are being unscientific and unreasonable.

This doctor was not at all happy with me when I started asking questions, instead of being an obedient little patient. She kept saying "IT'S YOUR CHOICE! IT'S YOUR CHOICE!"

I interpreted that to mean "If you want to kill yourself by ignoring my advice and not taking statins, then I can't stop you."

She didn't have time for discussing subtleties like the different kinds of cholesterol.
 
Old 03-07-2017, 05:45 PM
 
2,443 posts, read 2,070,942 times
Reputation: 5690
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
"the medical establishment and Big Pharma work together to decide that lower is better, the better to get more people on medication"

Yes, I think so. Most of the research is funded by the drug companies. It's easy to confuse people with statistics and make a drug look good even if it isn't.

Most MDs have no training or experience in interpreting scientific research. Since I have a PhD in experimental psychology, I probably know more about interpreting research than most MDs.

The whole idea that high cholesterol causes heart disease was based on unscientific thinking. It was observed that people who died from heart attacks often had a lot of cholesterol in their arteries. They assumed cholesterol caused the heart disease, but in fact the cholesterol in arteries is more likely a result of heart disease.

These ideas are slowly being recognized, but the average MD still doesn't get it. They are not qualified to understand the research, so they just follow guidelines.
What is experimental psychology? I have visions of Jack Nicholson in One flew over the cuckoos nest
 
Old 03-07-2017, 06:14 PM
 
4,312 posts, read 1,283,274 times
Reputation: 3393
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasperhobbs View Post
What is experimental psychology? I have visions of Jack Nicholson in One flew over the cuckoos nest
It's hard to believe experimental psychology is not even heard of. Psychology was an academic subject long before psychologists started doing therapy.

Psychotherapy was always done by psychiatrists, although Freud was actually a neurologist.

In the 1970s, it became legal for psychologists to be clinical therapists, if they had a license.

But academic experimental psychology still exists. It's like sociology, or economics, or any other social science.

Experimental psychology has nothing to do with therapy. I realize most people don't get this, because so many psychologists have become clinical therapists.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top